Thread: Value of: Scott Harrington
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01-08-2013, 01:51 AM
Tender Rip
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
TR, unless you classify Niskanen as a hitter, that's clearly not the point I was making. The numbers simply don't support your argument for Hamhuis on that front, even if he lays a nice hipcheck now and then.
You know I love you, but your point here simply wasn't a good one. It is not in the number of hits. Pronger hits very little but he is obviously very physical. Niskanen hits quite a bit and is physical, but doesn't have the size to be a real factor in that regard. Hamhuis hits more than Harrington has ever given indication of doing, and he can really make his presence felt. He did it more at Nashville whereas now with Bieksa he doesn't have to.
The thing is that Harrington is just not a physical player. He will rub players out just like Despres, but unlike Despres he hardly ever goes out of character and just obliterate someone. That's part of his appeal and 'never get yourself out of position' thing, but when you compare to players who obviously play a more physical game, most of us will think that being consistently physical is a plus.

Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Production is not a tool though. I don't agree that the defensemen I named possess standout tools - at least defensively - that Harrington doesn't (though Girardi is obviously a more prolific hitter).
Dan Hamhuis can QB a power play (more than good enough for 2nd unit duty at least) and you just cannot tell me that you see that in Harrington. Here junior stats will tell you something, because you are comparing Harrington - who is far from prolific on a stacked team - with guys who racked up close to PPG numbers in juniors. It isn't reasonable not considering these qualities that set them apart in terms of value. Girardi isn't a great passer, but at least he has a big shot which gives him an offensive dimension as well.

Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
1. Michalek, our #1 PK defenseman, has been traded.

2. We were 2nd worst on the PK in the playoffs in 2011, and the very worst in 2012. However good we were in the regular season, if they can't get the job done in the playoffs, it needs to be addressed. I am not confident in the likes of Martin and Orpik on the PK when it matters.
...or Fleury. But ultimately a team that can be top3 leaguewide on the PK for the full season is not having a lack of quality penalty killers. I am one of those who do not respect Bylsma's coaching at all and consider him incapable of adjustments. That is the real problem here, IMO. You cannot have Giroux and Voracek have ample time out of corners and whizzing the puck through the crease for backpost tap-ins repeatedly, rinse repeat, and do nothing about it for 6 games running.

Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
Man, these defense spots have not been grabbed by youngsters yet - that's what I'm getting at. Once they have, you can argue that there's too much youth. Until they have, we're not a young blueline, so the concerns are unfounded.
I am simply saying that none of the prospects (whoever gets traded) will be missed because they have never made it on to the team, and for any of them to get there, they have an insane amount of competition. If you completely forgot about the fact that we have Harrington on the books, we still have a long list of players to choose from and some who are highly touted will never make it on.
In such a scenario, it simply doesn't matter if we trade one or two of them, even if that guy is going to be a good player. Something I never disputed Harrington should/would be.
Less so as we are a team that must win again between now and the end of Sid/Malkin's prime, which is something like the next 5 years.

Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
They're not. We happen to have a couple overpaid, underperforming veterans on the blueline whose experience and track record could still yield a solid return. I'd cut bait with either of them before trading Harrington.
And again, Harrington does nothing for us now or in two-three years that we cannot easily get better with an experienced NHL player. Those overpaid, underperforming veterans will be crucial if we are to win anything this season, and we sure aren't if we deal them to play our rookies.
Whether Martin and Orpik have value.... well, their value on the ice will likely be higher for us than their trade value unless we do not acquire genuine top4D replacements for them. Which would only be more of a long term logjam for the kids of course.

Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
If it would take a "serious return" for Despres or Morrow, I'm assuming it would take something less than that for you to deal Harrington. What player(s) would make it worthwhile for you?
Again, Despres and Morrow have skillsets that are harder to acquire and they both offer skills that will make them useful on the team sooner than Harrington (IMO). Despres can be on the team this season (and probably should) going by the way he looked last season. Play him now and he can likely take over Martin's position sooner rather than later. Morrow might need a year or two more, but then he certainly brings elements that we do not have now and elements that are always in high demand.
Harrington is a player who might be better than Strait and Bortuzzo one day, sure, but not anytime soon and when he is used to playing against men after some AHL seasoning, some of the youngsters we have on the team will have had several years of NHL experience and will be preferred for that very reason.

As for what I'd want for Harrington.... can't say. By himself he probably won't yield any return that makes trading him meaningful. But in a package with another player and pick or something... that brings us one of the forwards we need..... lots of guys on that list.
I wouldn't care if Harrington was used to get us a rental upgrade for a playoff run... I want to win now.

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