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02-08-2013, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
The gap from 2002 to 2008 is not comprable to 1988 to 1990.

The 2008 Red wings had only five holdovers from 2002. Only Lidstrom was the holdover with a significant impact on the 2002 Cup. The 1990 Oilers returned 13 from the 1988 team.

Same with the 1986 Habs to the 1993 Habs. No need to go into detail on that one. The rosters were totally different minus Roy.

The fact remains that Messier had two Conn Smythe-worthy postseasons post-Gretzky. It took a record-setting postseason by Leetch to deny him one.

Ranford winning the Conn Smythe in 1990 is one of the biggest shams in postseason history. He won it purely for his performance in the SCF, a series in which his offense produced 20 goals in five games. Prior to the SCF, Ranford was maddingly inconsistent.

This idea that Messier's career "ended" in 1988 is just a joke, whether you or anybody feels he deserved those Harts or not.
Who said Messier's career ended in 1988? I said his best season, so much so that it's a massive outlier, was 1990. That's after 1988.

Also, Chris Osgood produced two Conn Smythe-worthy runs after the 2005 lockout. His 1998 run would have been Smythe worthy on a lot of teams, but the fact that it was compared to Vernon's from the previous year ruined any chance he had.

Chris Pronger often gets cited on this board with "He had three Smythe-worthy playoff runs" but where's the Smythe?

I'm not going to disagree, sometimes I think it goes to the wrong guy. Maybe 1990 was one of those years. At the same time, Cam Neely has a pretty strong argument on the other side in 1990. He had 28 points in 21 games with a massive physical presence, just like Messier (who had 31 in 22 - only a shade higher in PPG) and although I haven't been able to find an actual scoring log, from a youtube highlight video I found it looks like Messier may have entered the second half of the 2nd period with as few as 29 points, and it doesn't appear that Neely was involved in the single Bruins goal. Ranford also had a wonderful game (and it is reflected in the highlights) So voters may have been split between Messier vs. Neely (and also possibly Craig Simpson) while Ranford won over plenty. I would argue 1997 as a similar case; voters were likely split between Yzerman/Fedorov, possibly even Lidstrom, Konstantinov, Shanahan, and Lindros receiving significant votes. Which left the Vernon group as the winners.

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