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03-22-2013, 02:31 AM
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: United States
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Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post

We have gone over it and over it and I haven't seen a good refutation of the research where I demonstrated that similar players to Patty and JT usually hit the wall around age 37. About the same. And, we are watching JT's possession skills taking a big hit right now and it is related to moving his feet. It is possible that there is an injury, but should this continue he is definitely in decline. If players do not continually work out off ice as they age, they will decline more rapidly. The other issue with decline in elite players is that it doesn't show in point totals initially. It will show in other areas. The coach will get softer and softer minutes for those elite players, shifting the weight of non-scoring play to lesser players in the lineup. The progression is ugly trying to save face for that elite player and crippling the team. A pure points argument on decline is a straw man. It is around age 37 that their points actually take a noticeable hit. They can't do it even with softer matchups.
Well if they are going to hi the wall soon then Sj should probalby seek a trading partner for marleau in the summer or during next season unless he wants to take a hefty HTD..around 4-4.5. Joe's skill set is much more elite and should be retained.

As for JT's possession skills, they might be somewhat lower but without looking up stats i bet he has more takeaways than marleau. Also, marleau compared to JT to their respective work along the boards, and abilities to retain the puck and find guys for solid scoring chances... Joe wins hands down everyday and 2x on Sunday.

The other issue with decline in elite players is that it doesn't show in point totals initially.

Ask yourself this, why does Toddr feel the need to continually play marleau with JT when PM should be more than capable to shoulder his own line...with a 1-2 punch SJ could be???? B/c Cooter/Pavs/Havlat cant do the work down low, retain the puck and find Patty..Patty would have to do the board work and he is nowhere near as good as JT.

patty is a sniper, opportunist that, unless has open ice or breakaway, needs others guys like JT to feed him, guys like Jt who have the ability to retain the puck with guys draped all over him, and yet still be able to find marleau..there is no way that relationship gets reversed with 1/4 of the success as PM doesn't have those skills and IMO, his skills, especially his puck skills, are sub par for his pay grade.

and i wont even go into his massive streaks and tendencies to competitively disappear or withdraw...

if it were down to JT and PM...PM skills are replaceable..JT's are not..

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