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03-26-2013, 10:38 AM
  #918
papershoes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post
Comparing apples to oranges here.

Definitely not fair talking about Carbonneau, who is a top-10 defensive player of all-time, not noted for his offence whatsoever. Defensive forwards get Selke votes, and in the rare case they are just as good offensively as defensively, they get all-star votes. Carbonneau was a defensive stalwart, could be the best of his timeframe, he receives recognition in other categories to make up for what he doesn't possess offensively. Woit didn't receive any recognition besides an All-Star game in the NHL.
You're right, Carbonneau isn't a great comparison. However, I was simply using him as an example to indicate that all-star voting doesn't paint the whole picture. Carbonneau won the Selke but never received an all-star vote yet Dirk Graham won the Selke and received an all-star vote. Is Dirk Graham better? Of course not...

Quote:
Danyeko, I do not believe should go as early as he does. However, he was a punishing defenseman who was solid in his own zone and was a #2-#3 defenseman on three championship teams.
We can find quotes about Woit indicating he was a punishing defenseman and rock-solid in his own zone. Apparently, he was good enough to partner with Kelly on those dynasty Wings teams.

As for Daneyko, in my opinion, he was never considered close to #2 on those Devils teams (Stevens and Niedermeyer), and in 2000 and 2004, I would say he was no better than #4 (Stevens, Niedermeyer, and Rafalski)... maybe a Devils fan can provide some insight (TDMM?)

basically, a #3-#4 defensemen on three cup champions, with no all-star votes, known for great defence and punishing hits, is good enough to go in the 400s (again, I like Daneyko as a selection, and his career value is outstanding).
but, a #4 defensemen on three cup champions, with no all-star votes (in the O6), known for good defence (horrendous offence) and punishing hits, isn't good enough as a 25th round spare?

Quote:
Unfortunately there really isn't a metric or statistic that can solidify Woit as an ATD-worthy spare, I had a few defensemen left on my shortlist that are all substantially better than Woit.
I'd be curious to know who these defencemen are (not a snarky comment, just interested in learning more...)


Last edited by papershoes: 03-26-2013 at 11:12 AM.
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