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03-03-2013, 05:22 PM
Captain Mittens*
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The Meow-ntain
Posts: 33,429
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Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
Yes it's been pointed out multiple times..... incorrectly:

Boston had the 2nd highest payroll in MLB that year. They spent $44 million more (1.5x as much) as the team they played in the World Series.

I don't doubt at all that the Red Sox used advanced statistics as a strategy that year, but when you spend 20m on Manny, 17m on Pedro, (both of whom were there before Bill James or Theo) 12m on Schilling, 8m on Damon (also there before James and Theo) and so on, it's not really a "moneyball team".

Especially since so many of the key players on that team were assembled BEFORE the "moneyball" front office came aboard AND since one of the most interesting things about that team was that the year before they tried to go with the advanced stats concept (touted by Bill James, and which I agree with) of not really using a "Closer" (as the role has become) and how that strategy failed miserably, and that for the 2004 team they threw away that strategy (despite it being part of the supposed advanced stats philosophy.

Also, it's important to note that several of the 2004 team were acquired because they were too expensive for their former teams: Manny, Damon, Pedro, etc.

So the question is, did this team win the title because they used advanced stats to assemble a collection of players that the "eye" wouldn't have? Or were they a group, largely collected by the previous regime, who were big stars that ANY criteria would have said were good players?
Look at Ortiz, Millar, and the other players that Theo acquired.....

Here is a link to Theo's free agent signings

The Red Sox won their first world series on 10/27/04. Before they won, the most Epstein spent on a free agent was 3 Mil a year

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