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09-09-2011, 02:49 PM
  #141
seventieslord
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Join Date: Mar 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Funny, because I remember not too long ago, you thought that seventieslord had "proved" that Ramsay was better defensively than Gainey, despite Gainey's vastly superior Selke record...

So something must have changed since then, right?
Christ, I just love how whenever someone pops what they believe to be a "gotcha" question, "the usual suspects" are right there to dogpile on me before I've even had a chance to address it. Bravo.

Anyway, I'm not interested in this right now but here's my answer: This is not even close to the same thing. The selke existed for 57% of Ramsay's career and 75% of Gainey's. Gainey was not named on over 4X as many ballots in his career (as Erixon was compared to Tippett) - by my estimation, he was named on approximately 10% more ballots, with more years to do so. It's actually easily arguable that Gainey's wins notwithstanding, Ramsay's voting record is the more impressive one, and I've argued that before. If that argument isn't bought, the massive difference in market recognition between MTL and BUF can explain the rest away. (don't try to say NY/HFD is anything similar please!) in addition, the available defensive stats we have support Ramsay, especially when teammates/linemates are considered.

I really don't want to mention Gainey or Ramsay again in this thread. Just know that comparing them based on selke ballots is nothing like comparing Erixon and Tippett the same way.

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