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09-09-2012, 10:22 PM
  #107
Canadiens1958
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Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Haynes and Ward bring all the intangibles needed for the line. Vanek plays the slot and scores the goal.



In vancouver, he started with the match-ups, but he quickly lost that job to more capable players as he proved he couldn't do it. In boston, he immediately lost the job when the best option returned.

Even if your claims are true, which the statistical evidence doesn't fully suppoer, what does it actially prove? It proves that he was the best option, but once again we come back to context. Who were the other options on your team? How did you compare to the rest of the league?



I realize it might not be the most conventional place to put stuff like that, but I'd start by first looking in the profiles we linked to each player.



Odie Cleghorn is a borderline 1st liner in the main draft, so it's hard to believe I need to defend that comparison.

His season in the PCHA was similar to Sibby Nichols, but Smith was able to play at that level for more than twice as long.

As for Bobby Rowe, I'm sure the one season he played with Smith had a huge impact on his career. With Lalonde, Smith did finish behind him in 1913, but then led the Habs in scoring the next season. He led his team in scoring half-a-dozen times over his career, so he definately was the key player that I am portraying him to be. Don't take my word though - there are some contemporary reports in his biography.



You can call it whatever you want, but a one-season wonder is what he is.



This has nothing to do with young and old. It has to do with Jonathan Quick having a 4 year career that contains 3 years of filler and only 1 year of something relevant to an all-time draft.

He's not young... he's just not very good in an all-time context.



Again, Karlsson isn't a "rookie" in this draft. He's just a guy who had a 3 year career that contains 1 great season, 1 ok season, and 1 bad season.



There are no "young players" in this draft - just players who haven't accomplished very much yet.
Start with Don Smith. Factually wrong. 1913-14 Newsy Lalonde was the leading goal scorer despite playing 6 fewer games than Smith. Lalonde was injured in February.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1913%E2%80%9314_NHA_season

Outscored Smith handily regardless. Pitre was in Vancouver for a year and Gardiner was also hurt in February. Healthy team in 1914-15, Pitre returned from Vancouver, Smith was moved to the Wanderers since there were better options.

Barry Pederson was moved back to the offensive role when Kasper returned since Kasper did not have the offensive skills.Post 1986-87 with the Canucks, after Patrick Sundstrom was moved to the Devils. Pederson was the only defensive center alternative.Check the rosters for the Canucks during his stay.

Jonathan Quick took a 15th place team to a SC championship. Other retired MLD goalies never managed such a feat and most needed the stars to align properly for them to win a SC championship.

Paddy Moran had to beat two weak challenges Sydney and Halifax,but no PCHA team. McNeil and Karakas had to be relieved in the playoffs due to injury or poor performance.Johnston was a back-up.

The best comparable to Jonathan Quick is Normie Smith - 2 SCs in only three full NHL seasons plus two half seasons and a few games.
Yet Normie Smith is an ATD regular goalie - 2012 drafted #661 by Chaosrevolver. Again ageism is the only explanation for your persistent denials of Quicks accomplishments.

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