HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Notices

MAB is our Rodney Dangerfield

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-02-2004, 10:50 PM
  #1
Mr Sakich
Registered User
 
Mr Sakich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Motel 35
Posts: 7,888
vCash: 500
MAB is our Rodney Dangerfield

He leads rookie dmen in points per minute played, is 2nd amongst rookie dmen in +/- depsite playing for a team who is a coin toss from missing the playoffs, yet he isn't a top 10 rookie according to this site.

Michael Ryder, RW 7 0.0469
Trent Hunter, RW 20 0.0417
Matthew Stajan, C 7 0.0356
Jason King, RW 0 0.0352
Nikolai Zherdev, RW -13 0.0351
Alexander Semin, LW -3 0.0380
Patrice Bergeron, C 5 0.0370
Joffrey Lupul, C -7 0.0329
Tuomo Ruutu, C -30 0.0327
Nathan Horton, C -5 0.0300
Ryan Malone, LW -24 0.0281
M. Bergeron, D 13 0.0280
Niko Dimitrakos, RW 6 0.0261
Derek Roy, C -7 0.0258
J. Liles, D 6 0.0257
Matthew Lombardi, C 2 0.0244
Brett McLean, C -10 0.0238
K. Koltsov, LW -31 0.0236
Joni Pitkanen, D 15 0.0226
Jarret Stoll, C 9 0.0225
Eric Staal, C -3 0.0221
Mark Rycroft RW 2 0.0207
Paul Martin, D 13 0.0168
Tom Preissing, D 8 0.0156
Dan Hamhuis, D -13 0.0145

compare his numbers to Hamhuis and he is head and shoulders better but Hamhuis is considered a top prospect?? The only dman with comparable numbers is Pitkanen and apparently, he is the second coming.

Mr Sakich is offline  
Old
04-02-2004, 10:59 PM
  #2
Lowetide
Registered User
 
Lowetide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,281
vCash: 500
Hamhuis looks like a stud to me, the times I've seen the guy he's playing major minutes and looking good doing it. Pitkanen has been talked about so much he's probably a bit overrated, but he's going to be an impact player for a long time.

Bergeron isn't going to get that kind of respect because of his stature. I mean, watching this guy play hockey and then realizing he wasn't even drafted tells us how incredibly powerful the bias against size really is in terms of NHL scouting.

Still, 30 NHL clubs didn't bother to invest a 10th round pick on MA Bergeron, and even now any kind of slump or series of poor games will count more against him than it would a player with more size.

That's the way it has always been.

Lowetide is offline  
Old
04-02-2004, 11:01 PM
  #3
The Rage
Registered User
 
The Rage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Stamford Bridge
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,791
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Sakich
He leads rookie dmen in points per minute played, is 2nd amongst rookie dmen in +/- depsite playing for a team who is a coin toss from missing the playoffs, yet he isn't a top 10 rookie according to this site.

Michael Ryder, RW 7 0.0469
Trent Hunter, RW 20 0.0417
Matthew Stajan, C 7 0.0356
Jason King, RW 0 0.0352
Nikolai Zherdev, RW -13 0.0351
Alexander Semin, LW -3 0.0380
Patrice Bergeron, C 5 0.0370
Joffrey Lupul, C -7 0.0329
Tuomo Ruutu, C -30 0.0327
Nathan Horton, C -5 0.0300
Ryan Malone, LW -24 0.0281
M. Bergeron, D 13 0.0280
Niko Dimitrakos, RW 6 0.0261
Derek Roy, C -7 0.0258
J. Liles, D 6 0.0257
Matthew Lombardi, C 2 0.0244
Brett McLean, C -10 0.0238
K. Koltsov, LW -31 0.0236
Joni Pitkanen, D 15 0.0226
Jarret Stoll, C 9 0.0225
Eric Staal, C -3 0.0221
Mark Rycroft RW 2 0.0207
Paul Martin, D 13 0.0168
Tom Preissing, D 8 0.0156
Dan Hamhuis, D -13 0.0145

compare his numbers to Hamhuis and he is head and shoulders better but Hamhuis is considered a top prospect?? The only dman with comparable numbers is Pitkanen and apparently, he is the second coming.

What site are you talking about? HF? What do the numbers in your chart represent? I agree with you in sentiment (I myself have compared MAB to Dangerfield), but I don't understand alot of your post.

The Rage is offline  
Old
04-02-2004, 11:04 PM
  #4
oil slick
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 7,349
vCash: 500
I've tried defending him on the main board, but all in all, I think I prefer him getting no respect. If he were getting a lot of Calder talk, I think this would drive his salary up a lot, and put a lot of preasure on the guy. However, I do find it irritating when people claim he is not even in the top five offensive rookie d-men this year.

oil slick is offline  
Old
04-02-2004, 11:08 PM
  #5
momentai
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,352
vCash: 500
Honestly though.. points per minute played isn't the best indicator of talent or strength of play for a dman. Barrett Jackman certainly didn't win the Calder last year on the strength of his offensive game. It's all nice that Bergeron has been AMAZING since his callup and his game has certainly improved... but he's been inconsistent in terms of the entire year. And if people/sites rank him a little lower because of that... that's ok. After all, consistency is what we hope to shoot for.

momentai is offline  
Old
04-02-2004, 11:39 PM
  #6
Mr Sakich
Registered User
 
Mr Sakich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Motel 35
Posts: 7,888
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rage
What site are you talking about? HF? What do the numbers in your chart represent? I agree with you in sentiment (I myself have compared MAB to Dangerfield), but I don't understand alot of your post.
i don't have the savvy to make a proper table so the numbers are

player, position, +/-, pts/minute played

the reason I like points per minute played is that it equates players who are in different situations. It is unlikely a rookie will get a lot of minutes on a big salary team unless there are a lot of injuries. Rookies on expansion teams can get a lot of minutes which gives the appearance of better numbers.

A perfect example is Hamhuis and bergie. Hamhuis has 1 less point than bergie but has played half as many minutes. This is a testament to the quality of hamhuis's defense core and his coaches' willingness to play rookies. If bergie was in Nashville, he would probably have as many minutes as Hamhuis and twice as many points.

AS for Bergie not being an elite rookie, how many rookies have the patience and the ability to score the goal bergie got vs Dallas? Bergie makes things look so easy that we forget what kind of numbers he is putting up. Bergie is 50th in the league for dmen scoring out of 210 dmen. On average, every team has 1.6 dmen who score more than bergie. He is a top 2 to 3 scoring dman on just about every team in the league.

Mr Sakich is offline  
Old
04-03-2004, 12:20 AM
  #7
Silver
Registered User
 
Silver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: California
Posts: 5,063
vCash: 500
Heck, MAB wasn't getting any respect here until a couple of weeks ago. It's going to take time for people to come around...

Silver is offline  
Old
04-03-2004, 03:12 PM
  #8
Matts
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,911
vCash: 500
Pitkanen

I think his play has fallen off a little. Still a wonderful prospect though and playing under more pressure on one of the league's elite teams.

Hamhuis looks just great. That young fella can do it all

As for Bergy, there used to be a guy post on OF called Turbodog and he was a season ticket holder for the Dogs. Well he always raved about Bergeorn and said he did all the little things right and yes with that offensive ability he wouldn't get past the 3rd round if he was 6-0


Last edited by Matts: 04-03-2004 at 03:16 PM.
Matts is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:16 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.