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11-22-2012, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
McEachern's scoring without Yashin (before and after) is significantly worse than with Yashin - save for one year in Atlanta where he played opposite Kovalchuk.

Michalek's numbers with Spezza last year are comparable to his last three seasons in San Jose. It's worth noting that although Michalek did play some with Thornton, he spent more time with Pavelski as his center.

McEachern had the ability to be good for a stretch, but that was it. He was a 2/3 tweener. And I'm not sure where you're getting the size thing on him... are we talking about the same player?
72, 61, 60, 60, 55, 53, 49, 48, 47, 46, 45, 39

McEachern's 82 game point paces in his 12 full seasons in the league. In bold are the 4 seasons that he spent with Yashin. They trend high (because Yashin was a good player), but they weren't much higher than the rest of his career and he was never considered a 3rd liner.

Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
Hossa is certainly relevant; he led the team in scoring both years he was there with Spezza.
No, he isn't.
02-03, Spezza played 33 games as an AHL call up.
03-04, Spezza scored 55 points as rookie mostly on the 3rd line with Havlat.

In 98-99, Hossa scored 30 points as a rookie in Yashin's career season.
In 00-01, Hossa was 2nd on the team to Yashin in points with 75... while playing with Bonk that season.

00-01 is the only remotely interesting season in terms of production between any of these players; except that none of them played together and this season goes against your argument. I have no idea where you were going with this whatsoever,

Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
Teenage Yashin stepped on to an expansion team in its second year, a team that set a record for futility. He went out and excelled, and led the team. Yashin eventually clashed too much with the Senators over his contract, spurred on initially by their hesitance to sign him to a multi-year deal, while signing Daigle immediately to a then-gigantic contract ($12.25m over 5 years) that made him among the highest paid in the league and caused the league to institute a rookie salary cap.
Teenaged Yashin also got ice time that he didn't deserve handed to him because the team was so bad when he first started. He never had to fight for ice time or work his way up through the depth chart. Because of that, he also never improved his game and (like Daigle) suffered greatly for it when he started playing for better/other teams.

Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
Regardless, Yashin IMHO was better than Spezza.
Yeah; a terrible defensive player, awful face-off man, brutal in the postseason... who offset all of that with a whopping 2 PPG seasons out of his 12 year career?

Face-off % (2001-present)
Spezza = 52.1
Yashin = 46.1

Playoffs (Career)
Spezza = 53-17-34-51, 0.96
Yashin = 48-11-16-27, 0.56

Regular Season (Career)
Spezza = 606-226-390-616, 1.02
Yashin = 850-337-444-781, 0.92

Peak Seasons
Yashin = a mere two PPG seasons
Spezza = four times in the top-6 in PPG (4th, 5th, 5th, 6th)

No debate here, Spezza is much better than Yashin ever was defensively.

So uh, what was it that you were saying? ... Because I thought that it might have been something ridiculous.

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