HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Marc-Andre Bergeron Comparisons

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-24-2004, 01:55 PM
  #26
Mizral
Registered User
 
Mizral's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Earth, MW
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,157
vCash: 500
Dempsey to me is a better example.

While I like the fire Bergeron brings, guys, I'm not sure if he will eventually become a fulltime Oiler down the road. Maybe next year, but I believe eventually they will ween him out. Some people might find this a slam, but it's not really. As the Oilers get better, the standards on their blueline will rise, and if the Oilers go out and get themselves a Kaberle, or Lynch comes up and can be as good as Bergeron offensivly, I think Bergeron will be either dealt, waived, or sent back down to Toronto.

We see this often on teams. Look at the Canucks a few years ago - we had Greg Hawgood playing for us, and actually he wasn't terrible, but as we got better, eventually the standards improved and then Hawgood wasn't good enough. The Habs had Boulion this year, but trust me on this one, they can't wait to get rid of him.

As for comparing Bergeron to Liles, I have to take issue with this. Maybe I'm too much of a fan of Liles, but the talent Liles displays to me is just awesome - no offense to Bergeron, but I don't believe he can match Liles in the talent department.

I do think Bergeron will be a useful player for the Oilers, particularly next year since I think he'll get 82 times - injuries, and big-time power play time. I think you'll see that he can get around 30 points next year even. But in time, guys like Lynch will replace him - such is the lot in life for small defenseman. Almost all of them at least.

Mizral is offline  
Old
03-25-2004, 12:47 PM
  #27
Dallas
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 851
vCash: 500
I think you're underestimating Bergy. His stats from this season projected over an 82 game scheduele are 13-25-38. No other regular rookie defenseman in the league comes close to his PPG average. Not Liles, not Pitkanen... nobody. If you're only expecting him to get 30 points next year in a full season I think you'll be slightly surprised. All Bergeron has done throughout his hockey career is put up huge offensive numbers. If he gets a regular shift next year as he is now, I wouldn't be surprised to see him get 45 points.

Dallas is offline  
Old
03-25-2004, 01:07 PM
  #28
Obsessed
Registered User
 
Obsessed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Devon, AB
Posts: 907
vCash: 500
The most impressive aspect of Bergerons game to me is his shot. He has a bullet from the point and he is fairly accurate. His stock is definatley on the rise as a PP QB. Dempsey is a fair comparison but I'd like to see him reach Rafalski like potential.

Cant forget how dangerous he is with the hip check either. Low center of gravity can be lethal.

Obsessed is offline  
Old
03-25-2004, 01:27 PM
  #29
copperandblue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 10,724
vCash: 500
I will probably get flamed for this but to me, Bergeron seems like a player that is along the lines of a Tarnstrom.

He is definately capable of putting points on the board and definately can add a different dimension to a defensive blueline but will likely never be a guy that will be relied on when the team is up by 1 and heading into the last 5 minutes of a game.

He is what he is and to me he is kind of a one dimensional player.

That said, I think he will be very good at that dimension.

copperandblue is offline  
Old
03-25-2004, 05:17 PM
  #30
Matts
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,911
vCash: 500
Yeah, good point

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
Dempsey to me is a better example.

While I like the fire Bergeron brings, guys, I'm not sure if he will eventually become a fulltime Oiler down the road. Maybe next year, but I believe eventually they will ween him out. Some people might find this a slam, but it's not really. As the Oilers get better, the standards on their blueline will rise, and if the Oilers go out and get themselves a Kaberle, or Lynch comes up and can be as good as Bergeron offensivly, I think Bergeron will be either dealt, waived, or sent back down to Toronto.
I doubt MAB would be here right now if the Oilers PP wasn't so damn terrible. He doesn't make it Wings-esque but he has certainly made it better. I think Lynch will eventually run the PP from the backend and you are probably right in that he'll take Bergeron's place. The Oilers are in love with Greene and Woywitka so I think we take those three kids along with Semi, Brew and Staios and that's the defense.

BUT that could change if next year Bergeron improves and really improves the PP and if he starts creating chances and goals off the rush. That would give him a whole other element to make himself more attractive to the org.

That being said this is certianly more tolerable then the stretch drive of '02 when we went with Boots-Fergy as the 3rd pairing after the Poti/York deal

Matts is offline  
Old
03-25-2004, 09:27 PM
  #31
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,196
vCash: 500
The Nathan Dempsey comparison is a laugh and a half. He's a 29 year old just now becoming a regular nhl'er and his offense is just ok.

Bergeron has been flirting with a .5 ppg average since the day he came into the league (at 22 years old) and is now a major offensive cog on this team. In this most crucial stretch of the season MAB is on a 5 game point scoring streak with 3g-3a-6pts, +3, and 11 shots on net. Those would be very good numbers for Ryan Smyth or Marcus Naslund any time of year, but at crunch time they're spectacular.

If there's a rookie that he can be compred to it's the Bergeron in Boston. Patrice is relied upon to contribute there, he's not just occupying a training position.

Oi'll say! is offline  
Old
03-27-2004, 12:00 AM
  #32
Mr Sakich
Registered User
 
Mr Sakich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Motel 35
Posts: 8,119
vCash: 500
bergie now leads all rookie dman in ppg. He is 6th overall amongst rookies in points per game. He is 4th overall in rookie +/-.

He should be on the all rookie team

Mr Sakich is offline  
Old
03-27-2004, 01:15 AM
  #33
The Rage
Registered User
 
The Rage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Stamford Bridge
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,792
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sakich
bergie now leads all rookie dman in ppg. He is 6th overall amongst rookies in points per game. He is 4th overall in rookie +/-.

He should be on the all rookie team
If he had those numbers over 60+ games, I would agree with you. Still though, it's amazing how he gets no respect (cue Rodney Dangerfield expression).

The Rage is offline  
Old
03-27-2004, 06:29 AM
  #34
rabi_sultan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London, England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 3,782
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to rabi_sultan Send a message via AIM to rabi_sultan Send a message via MSN to rabi_sultan Send a message via Yahoo to rabi_sultan
could he win rookie of the month for this month ?

rabi_sultan is offline  
Old
03-27-2004, 10:39 AM
  #35
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,196
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabi_sultan
could he win rookie of the month for this month ?
I just briefly rounded up his #'s for the month:

13gp, 3-6-9pts, +3, 28 shots.

I think the guy to look at is Zherdev, he's had a pretty good stretch of games but I haven't had time to look at his numbers.

Oi'll say! is offline  
Old
03-27-2004, 12:29 PM
  #36
Atlantic
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 144
vCash: 500
I'm not going to make a comment about comparing MAB with any other player, but I have to get this out. Since it is about hockey player comparisons.

Listening to the Score on t.v. the other day they had a small piece on Ovechkin, nothing new that nobody here hasn't heard already. But what really bothered me in this little story was that there are people reporting Ovechkin to be just as good as Mario Lemieux and Wayne Gretzky, or even better than them.

I did one of those double takes, by swining my computer chair around to face the screen, I wanted to see the face of the person who would actually write such garbage. Sure Ovechkin is a highly touted number one pick guy, but he isn't here yet, he isn't drafted to a team or played one NHL game for that type of praise to be used. Really now, people must be going through memory black-outs as to how well Gretzky played the game!

Unless he starts breaking the "Great One's" records then they can start with the comparisons.

The person(s) who reports that kind of garbage should get a new job with Life magazine. While they are at it, they should find a new one as well.......a LIFE.

Atlantic is offline  
Old
03-27-2004, 01:55 PM
  #37
Behind Enemy Lines
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Posts: 3,776
vCash: 500
IMO Bergeron and Nedved have been the catalysts in turning this team around. Nedved has delivered skill and finishing ability to address the gaping hole at first-line centre. And under Ulanov's tutelage, Bergie has transformed the backend with his great outlet passes and power play quarterbacking. And he can actually hit the net on the power play.

Bergie's fast puck movement has been invaluable. This team is flying in transition with Bergeron feeding bullet tape to tape passes. Finally, his decision-making has been much improved since the demotion. I for one am through second guessing Bergeron. I've seen enough of his skill, heart, and character on-ice to feel this guy will be around to battle off the size issue. Rafalski is a decent projection but Bergeron's fire could help him carve out a different, more physical place.

Can it be a coincidence this team's fortunes have changed since addressing its three key weaknesses - #1 centre, power play defenseman, and goaltending?

Behind Enemy Lines is offline  
Old
03-29-2004, 12:05 AM
  #38
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,196
vCash: 500
The aforementioned streak is now up to 7g, 3-5-8pts, +4, 15 shots.

*BUMP*

Oi'll say! is offline  
Old
03-29-2004, 01:15 AM
  #39
The Rage
Registered User
 
The Rage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Stamford Bridge
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,792
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
The aforementioned streak is now up to 7g, 3-5-8pts, +4, 15 shots.
This guy is incredible. He's put up great numbers at every level, including the NHL. And he still gets no repesct, even from an "oilers fan" like Mizral. I mean c'mon, look at the above numbers, which are outstanding considering the importance of the games we're playing right now. The cold hard facts show he is a quality defender, and one who steps it up in the most important games. For some reason people still don't believe that.

The Rage is offline  
Old
03-29-2004, 01:27 AM
  #40
IceDragoon
Registered User
 
IceDragoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: South of Sanity
Posts: 3,874
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
The aforementioned streak is now up to 7g, 3-5-8pts, +4, 15 shots.
Funny what a trip to the minors can do if a guy has the right attitude.
Gotta love his perspective adjustment.

IceDragoon is offline  
Old
03-29-2004, 01:45 AM
  #41
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,196
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDragoon
Funny what a trip to the minors can do if a guy has the right attitude.
Gotta love his perspective adjustment.
I love his attitude, he's just a competitor in every way and he's smart about it.

We got sooo lucky when we signed this kid as a free agent, I bet the Habs are kicking themselves right now

Oi'll say! is offline  
Old
03-29-2004, 01:51 AM
  #42
Cerebral
Registered User
 
Cerebral's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 21,758
vCash: 500
I'll admit, I've doubted Bergeron all season long. I was one of the few guys that didn't have him pencilled in to our opening day lineup and up until this past month I was still questioning his overall ability. After tonight, I'm officially one of MA's biggest fans.. he shoots a lot harder than I originally thought and his ability to jump into the rush has created a number of offensive chances. I've carefully watched his defensive play the past 5 games or so and I've been pretty impressed. He's not Adam Foote in the defensive zone but he doesn't "get lost" and "lose his man" every shift like a lot of posters have alluded to on discussions about rookie d-men on these boards.

I don't think Bergeron will ever be the all-around d-man that a guy like Pitkanen or Hamhuis will become but I feel he can round into an effective top 4 d-man. Heck, he's easily been a top 4 d-man for us during this streak and we've been the hottest team in the NHL. While I still think we could use another puckmoving d-man on our powerplay (hopefully Woywitka/Lynch/Gilbert can eventually fulfill that role), Bergeron's emergence has definitely taken the heat off of Lowe's shoulders somewhat..

Cerebral is offline  
Old
03-29-2004, 02:01 AM
  #43
Oi'll say!
Registered User
 
Oi'll say!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oil in 9
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,196
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerebral
He's not Adam Foote in the defensive zone but he doesn't "get lost" and "lose his man" every shift like a lot of posters have alluded to on discussions about rookie d-men on these boards.
Are you talking about my rant in a different thread? :p

I was referring to all of the new guys who've cut their teeth here in the last two seasons. I'm not saying that they're not going to be good, on the contrary, but I don't there's a d-man who's ever come into this league and played like a veteran from his first shift onwards. The Oilers started last season with only 5 guys who'd ever played before and since that time they've broken in an excessive # of d-men through necessity. I think it's tough on a goalie, that's all.

Oi'll say! is offline  
Old
03-29-2004, 03:42 AM
  #44
Cerebral
Registered User
 
Cerebral's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 21,758
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oi'll say!
Are you talking about my rant in a different thread? :p

I was referring to all of the new guys who've cut their teeth here in the last two seasons. I'm not saying that they're not going to be good, on the contrary, but I don't there's a d-man who's ever come into this league and played like a veteran from his first shift onwards. The Oilers started last season with only 5 guys who'd ever played before and since that time they've broken in an excessive # of d-men through necessity. I think it's tough on a goalie, that's all.
Nope, I wasn't referring to your rant.. It was directed more towards the thread on rookie d-men in the General NHL forum. I believe it took about 3-4 pages before someone even mentioned Bergeron's and the posters claimed his stats weren't that significant because he was such a terrible defensive player. I actually did agree with the gist of your other post.. the playoff drive just makes us all jumpy I guess!

Cerebral is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:04 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.