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04-25-2014, 07:46 PM
Join Date: Mar 2011
Originally Posted by
1- I guess you didn't follow as much as you think then. Either that or your memory is not as good as mine. In any event, the Therrien vs PK debate was on full force for most of the year, really, where have you been? And yes, a lot of it was created by our own coach publicly bashing and
flat out blaming PK for losses
I usually don't like to dig up things that clearly happened for posters that seemed to have missed it, you can do your own homework. But I'll make an exception this time:
''2 mauvaises executions par un defenseur (PK Subban) et c'est dommage, dans le fond c'est ca qui a couté le match'' (paraphrasing but feel free to watch the video).
In case you don't speak french, in a nutshell, Therrien says there were 2 poorly executed plays by a Dman (PK) and that's what cost them the game.
This wasn't the only time either. He did it a few times.
So laugh all you want, but you just proved that you really have nothing to add to this particular question.
2- So much fail in this point, I don't know where to start. Plekanec had the most ice time, therefore, I put him #1. Pretty simple stuff. Also, you said DD is better offensively, well, every time Plekanec had the benefits of playing with our best wingers, he outproduced DD. But let me guess, in your mind, you think comparing the player who gets used as the main shutdown guy, toughest match ups, toughest responsibilities, weaker wingers, to the guy that gets put in a way more favorable position to produce is fair?? Therrien decided to construct our lines the way he did and he established a role for each one. Looking at the team, he felt that was the best way to optimize his roster. It has nothing to do with him thinking DD is the best offensive center.
As for the rest, I mean you contradict yourself so badly. Again, the stats are there for you to see. Eller produced on the EGG line. They were split up because the rest of the team wasn't producing and we were around .500 mark. So when they went into their own little funk (as most trios do) Gallagher was moved. Still, Eller and Galy kept producing at about .5 while seeing their ice time drop. Then Galy was moved up to play with Plek and Gio because Bourque/Bournival/Briere just couldn't quite cut it (at least not for Therrien), and then Eller's production dropped completely and his PP time vanished. That's what happened. People really have bad memories. I'm not saying Eller doesn't share some responsibilities. He does. But to suggest Eller was in a complete funk and that's why players were moved is just flat out wrong.
And funny you say Therrien instilled a ''work for your chances'' attitude when DD was garbage and freely got to play with Galla-MaxPac. He hadn't earned jack crap.
I mean really dude, you're making me wonder if you followed this team at all during the season.
3- I would have liked to see Galchenyuk be used at center more, and we could have done it for a good while with DD playing like crap to start, and definitely during the exhibition games which is the right way to start imo. I don't think it's the end of the world. But it's something I would have liked.
4- Dude. There is no simplest thing to understand. Therrien oversees everything. If his assistant cannot fix a problem, then he needs to step in and fix it himself. I mean really, not sure how this is difficult for you to understand. What's funny here is that our ES play during the season was crap too, but nobody wants to admit that. For the PP, it's not his fault. Let me guess though, we have no issues to credit him for the PK?
Therrien is responsible for everything. He delegates. If the person he appointed to a role is failing, then he needs to step in. He's failed in fixing the PP.
5- Sure, at the end of the day, results are the only thing that matter. But when you are trying to analyze how a team actually performed, then you need to dig in much deeper than just the standings. They don't tell the whole story and can be influenced by a number of factors that are completely irrelevant to coaching (like injuries, scheduling, timing, luck...).
When you look at the overall season, no, the team was not structurally strong, and if it wasn't obvious for you when watching, then the basic stats should have helped you raise doubts in your analysis, and if that wasn't enough, then the advanced stats should surely have turned your doubts into reality. If you choose to ignore all of that, then you're just being a fan, and there's nothing wrong with that. But don't try to get into a discussion after.
We are not playing now like we did most of the year. That's just a cold hard fact. You will never be able to prove otherwise. All you can really do is keep a blind eye and ignore the very telling stats.
6- Now I'm definitely convinced you haven't followed the team at all.
Plek has one of his worst productive years. PK regressed. Galla-Galy stayed the course but they're sophomores and didn't strike me as the ''sophomore jinx'' type, and they weren't, but they didn't improve. Gionta regressed and is now a 3rd liner. Briere one of his worst seasons. Diaz regressed. Eller regressed. Moen regressed. Emelin has not improved in any way. Bourque career low. Prust regressed.
By regression, I mean compared to last year.
I mean seriously dude..did you follow anything this year??
8- I have no problem with the system we used in the POs. We played completely differently in the season. If you can't see the difference then you either didn't watch much of the season (which is what I'm thinking seeing how you have such a poor recollection of what happened this year) or you just don't know or pay much attention to what is really going on during games.
I listed 8 things I didn't like from Therrien. You tried to counter them but seriously, you've failed miserably. A simple ''I don't care about any of this, I just look at the W column'' would have made more sense.
I don't have much of an issue with Therrien, overall I think he's done a pretty good job since joining us for the 2nd time. So really, I have no reason to nitpick anything. As I said before, why would I criticize him for this season and then also say I think he's done a pretty good job overall?? Really. Why?
I'm not biased, I have no issues giving 2nd chances and I'm pretty patient. Also, I'm more than willing to admit being wrong. But I'm not wrong about a thing here.
1- It's funny because my first response to this point was "true, to an extent" and that's because I said Therrien never bashed him. That implies he insulted him or ridiculed him. Placing the blame on a
, in one game, without even saying his name, is far from bashing. Sure, it's immature, but give it a break with "Therrien bashes PK on multiple occasions". I agreed with you that he misused him a lot, but stop being so dramatic with him "bashing" Subban.
2- So your argument is that, because Plekanec had more ice time than Desharnais, he is the #1 center? Oh my. I'm pretty sure the center who plays on the top line is the top center.The center who plays on the top powerplay unit is the #1 center. Desharnais is both of those. Plekanec has more ice time because he plays on the penalty kill as well as the second unit of the powerplay. I honestly can't believe you're trying to say Plekanec is our #1 center when it's quite obvious he isn't the one playing on the #1 line. You can argue he is our most valuable center, but not our #1... The last time Plekanec out-produced Desharnais, it was Desharnais' first season in the league. He is also outproducing Plekanec this season too, despite having an awful start and actually being scratched numerous times.
3- Again, Galchenyuk DID play at center multiple times this season. You just told me that you question whether I even watched this team when you're whining about something that actually happened. The kid is 20, Eller is further in the development curve, so let Eller develop at center while Galchenyuk develops his NHL game. I don't understand why you could possibly nitpick something like this, when the course of action taken was by far the most logical.
4- Man, this is getting pathetic. You are so stubborn. The powerplay was not Therrien's responsibility, and when he noticed that it was seriously struggling, he began to focus on it. Not too hard to understand, so stop whining. I understand he delegates, but he isn't in charge of the actual powerplay. He is obviously making efforts to fix it, yet you are still complaining.
5- I've never seen someone type so much without having any content in their post, or a single shred of an argument. Stop rambling! The team struggled scoring 5-on-5 for a long stretch this season, but we still ended up 16th in 5-on-5 Goals For/Against. Eller struggled this year in terms of production, Pacioretty and Desharnais were awful for the first 20 games or so, Plekanec barely produced at .5 PPG. Our team struggled with offense this year, but succeeded a lot in restricting goals. So in the end, your complaints are still nitpicking because we finished with 100 points and deserved to do so. You're just complaining for the sake of complaining. Even elite teams have issues, like Colorado/Tampa's awful penalty kill or LA's horrible powerplay. They are still considered great-to-elite teams this season.
6- All I can say is... wow. How exactly can you argue that PK Subban regressed from a half-season? And are you honestly trying to tell me Plekanec regressed just because his production on the second line wasn't PPG? And... Moen regressed?! HAHAHA! Holy crap!!! I always thought you knew at least a bit about hockey, but if you're going to sit there and say Moen regressed, you're absolutely full of ****. It seems to me that you are one of those people who bases a season solely on point production, even if it's a fourth liner. I almost want to put this #6 as my signature, it's so laughably flawed. Almost every single player you listed didn't actually regress. The only one I'll agree with is Eller. Gionta didn't regress- he just took on a new role with the team. Another perfect example of how you're only looking at stats to argue that players regressed. Only those with very low hockey IQ argue player skill based solely on stats. This is just sad, man.
8- The only argument you keep saying is "we've changed, if you can't see that then you're crazy" despite providing any actual argument. It's like I'm having a discussion with a child! Present an argument instead of all your bickering! The team is playing puck pressure on the forecheck, as always, and position-oriented focusing on shot-blocking and clogging lanes on defense, as we did all season (last year we had a puck-pressure system on defense). We are playing a similar neutral zone strategy to what we have been lately, as I recall. As I said, I believe we have modified some of our game to combat Tampa's speed, but we still have many of the same basics. Please, explain otherwise with your enlightened arguments of "if you can't see my baseless argument, you don't watch hockey".
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