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Mats Sundin

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Old
12-04-2007, 04:17 AM
  #1
Plager05
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Mats Sundin

He would be a dream acquisition for the Blues. I think its logical and feasible.

1. He's veteran all-star looking to win a cup. Would give us two great top scoring lines. Tkachuk, Stempniak, Perron, Boyes, Kariya, Sundin would be our top 6

2. He's an UFA after this season.

3. Former Blues exec John Ferguson Jr. is the Leafs GM. I think its significant because it won't exactly be an open market for Sundin, with his NTC.

4. This article from espn.com suggests the Leafs would have trouble getting a 1st round pick in return. Price should be pretty reasonable.

The main question I see is if Sundin wants to come here. There is definitely a clear role for him here, but will he join a team in the low end of the playoff race? Or can the Blues stay in 2nd in the Central?

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12-04-2007, 05:24 AM
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rumrokh
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It ultimately depends on the price. Even if nobody will send a first rounder for him, that doesn't mean the price will be cheap. Many teams will be competing if he hits the market. Then again, if he only signs off on three teams and two of them don't want him...who knows?

With more Swedish players, bigger playoff dreams, etc, it seems like Detroit is the dream destination for Sundin if he's moved. It's really unlikely that the Blues are willing to sell as much future for Sundin as the Wings would be. But if the Blues are not sellers and the price is right, he's a smart rental. Especially smart if you can convince him to stick around for a year or two, maybe on the off-chance that it would help bring along Berglund.

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12-04-2007, 08:37 AM
  #3
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Make the 1st conditional on playoff performance. Otherwise, we've got Atlanta's 2nd and a ton of prospects from which we can deal.

However, the point about Detroit is dead on: not only is Detroit a "dream destination" for what seems like the 132nd straight year, they have all kinds of cap space to work with ... meaning Toronto doesn't have to take back a couple of guys they really don't want to make the deal work. The Red Wings are also quite likely to throw out their 1st as casually as a great poker player ups the ante early in a hand. At that point, does Toronto really want the 1st, or do they want guys they can plug into the lineup for 2-4 years down the road?

As much as the "1st round pick" is [over]valued here at HF, most teams will gladly take proven commodities [read: guys actually playing pro hockey or at a really high level in juniors or the NCAA] instead.

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12-04-2007, 08:38 AM
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The fact that my old man would have a heart attack and possibly die, and that we have a standing $500 bet on either the Leafs or the Blues winning the Stanley Cup first should be enough reason this doesn't happen.

But in the really real world economics, Sundin has zero reason to choose St. Louis over 28 other teams. If he wants to win a Stanley Cup and that is his only reason to make the decision would he choose St. Louis in his top 10 destinations?

Truth is I don't see Mats accepting a trade. I do believe his goal is to retire a Leaf. Even more so than winning a Stanley Cup. I would have to figure the destinations he would lean towards would be:

Detroit
Colorado (return to his 1st team?)
New York Rangers
Anaheim
Vancouver (to play with Naslund?)

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12-04-2007, 11:43 PM
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Gutchecktime
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Quote:
4. This article from espn.com suggests the Leafs would have trouble getting a 1st round pick in return. Price should be pretty reasonable.
Silly IMO. Keith Tkachuk got a 1st, a 3rd, a 2nd in 08, and a conditional 1st. Why would Sundin have trouble getting a 1st from a contender?

Anyways, if Sundin goes to the Blues, I'm cheering for the Blues to win a cup. I'll cheer for Sundin's team in the playoffs no matter where he goes. He would be a great addition to any contender IMO. The very definition of clutch, surrounded by, well, total crap, for most of his time here.


Last edited by Gutchecktime: 12-04-2007 at 11:59 PM.
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12-05-2007, 01:04 AM
  #6
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If we have the cap space, I think a two year deal for Sundin would be nice. Weight is probably gone after this season. I don't think we should go into next year with just Tkachuk and Kariya as offensive veterans. JD will probably sign someone, so this is killing two birds.

I didn't think about Detroit. Hopefully things can somehow play out in our favor. I only hope Detroit just doesn't have the kind of assets Toronto wants. I think the Blues are in a better position to offer roster players, especially defensemen. I also wouldn't mind giving up a little youth to keep the Wings from getting him if we're close in the standings.

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12-05-2007, 03:07 PM
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Last year was alot diffrent situation league wise than right now. Last year people had cap money to spend. Also with his cap hit, which I have no idea what it is, what teams can actually trade for him that would want to that would want to clear the cap space by possibly really messing with team chemisty in order to make the cap?

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12-05-2007, 05:01 PM
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His cap hit is 5.5 million but obviously that would be significantly lower at the deadline, which is when a deal would be made, if at all. I don't think it'd be too much of a problem at the deadline.

And if the Leafs were to trade Sundin, I would imagine they'd be out of a playoff spot at that point and would be looking for good young prospects/picks.

It'd be great news for me if the Blues were interested, because I'm someone who loves prospects and also loves the Leafs, who trade them all away. It's like the Hockey Gods' idea of a cruel joke. So, I live vicariously through other teams' prospects - and I love the Blues' prospects. So send a few this way plz.

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12-05-2007, 05:20 PM
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For the record, I can't see any scenrio in which Toronto trades Mats Sundin. I also can't see him wanting to go anywhere except maybe Detroit (bummer).

He could have left Toronto this past offseason and signed anywhere and he chose to go back to Toronto where they really didn't improve the team to make a run at the playoffs let alone a Stanley Cup run. They acquired a goalie, which is a move, but if that is the only move on a team with some pretty big holes, then I would not consider that a significant move.

Would I like to have him? Sure. Do I think it is even a remote possibility? No. Besides, to acquire him now seems like it would be the Tkachuk deal all over again, pay with young players to acquire that "missing piece".

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12-05-2007, 06:08 PM
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They acquired a goalie, which is a move, but if that is the only move on a team with some pretty big holes
Well, to be accurate, that wasn't our only move. We signed Jason Blake as well. He hasn't worked out well so far, but I'm guessing the Leafs didn't expect him to be a) diagnosed with leukemia and b) have only 3 goals so far when he had 40 last season.

But yeah, it remains to be seen if he will waive his NTC and allow himself to be "Ray Bourque'd". At this point, he's saying he doesn't want to go anywhere. I think Leaf fans are hopeful he will agree, mostly because they want to see him have a chance at a cup.

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12-05-2007, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Plager05 View Post

4. This article from espn.com suggests the Leafs would have trouble getting a 1st round pick in return. Price should be pretty reasonable.
lol...

ESPN covers hockey?

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Old
12-06-2007, 07:00 PM
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Rare Jewel
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i'd there only one propect i want from st. louis



perron!!

i'd trade mats shraight up for him(if the leafs were outta playoff hunt by feb 27)

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12-07-2007, 03:47 PM
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i'd there only one propect i want from st. louis
lars eller. lars eller. omg, so jealous seeing him picked at our spot was like a knife through my heart.

damn you, ferguson.

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12-08-2007, 01:37 AM
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He would still have to waive his NTC......

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12-08-2007, 01:39 AM
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lol...

ESPN covers hockey?
I am not quite sure cover's hockey would be the correct way to describe it. It's actually more like highlight's with the least amount of time possible.

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12-08-2007, 09:57 PM
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You can bet if Toronto offers up Sundin, who is currently 7th in the league in scoring, there will be plenty of teams willing to start at a first round pick.

But I'm sure the Leafs would be willing to consider Erik Johnson as compensation.

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12-14-2007, 12:39 AM
  #17
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You can bet if Toronto offers up Sundin, who is currently 7th in the league in scoring, there will be plenty of teams willing to start at a first round pick.

But I'm sure the Leafs would be willing to consider Erik Johnson as compensation.
OF course they would, who wouldn't? That would be awesome for the Leafs!!!!

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12-15-2007, 02:12 AM
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OF course they would, who wouldn't? That would be awesome for the Leafs!!!!
Well some dreams are made to be broken.

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12-15-2007, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by TheFinalWord View Post
You can bet if Toronto offers up Sundin, who is currently 7th in the league in scoring, there will be plenty of teams willing to start at a first round pick.

But I'm sure the Leafs would be willing to consider Erik Johnson as compensation.
ok, now you are just being a tease...

I accept your offer.

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12-15-2007, 03:15 PM
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Mats will not be traded for anything less than 2-1st round picks, and at least 1 really good prospect

He's on MVP pace right now and head and shoulders better than any other rental in recent years. There is no way we recieve anything less than overpayment for him.

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12-15-2007, 03:17 PM
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Mats will not be traded for anything less than 2-1st round picks, and at least 1 really good prospect

He's on MVP pace right now and head and shoulders better than any other rental in recent years. There is no way we recieve anything less than overpayment for him.
Keep telling yourself that, kiddo.
It's never going to happen; but keep telling yourself that.

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12-15-2007, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by kimzey59 View Post
Keep telling yourself that, kiddo.
It's never going to happen; but keep telling yourself that.
Do you really think that Mats Sundin, who is *right now* twice the player Guerin or Weight ever have been would receive significantly less compensation than those players got? I doubt it.

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12-15-2007, 04:00 PM
  #23
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Keep telling yourself that, kiddo.
It's never going to happen; but keep telling yourself that.
Hey, you don't want to pay for the ticket, you don't have to get on the ride.

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12-15-2007, 04:13 PM
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WalterSobchak
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Hey, you don't want to pay for the ticket, you don't have to get on the ride.
we're good, there's a few other rides in this park we are interested in than this old rickety roller coaster.

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12-17-2007, 02:50 AM
  #25
Bluester
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Originally Posted by Rattlehead View Post
Mats will not be traded for anything less than 2-1st round picks, and at least 1 really good prospect

He's on MVP pace right now and head and shoulders better than any other rental in recent years. There is no way we recieve anything less than overpayment for him.
I can possibly see a team giving a first and some sort of prospect or 2 depending on quility. Although he has to waive his no trade clause for anything to be done. And if he only waives it to say a certain number of teams and it's made public that would possibly hurt his value cause then your only dealing with a certain amount of resources. So unless someone panics I really really don't see an overpayment. If anything I see teams shooting low and the leafs taking it cause they want something for him.

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