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03-16-2013, 08:55 PM
  #360
pdd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ushvinder View Post
Couldn't agree more. Players like gilmour, datsyuk, brind'amour and peak modano are pretty much on fedorov's level defensively. (mod)
This statement is absolutely not true. Datsyuk is the only one with an argument, and IMHO he wasn't the best defensive forward on his team when he won his Selkes.

Quote:
Fedorov finished top 15 in scoring a grand total of 4 times, the offensive gap between the two is very large. Offense from a forward is significantly more important, and selanne has him beat clear cut in terms of durability. Teemu has surpassed Sergei and in 10 years he will be ranked higher when its all said and done. Red Wings fans want to make all the excuses they want for fedorov, I can easily bring up the issue of selanne's knees. If he had surgery done earlier, he would dust fedorov away offensively and really thats the main job of a forward, to go out and score.
That keeps being repeated. "Offense is the most important thing." No, what's most important is "more goals". Whether that occurs by scoring 4 and giving up 3, or scoring 3 and giving up 1, the point is to win. And Fedorov was better at creating a positive goal differential - in other words, creating offense for his own team combined with impeding the opponent's offense - than Selanne was/is.

Which is really the question being asked. Because "Who is the better player" ultimately comes down to "Who is (individually) more likely to cause his team to win?"

Quote:
Selanne has 3 seasons where he was in the conversation for best forward, fedorov has like 1.

Thier hart voting, a criteria devilmademe loves to use.
Selanne: 3, 5, 5, 6, 9
Fedorov: 1,5, 9.
Selanne received fringe mentions in 1993. A couple of his best seasons in the later 90s coincided with Jaromir Jagr and Pavel Bure missing significant time.

Fedorov, on the other hand, won the Hart over Gretzky. He was in the conversation in 1996 (and should have been on the postseason all-star team ahead of Messier; that was a travesty in voting).

Fedorov played on a team with other highly skilled players such as Yzerman, Shanahan, Konstantinov, and Osgood who received Hart votes in 1996, as well as Coffey (1995), Lidstrom (1998, 2001, 2003), and Cheveldae (1992). After that, he had 5 games with Selanne and Niedermayer (2006), and then Ovechkin (2008, 2009) and Green (2009).

Selanne had Hart-vote teammates in Tkachuk (1996), Kariya (1996, 1997, 1999), Hebert (1997), Nabokov (2001), Sakic (2004), S.Niedermayer (2006, 2007, 2008), Pronger (2007), Getzlaf (2009, 2011), Perry (2011), Visnovsky (2011)

But Fedorov played on the *deeper* and more successful teams, and he didn't put up as many points as often. So he clearly wasn't as worthy a Hart candidate as Selanne was, based on any criteria.

Quote:
Originally Posted by begbeee View Post
When he was put in Selanne's position he did what? Yes, he led Ducks in points with stellar 65 points year to nonplayoff year.

Fedorov is more in category what he could be than what he actually was. And this fact is overrun with defense argument from his fanboys.
Fedorov was playing alongside a prime Paul Kariya, who was scoring 4 points every 3 games? I must have missed those Ducks games... in fact, I thought Kariya was with the Avs along with Selanne at the time. And that Fedorov's most offensively talented teammate was a 54-point Vinny Prospal, followed by 52-point Petr Sykora. He had two guys who were mediocre offensive players with little to no defensive game. Steve Rucchin (Selanne's former center) was the second-best forward on the team, but centered the second line.

I just wonder how things would have worked out had they kept Fedorov instead of trading him in 2005. Fedorov, Selanne, and Niedermayer would have been a pretty killer combo.

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