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04-06-2013, 12:24 PM
I voted for Kodos
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: West Egg, New York
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Originally Posted by Hawkey Town 18 View Post
1984: Paul Coffey is used as the benchmark...he outscored Michel Goulet by 5 points. Does anyone in their right mind really think Coffey would have outscored Goulet if he wasn't playing with a Gretzky type of teammate?
Coffey was 6th in NHL scoring in the 1994-95 season, playing in Detroit. Did he have the talent to finish second in league scoring on his own merits? Certainly.

1985: Same situation but with Kurri and Hawerchuk...Hawerchuk is denied a well earned score of 100, and was very likely the second best offensive player that season, which is what is trying to be determined.
Jarri Kurri was 8th in league scoring in 1988-89 with Gretzky playing in LA. He was a very talented scorer, with or without the Great One, whose ass he spent a lot of time covering.

1. Esposito - 145
2. Orr - 122
3. Hodge - 105
4. Cashman - 89
5. Clarke - 87
6. Martin - 86
...average as benchmark: 106
Obviously we have to treat Cashman and Hodge's production here carefully, and everybody knows that. Those two were never outlier scorers based on talent. But the simple fact of the matter is that those points were scored, and we cannot arbitrarily act as though they do not exist.

Why is Orr included in the average?
Because he scored those points. The whole purpose of the option #3, or averaging system, is to find some sort of middle point between the outliers and the pack and use that as a benchmark on the assumption that this will create the least distortions (not on the assumption that it is perfect).

Also, we cannot simply remove Bobby Orr because he is Bobby Orr. The VsX system treats all players and all seasons equally, and identifies and removes outliers based on a clear, mathematical system. Arbitrarily removing players because of their names or because they are "70's Bruins" is no system, at all, and leads to nothing but endless, and fruitless, disagreement.

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