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Where do Oates,Messier and Robitaille rank with all time greats?

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Old
04-05-2004, 01:16 AM
  #1
Randall Graves*
 
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Where do Oates,Messier and Robitaille rank with all time greats?

With Mark Messier,Adam Oates and Luc Robitaille all likely retiring I think its time to ask the question where each stack up on the all time best players list.

So Rank them!

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Old
04-05-2004, 03:42 AM
  #2
bleedgreen
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how about ron francis? i think he deserves a mention here.

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04-05-2004, 03:46 AM
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kmad
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Francis is still playing, Oates Robitaille and Messier are not

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04-05-2004, 04:50 AM
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Cerebral
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I'd personally rank them as follows:

Messier
Oates Robitaille

Messier gets the nod based on his incredible leadership abilities and the sheer number of Stanley Cups he's won. I think Oates and Robitaille are pretty close.. they're all likely Hall of Famers eventually, it's just a question of who gets in first I believe.

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04-05-2004, 05:47 AM
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roast
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i would agree with your rankings there. If you include Francis, i'd put him between Messier and Oates. Do you think MEssier could get the wating period wavied for him to enter the hall immediately? I would think he's a sure fire first ballot hall of famer.

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04-05-2004, 08:49 AM
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kyle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roast
i would agree with your rankings there. If you include Francis, i'd put him between Messier and Oates. Do you think MEssier could get the wating period wavied for him to enter the hall immediately? I would think he's a sure fire first ballot hall of famer.
If anyone could, he could BUT I doubt it. I seem to remember them saying that after Lemieux's waiting period was waived, they said that they would never do it again.

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04-05-2004, 08:56 AM
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Raging Bull
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My rankings would go somewhat like this:
Messier
-----
-----
-----
Robitaille
Oates


And if we are including Ron Francis, he's right behind Messier. But IMO the other 2 aren't in the same league as Messier and Francis. Just my opinon though.

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04-05-2004, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mogilny8989
My rankings would go somewhat like this:
Messier
-----
-----
-----
Robitaille
Oates


And if we are including Ron Francis, he's right behind Messier. But IMO the other 2 aren't in the same league as Messier and Francis. Just my opinon though.
couldn't agree more. Both Robitaille and Oates are great players and worthy of Hall of Fame, I believe, but neither were anywhere near as influential on the team and the game as a whole as Messier was.

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04-05-2004, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuthbert
couldn't agree more. Both Robitaille and Oates are great players and worthy of Hall of Fame, I believe, but neither were anywhere near as influential on the team and the game as a whole as Messier was.
Call me a homer, but I think you are both underestimating him.

He may be a little one dimensional, but he is/was the best ever at what he does. Luc the the highest scoring left wing and highest goal scoring left wing of all time. I agree that Mess ranks way above him. But Luc is far ahead of Oates

 
Old
04-05-2004, 01:57 PM
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Pure Slaughter Value
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I agree that Mess ranks way above him. But Luc is far ahead of Oates

My thoughts as well. Luc gets no love

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04-05-2004, 02:03 PM
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OldTimeHockey
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Messier Ranks 26th
Lucky Luc Ranks 63rd
Oates slips in to the top 150 at 135.

How the hell am I suppose to know where they rank...Gotta a list? :lol

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04-05-2004, 02:23 PM
  #12
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Mark Messier
...
...
Ron Francis
...
Brett Hull
Luc Robitaille
...
...
Adam Oates

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Old
04-05-2004, 03:01 PM
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Burke's Evil Spirit
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Messier is a top-5 player all-time, IMO...as for Oates and Robitaille, obviously they're way down the list, and I'd have Oates ranked slightly ahead of Robitaille.

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04-05-2004, 03:23 PM
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OldTimeHockey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burke's Evil Spirit
Messier is a top-5 player all-time, IMO...as for Oates and Robitaille, obviously they're way down the list, and I'd have Oates ranked slightly ahead of Robitaille.
I don't think Mess is top 5.

gretz
lemieux
orr
howe
richard
and so on and so on

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04-05-2004, 03:47 PM
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I agree with OTH. Mess is top 10 but not top 5. And his leadership doesn't help him there. Hell as far as I'm concerned he's the second-best leader of all time, behind Jean Beliveau.

Oates is the best pure passer of the last 15 years or so. Now don't get confused. Lemieux and Gretzky are better passers, but in their primes they also had great scoring ability themselves. Defenseman and goalies had to respect their shot as well as be ready for the pass. With Oates, everyone on the ice knew he was going to pass and the passes got there anyway. Adam Oates has been underrated for a long time in this league, same as Dale Hawerchuk before him.

As for Lucky Luc, someone up-thread mentioned his accomplishments, and those are nothing to sneeze at. For about 3 seasons, Robitaille was as automatic as it gets in the NHL, from a position not known for great snipers. Sure he benfitted by playing with Gretz, but so did Kurri and no downplays Jari's accomplishments.

As for where you "rank" those two, I would put Oates a little ahead because he could make even the most pedestrian wingers into goalscorers in his prime. Not saying Robitaille didn't, but I think it's obvious Oates contributed more to his linemates. Having said that I am equally fine with Robitaille ahead as goals are tougher to come by than assists.

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Old
04-05-2004, 04:06 PM
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Luigi Lemieux
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he was ranked #12 by THN in their 50 greatest players of all time.

that was published in 1998, and he's done nothing since then so i don't know why people are saying he's top 5. top 10 is even arguable.

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Old
04-05-2004, 04:27 PM
  #17
OldTimeHockey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldTimeHockey
I don't think Mess is top 5.

gretz
lemieux
orr
howe
richard
and so on and so on
Beliveau
Bossy
Domi
Doug Harvey
Eddie Shore
Ray Bourque
Guy Lafleur
Bobby Hull

and then if you start putting goalies in there, Mess falls down even more.

Bower
Sawchuk
Plante
Roy
Hall
all would in my books bump Messier down.

Not trying to take anything away from the guy. I just think he is slightly overrated.

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Old
04-05-2004, 06:06 PM
  #18
LuckyLUC20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsjohn
Call me a homer, but I think you are both underestimating him.

He may be a little one dimensional, but he is/was the best ever at what he does. Luc the the highest scoring left wing and highest goal scoring left wing of all time. I agree that Mess ranks way above him. But Luc is far ahead of Oates
yeah I agree. It's Messier, ................ Robitaille ........ Oates.

My handle is named after him for a reason. Luc is an emotional leader for the Kings. He is the heart and soul of the franchise along with Ian Laperriere. Luc's heart is unmeasureable. I think he's the classiest player in all of sports ... I will miss him if he does in fact retire. These guys don't grow on trees, that's for sure.

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