View Single Post
12-16-2012, 05:13 PM
Registered User
buddahsmoka1's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: México, D.F.
Country: Mexico
Posts: 25,050
vCash: 500
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
The web development work for McGill as actually being done by McGill alumni at competitive market rates, and that company has employed McGill students:
It's not a job that two undergrads can do with their spare time on their weekends.

I've known of students do system administrative roles for various departments, and I've known of students run some of the newspapers. Basically, if students are qualified, they can get administrative positions with McGill.
Good, it should be more widespread. Instead you have MUNACA workers striking for 70% pay raises, while you have students crossing picket lines to do their job for them.

I've already specifically given you the example of an electrical engineering phd student who was denied a laptop by his supervisor, but please, ignore it.
This has really no relevance to the question of why a university should buy a computer for every student.

ETA: I've neglected to mention that many low income students don't have computers of their own.
I have never seen a student without a lap top. And if they don't have one, they can park their ass in the library and use those. Otherwise they can GTFO, because there is no point of going to university if you don't have a laptop or access to a computer.

You don't want to be cheap on something that increases productivity. If it increases productivity, then pay for it.
You can't increase productivity by supplying something students already have.

The reason I bought this setup is that it gives the comfort of a desktop computer in the office, but it can be disconnected and used as a laptop during travel sequences. If I'm spending a month or two a year travelling, then I need a good, nimble laptop.
And I just bought a lap top with probably better specs for under a grand. Laptops are dirt cheap these days if you know how to shop for them. LCD/HD monitors run for a single bill.

I just showed you a link that the McGill physics department offers a tuition waiver.

For some other departments that apparently don't waive tuition, $4,000 is a massive problem on a graduate student salary. They should offer salaries that are $4,000 higher to compensate. But they won't, so they will end up with lower quality individuals. Nobody wants to spend five years of their lives on peanut butter and kraft dinner, so this is where they'll go if they have no other options.
I meant to say widespread, sorry. Approx. $20K is a fine salary for student in Montreal. It hardly amounts to "peanut butter and kraft dinner." I live very comfortably on a $22K income.

When I was applying for graduate school in 2007, I specifically didn't apply to UToronto and UBC because I knew that $18,000 and $20,000 (salaries at the time) would not cut it in those cities even with the tuition waivers they were offering.
And Toronto and UBC have 15-20% higher costs of living than Montreal. Opps, there goes your 'extremely high cost of living' argument.

I am comparing public and private schools to McGill.
Ohio State and UC Irvine are public schools.
The guy who went to John Hopkins had the exact same offer from University of Washington.
How many examples from public schools do you want? 20? 30?
You provided two public school examples, from American schools no less. Is it really that surprising that American schools can provide higher salaries? McGill's graduate student salaries are more or less in line with Canadian universities, with the lowest tuition costs and costs of living. If you do the math, McGill is providing the best purchasing power to their graduate students in the country.

I gave you some specific examples. Let's try again:

- Tuition is actually more expensive for academics in Quebec, because it's apparently not universally waived here.

Is that complicated? Can you get the point? If the sticker price is $50,000 in Massachussetts, and $4000 in Montreal, then your bank study will conclude it's cheaper in Montreal, even though no academic pays the $50,000.
It is not universally waived anywhere. Not all American schools waive tuition, nor does everyone that gets enrolled as a graduate school receive full waivers.

The same is true of rent. Your study would conclude that rent is cheaper in Montreal than in New York, but that is actually specifically not true if you're employed by Columbia.
False. You said your friend got an apartment for $700, and I guarantee that this is a special occasion. Even then, rent prices in Montreal average much less than that.

Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
I was paying $1200/month for a four bedroom with three floors a couple years ago, at a 15 minute walk from campus.

A friend of mine bought at a house, in a nice neighbourhood, three floors, four bedrooms, backyard, 30 minute walk to university, for under $200,000. In Montreal that would be $500,000 or more.
Where? In Ohio? No ****...

Everybody I know in Montreal is struggling with the high cost of living and high taxes.
Spare me.

"Unless you're looking for a family doctor" lol. Are you serious?

As for your "experiences", you're a man in your 20s, your experiences are limited because your health has probably been good. My father passed away from cancer a year ago after a long struggle with crappy treatment. I know what I know about health care in Montreal.
I am sorry about your father, but we are talking about graduate students are we not? How is my health 'because I am in my 20s' not relevant to a discussion about graduate students, but your middle-aged father's health is? Doesn't make sense.

The article mentioned clothing:
One of Greater Montréal’s assets is unquestionably its affordable cost of living. Whether for accommodation, food, clothing, medical care or raising a family, costs in Montréal are far less than in other major cities.
Having seen many places, clothing in Montreal is indeed cheaper than say Europe or Australia... but it's even cheaper in the USA.
Yeah, key word, mentioned. As in you know, it's only part of a wider assortment of consumption goods in the index.


All of this to say, the Quebec government can legitimately choose to not have world-class universities, and to be a second-world or even become a third-world backwater within North America. If they don't make the necessary investments, in either higher tuition or higher gover nment support, then that's what will happen. If you want to hire high quality staff, you'll have to pay for it.

Conversely, if you tell staff you're too cheap to cover business expenses, and that you can't afford to pay graduate students a living wage, you'll pay the costs in other ways as your society declines.
Yeah, I'll wait to see when Montreal becomes a second or third world backwater within North America, much less their universities.

Here, I'll give you a little homework. Go on the QS rankings, and check out the funds all the top 20 universities receive. McGill has been one of the lowest earning universities on that list for over a decade, it hasn't changed anything.

buddahsmoka1 is offline