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05-21-2013, 07:58 PM
  #919
habsfanatics
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmanfish90 View Post
So correct me if I'm wrong habsfanatics, but what I feel like you're implying to me is that the defense, at no point during the season, was the issue for some games and that the entire issue with the Habs defensive shortcomings (shots against, goals against, etc) this season is placed entirely on the goalie, in fact only 1 goalie: Carey Price. Budaj played well, nothign to do with defense.

Obviously you don't watch ALL the games. Budaj had such a great record because for the most part, the defense in front of him played well for him. Down the stretch for Price, the defense played like utter crap.

As for shot differential, this is the only thing I can say. When looking at 1 statistic like SA, it's easy to come to certain conclusions, which in some cases are accurate, but in most cases are wrong. Did you notice that Montreal had one of the highest positive shot differentials in the NHL? Why is that you may ask, it is because our offense controlled the pace of a good majority of our games and when our opponent had the puck, they capitalized on some SCORING CHANCES that they had. Now I'm not saying the defense are at fault for these chances, in fact I believe that both the defense and the goalie are to blame for scoring chances that end up turning into goals. But scoring chances, for the most part, are the forwards and defence's part to blame. Last time I checked, the goalie didn't handle the puck all that often (although he may play the puck the odd time or give up some rebounds, with Price the rebounds aren't what killed him). Look at Penalties. Montreal was the third highest minor penalized team in the entire league. That has an effect on outcomes for games (take the Ryan White Ottawa Senators fiasco in the beginning of the season) as well. The point is, you look at one stat (shots against) and determine that because we had a low shot total, then the defense was good year round and that the goalie must have been the only issue.

As for why I believe Carey Price is a top 5 goalie? Let's ask this question. Out of the following goalies, who in their entirety over their career as a goalie based on technical skill, clutch, potential, etc. makes your top 5.

Hiller
Rask
Miller
Kiprusoff
Ward
Emery
Crawford
Varlamov
Bobrofsky
Lehtonen
Howard
Dubnyk
Markstrom
Quick
Bernier
Backstrom
Price
Rinne
Brodeur
Nabokov
Lundqvist
Anderson
Bryzgalov
Mason
Fleury
Vokoun
Niemi
Elliot
Halak
Bishop
Lindback
Reimer
Luongo
Schneider
Holtby
Neuvirth

For mine you have, in no particular order:

Quick
Rask
Lundqvist
Niemi
Price/Howard/Schneider/Rinne (all arguable for Top 5 IMO)

The things that all these goalies have in common besides Price: all have had strong defenses in front of them over certain periods of their career.
All the things you implied I said are incorrect. I never said that the sole reason we lost games was because of one goalie, specifically Carey Price.

What I did say, was that our shot differential was top tier in the entire league. The correlation between shot differential and qualifying for the playoffs is pretty astounding. I was debunking the myth that we gave up an extraordinary amount of scoring chances despite the low shot totals. It simply isn't true. Budaj, for the most part played under the same D and won 8 out of 10 starts. Not to say Budaj is a better goalie than Price, I don't believe that to be the case. His sample size is small and he has a history that can't be ignored, however, he played well this year, but the strong D was primarily responsible for that. Not Budaj himself.

There has been study after study done that shows shot quality as a whole has very little meaning. Shots generated is the driver force to goals. We gave up the 5th fewest, if you honestly believe our D gave up the 5th fewest shots, but the 5th most scoring chances, or whatever snake oil you're trying to sell, You are full of it, plain and simple.

I've watched every habs game for the last 10 years aside for one that a missed the first period of, this season. Try again.

We had the shot differential strongly in our favor even though we led plenty of games. The score plays a factor in Shot differential as teams leading tend to get out shot as they either sit back or the trailing team pushes forward.

What we seen during the meltdown was a goalie spotting the other team a 3 goal lead before the end of the first period, sometimes on 4 shots. From this point forward there is going to be a disproportionate amount of odd man rushes as the team who spotted the 3 goal lead now has to take risks they normally wouldn't take. They looked bad, but Price contributed greatly as to why they looked bad. They were playing 1, 2, 3 behind 10minutes into the first.

It sounds to me like your position is entirely based on emotion and not on merit. I'm beginning to believe it was you who didn't watch the games. I don't believe what everyone tells me just because they tell me it. I do this real Neanderthal thing, called thinking.


Last edited by habsfanatics: 05-21-2013 at 08:09 PM.
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