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03-29-2013, 12:36 PM
  #510
Richter Scale
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Big surprise, we lost and suddenly this thread explodes.

At this point, I really really hope if Torts gets canned, that Sather continues to do nothing to address the problems with this team or learn from his mistakes. Then this thread can be bumped and all the fair weather fans who come out to moan when the team struggles and the guys who don't have a clue what they're talking about can read their hyperbolic bs, realize it, and sit down and just stuff it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Everyone who comes here forgets hOw to score sans Gabs. It would not surprise me at all if the best player in the world did as well lol
Really? News to me. Please, enlighten us - who exactly hasn't been able to score under this system that did previously elsewhere? What player came here from another team, played under Torts system, and has not met expectations? Or alternatively, who has left us under Torts system and gone on to explode offensively?

- Nash is having the best season ppg-wise of his career.
- Gabby, 2 40-goal seasons.
- Richie, while he wasn't great last year, did fine and about on par for his career despite a slow start.
- Fedotenko carried over a similar ppg from Pitt to us. And is doing worse this year with a run and gun system in the Flyers, and the coach that people here are for some mind boggling reason enamored with - Laviolette.
- Dubinsky is just as mediocre this year with CBJ as he was with us last year.
- Anisimov is the same story.
- Prust actually improved his offense when he came to NYR and played in Torts' system. And has carried over a similar ppg to MTL.
- Prospal, during the short time he had to play under Torts' system had quite possibly his best ppg rate of his career.

The only players that come close to fitting this storyline are Asham, Pyatt, Powe, Halpern. But none of them are exactly offensive powerhouses or at the pinnacle of their careers. And their ppg may well just be thrown off by a small sample size this year.

- Then you have John Malkin Mitchell. He has double the ppg this year as he did with the Rangers. But guess what? He's also getting almost double the ice time he did with us. I'm shocked! Shocked I tell you! More ice time means more production!?! And if you discount his hot start, even with more ice time he's about back on his ppg pace with the Rangers last year. The last 20 games he has 4 goals and 3 assists.

This has just become the accepted wisdom around here and is a complete load of crap.


Quote:
Originally Posted by I Eat Crow View Post
Look, it's obvious that the players on the team aren't able to exercise their full creativity. I have no problem with playing dump and chase, counter attack style against some teams, but when we're obviously more talented than the opposition, let the talent and creativity flow. It's why we've struggled against Buffalo and Florida. I like Torts, but his refusal to adjust has me frustrated.
Then stop *****ing about the dump and chase. If they could carry it into the zone or make amazing passing plays, they would. Torts is not telling them not to be creative or not to let the offense flow. At BEST, what he is saying is that if you don't have a play, don't force it and dump it in. That is simply SMART hockey. Want a prime example of why, with the personnel we have, getting the puck down low and being able to set up in the offensive zone is important and better than playing a "run and gun" system or "opening up" the offense? JT Miller's turnover last night -- he tried to pull a dumb move, failed, got caught along with the rest of his line down low because they hadn't set up, gave up an odd man rush, and lo-and-behold Ottawa gets a goal. This particular example happened deeper in the zone and wasn't a zone entry play, but the result was precisely what happens if during zone entry you don't have a play, don't get the puck deep, and instead try to force it.

As for the bold... where do you guys get this from? I'm not saying the team is bad, but I'm not seeing this amazing offensive creativity that everyone somehow thinks exists. We have 3, maybe 4 guys on this team that you could actually make that argument about consistently. 2 of them are playing like crap this year. The rest of them are fine, but don't finish and aren't consistent. Last night alone -- Stepan whiffs on a one-timer for an open net. Hags does the same thing. McDonagh has a rather large portion of the net open and shoots it into Bishop. Gabby continues to fail on two prime chances.

But yea, you're right. Definitely more skilled. And totally not getting enough chances because of the system (the five examples alone that I listed above included at least 3 that need to be goals).


Quote:
Originally Posted by I Eat Crow View Post
Away on vacation actually, didn't bring the laptop, nice try
So you're saying you have no examples, but just like to spew bs? Cool. You can't actually back up what you say? Here, I'll help you out with two examples -- nay, three. There have been three 3 on 2's this year in which Stepan was given the puck and instead of making a good pass or taking a shot, he took it behind the net (he scored on one of them by banking it off the goalie in the Washington game -- but I count that as him getting lucky, because there is no way he could have expected that to happen and if it doesn't these whole boards explode at him for doing it). Now, please, explain to me how it is John Tortorella's fault that Stepan had brain farts on those plays and just completely ****ing flubbed them. You think Torts was sitting there on the bench saying "YEA, good job Steps, got that puck down low!"? There is no way in hell that is on Torts. Step just decided to ****ing forget how to play hockey in those moments -- and its unfortunately not an uncommon occurrence with a lot of the guys on this team.

---

I'm a Torts defender. I've always said that he does plenty of things that drive me up the walls and that I wish were done differently; but even with those things, I think he brings more good than bad. And the problem (offensively) isn't the system. It is a GM that has no clue what he is doing. It is a team that is constructed poorly. It is players failing to play a full 60 minutes. It is a failure to work as hard as last year as a team. And it is your two star players pulling disappearing acts this year.

Edit: I'll take the Sather stuff to the Sather thread -- sorry.


Last edited by Richter Scale: 03-29-2013 at 01:28 PM.
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