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03-16-2013, 03:51 PM
  #1027
JackSlater
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
I'd say Getzlaf is slightly above average in the NHL while Stamkos is slightly below average. So I don't think it's really close. There's a reason why the Ducks have been so dominant this season. Getzlaf has been their best player.
That is your opinion then, I'm certainly not trying to say that Stamkos is a good defensive centre. So is Getzlaf the reason that they have also disappointed in recent years? There is more to it than that clearly, but there is no question that he has been playing very strong hockey thus far.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Even last year in Getzlaf's awful season, he wasn't THAT bad defensively.
I don't think anyone has said Getzlaf is bad defensively.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
You're underrating Getzlaf's skating, and overrating its impact on big ice. Getzlaf is a good puck possession, he won't need to chase it around the ice.
Puck possession players tend to disappoint on international ice relative to their NHL performance. There are always many points when any player will chase the puck.



Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
The short length of the Olympics means performance over 82 games isn't that important.

For example, I would pick Giroux for the Olympics. If it was 82 game tournament instead of the current format, there is no way in heck I would pick Giroux. Giroux is just awful defensively over the course of an NHL season. His effort is bad and at times pathetic.

Now, he is capable of playing well defensively. In a short tournament, I have no doubt Giroux will do whatever is necessary to win, including being responsible defensively. And obviously he is one of the most talented offensive players available.


Now, maybe Getzlaf was awful in his last 82 game season. Does that mean a more consistent but less talented player will be more effective in a short Olympic tournament? No.
I think you are missing the point of talking about 82 games. The small sample size makes me question what level Getzlaf is really at. If someone like Kunitz finished a year at this level of production, he would actually merit consideration for the time. It's highly unlikely that he would be able to do that over a long season though, as the sample size irons out hot and cold streaks for the most part. I want to know if Getzlaf is simply on an extended hot streak, or if he has basically returned to his peak.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
My mentality is goal differential. Say Line A scores averages 5 GF per game, but 2 GA per game. Say Line B averages 2.5 GF per game and 0.5 GA per game.

Clearly Line B is better defensively, but Line A is a better all around line.

I pick the best all around players, and Getzlaf fits the bill.
Everyone is considering goal differential, it's all that matters. Picking the best all around players isn't always the optimal strategy. If we need a checking line winger, Sharp is a better pick than Getzlaf even though Getzlaf is better, for example.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
I would take Getzlaf over St. Louis defensively.
St. Louis is a better defensive player, and the gap should grow with more ice to cover.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
What you're saying here is a non issue. Crosby and Toews are the locks to play centre. Bergeron should as well. There isn't a single other player who can ''only'' play centre. Staal, Stamkos, Benn, Tavares, Grioux, etc can all play the wing. Therefore, there is a centre spot available.
Just because they can play wing doesn't mean they should. Stamkos is clearly better than Getzlaf, which makes me wonder why he has to move over to the wing to accommodate Getzlaf. It would make sense if Canada had a shortage of centres and needed to take advantage of what was available, but that is not even remotely the case.

You have also been referencing Stamkos playing like a winger and just assuming that it will work. I would rather Canada not just make assumptions with the second best player on the team. If Stamkos loses a large part of his effectiveness due to moving to the wing, Canada loses a massive component of the team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
Crosby and Bergeron together would be wasting one of the two's faceoff ability. And wasting Crosby's offense. Would rather have Kunitz there honestly. Bergeron at RW makes no sense to me whatsoever. He's the perfect 4C.
I disagree that such a line would waste Crosby's offence. Crosby's best international tournament, by a mile, was the 2006 WC with Bergeron on his wing. We saw Crosby fail to click with highly skilled wingers in 2010 (and fail with an injured Bergeron), and at this point it seems like he works best with straightforward, responsible players.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandyAlwaysKnows View Post
And I've explained my reasoning for not wanting Stamkos at centre. Also, if Stamkos is centre, then St. Louis will be on the team and I'm not sure I want him there at this point. St. Louis and Stamkos are very good offensively together - but defensively, not so much. They're horrible defensively and that's part of the reason why Tampa is so low in the standings. They score a lot, but give up as many goals as they score.

imo MSL was not there in 2010 because of his declining defensive play. He will also be 39 at the next Olympics... I'll pass on him.
St. Louis wasn't there in 2010 because Canada wanted to be big and gritty on NA ice. It had nothing to do with defensive ability, or even overall ability as St. Louis had a tremendous year. If they tailor their selections for the ice surface again, Getzlaf is in trouble.

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