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Kalinin vs Hamrlik

View Poll Results: Which defenseman would you rather have?
Kalinin 23 45.10%
Hamrlik 28 54.90%
Voters: 51. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
04-06-2004, 04:42 PM
  #1
Thomas
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Kalinin vs Hamrlik

Trying to settle an argument, who would you rather have (combination of now and future) between Kalinin and Hamrlik.

I'd say Kalinin because of his age and he seems to be just warming up, while Hamrlik has had a dissapointing season, though Hamrlik is a bigger defenseman.

Anyways, I'd appreciate your opinion,

Thanks.

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04-06-2004, 04:49 PM
  #2
glenjackson
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Personally, I'd prefer Kalinin. But that might be a fantasy slant. I traded him away this year when I thought I was deep with young defensemen and that he was going to just be good, but not quite as good as he turned out to be. I want him back!

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04-06-2004, 05:00 PM
  #3
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Kalinin.

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04-06-2004, 05:30 PM
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Hamrlik

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04-06-2004, 06:10 PM
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Epoch
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Hamrlik.

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04-06-2004, 06:53 PM
  #6
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Roman

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04-06-2004, 10:11 PM
  #7
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I don't even need to be a homer on this one....Kalinin.Dmitri is already a #2 and is 23 years old.Roman has tapped out and Kalinin has all the skill in the world.

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04-06-2004, 10:34 PM
  #8
Winston Wolf
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Kalinin pretty easily for me. He's like 7 years younger and really isn't much of a downgrade from Hamrlik right now. In the future he'll be better than Hamrlik was in his prime.

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04-06-2004, 10:37 PM
  #9
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Don't get me wrong, I like Hamrlik a lot, however, Kalinin is very young, and can only get better. Hamrlik can't get much better than he is. Kalinin rarely, rarely makes mistakes and had a great offensive year for a defenseman not known for scoring. Kalinin in a heartbeat for me. Hamrlik will only get more votes because people who don't know a thing about hockey will think he's still as good as he once was. He isn't, and he won't get any better.

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04-06-2004, 10:46 PM
  #10
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Kalinin hands down, and that's not just because I'm a fan of the team. He's much younger and will be better than Roman was in his prime. Kalinin, within two years, will be good enough to play #2 on just about any team in the league. He's going to be a 40 point defenseman that plays as good in his own zone as the most stalwart stay at home defenseman.

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04-06-2004, 10:52 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhett4
Kalinin hands down, and that's not just because I'm a fan of the team. He's much younger and will be better than Roman was in his prime. Kalinin, within two years, will be good enough to play #2 on just about any team in the league. He's going to be a 40 point defenseman that plays as good in his own zone as the most stalwart stay at home defenseman.

Hell,next year if Z is gone,I see no reason why Tree can't reach 50 points.

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04-06-2004, 11:01 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielBriere48
Hell,next year if Z is gone,I see no reason why Tree can't reach 50 points.
You might be right. Quite frankly, I think Kalinin will be the best player on the team in a few years. I'm higher on him that anyone, and we've got some talented young guys.

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04-07-2004, 04:51 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhett4
You might be right. Quite frankly, I think Kalinin will be the best player on the team in a few years. I'm higher on him that anyone, and we've got some talented young guys.

It's funny how practically no one knows who he is,or how good he is going to be.I could easily see him being the best Sabres d-man or the Sabres d-man with the best impact.

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04-07-2004, 05:06 PM
  #14
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First, I think many of you are underestimating where Hamrlik was at his best, and I also think the suggestion that he is topped out in terms of development is off as well. I don't think he is going to get any better offensively (in fact, I think his point totals will show a sharp decline), but I think he can be even better defensively as he enters his thirties.

Second, suggesting that Kalinin is going to be better than Hamrlik in his prime (or that he is as good as Hamrlik now) is more than a small projection. Kalinin may or may not reach that level, but he has a long way to go. Hamrlik, at his best, is top 2 on nearly any team in the league.

Third, isn't this a bit too much of an apples to oranges comparison? I'm a big New York Islander fan and I really like Hamrlik's game a lot (even though he did not have a great season). But, I'd still take Kalinin. Why? Because of the age difference and because I love Kalinin's POTENTIAL. Hamrlik is the far more effective player NOW and probably for the NEAR FUTURE but Kalinin should be a high-level dman for the next decade and he could turn out to be very, very good.

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04-07-2004, 05:41 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
Second, suggesting that Kalinin is going to be better than Hamrlik in his prime (or that he is as good as Hamrlik now) is more than a small projection. Kalinin may or may not reach that level, but he has a long way to go. Hamrlik, at his best, is top 2 on nearly any team in the league.

Kalinin was the best D-man in the final stretch(for Buffalo),when he was playing 28-30 minutes a night.Kalinin doesn't have a long way to go.He's a top 2 pairing on pretty much every team and his offense has already surpassed Hamrlik's.Kalinin's defense has been improving too.

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04-07-2004, 06:26 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielBriere48
Kalinin was the best D-man in the final stretch(for Buffalo),when he was playing 28-30 minutes a night.Kalinin doesn't have a long way to go.He's a top 2 pairing on pretty much every team and his offense has already surpassed Hamrlik's.Kalinin's defense has been improving too.

Kalinin isn't in Hamrlik's league defensively right now. He does have a long way to go. And, yeah, he is Hamrlik's equal offensively in Hamrlik's worst season. But, Kalinin's career high of 34 points is about 30 points lower than Hamrlik's career season. It is unlikely that Kalinin is every going to put up the 60 points that Hamrlik did in his prime.


BTW, Buffalo has a winning record and let in about as many goals as the Isles, yet Kalinin was not a plus player. And, don't tell me his so-so +/- reflects being on the ice in critical moments against the top line. Adrian Aucoin was used the same way and was +30 on a team that isn't much stronger than Buffalo.

Kalinin should be a very effective dman, but he still has a long way to go before he will be a true top pairing guy on a contender. I personally think he will be a fine player, and perhaps the equal of Hamrlik in his prime. But that is far from being a sure thing.

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04-07-2004, 07:13 PM
  #17
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Old
04-07-2004, 10:54 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Milbury
Kalinin isn't in Hamrlik's league defensively right now. He does have a long way to go. And, yeah, he is Hamrlik's equal offensively in Hamrlik's worst season. But, Kalinin's career high of 34 points is about 30 points lower than Hamrlik's career season. It is unlikely that Kalinin is every going to put up the 60 points that Hamrlik did in his prime.


BTW, Buffalo has a winning record and let in about as many goals as the Isles, yet Kalinin was not a plus player. And, don't tell me his so-so +/- reflects being on the ice in critical moments against the top line. Adrian Aucoin was used the same way and was +30 on a team that isn't much stronger than Buffalo.

Kalinin should be a very effective dman, but he still has a long way to go before he will be a true top pairing guy on a contender. I personally think he will be a fine player, and perhaps the equal of Hamrlik in his prime. But that is far from being a sure thing.

Uh Kalinin was even and to let you know there were 3 players who had a +...Drury,Hecht and Patrick.2 forwards and 1 d-man who played limited minutes.

And Please,Hamrlik's top 65 point year was 9 years ago when scoring was way up and he was the number one threat on offense.What was he?A -24.Hamrlik is not a 50 point d-man,more like a 30-40.


Kalinin is not that far away from Hamrlik defensively.Kalinin just completed his 4th season.Look at Kalinin's +/- for a bottom 5 team last year....-7.Hamrlik's was almost 4 times that on an equally bad team.I know that Kalinin will surpass Hamrlik next year,if he hasn't already.

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04-07-2004, 11:11 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielBriere48
Uh Kalinin was even and to let you know there were 3 players who had a +...Drury,Hecht and Patrick.2 forwards and 1 d-man who played limited minutes.

And Please,Hamrlik's top 65 point year was 9 years ago when scoring was way up and he was the number one threat on offense.What was he?A -24.Hamrlik is not a 50 point d-man,more like a 30-40.


Kalinin is not that far away from Hamrlik defensively.Kalinin just completed his 4th season.Look at Kalinin's +/- for a bottom 5 team last year....-7.Hamrlik's was almost 4 times that on an equally bad team.I know that Kalinin will surpass Hamrlik next year,if he hasn't already.
Completely agree.

Kalinin doesn't get the exposure he would if he were on Ottawa, Colorado, or Detroit. His defense is terribly under-rated. His offense is consistantly improving.

Hamrlik has had a 60 point or so season, like DB48 said, almost a decade ago when over 10 players had more than 100 points and 8 players had over 50 goals. The past few seasons have been nothing like that. Also, Hamrlik was the only defenseman of note on the Lightning at that time, making him the primary offensive threat from the blueline, on the powerplay and even strength which gave him an immense amount of ice time. Kalinin is still in Zhitnik's shadow in that regard. Other than that one 65 point year he's had, he only had over 40 points 4 other times in his 13 NHL seasons and has failed to hit 30 points 6 times. Kalinin was not picked in the 1st round to be an offensive force, Hamrlik was. Kalinin was widely known as a stay-at-home d-man with limited offensive ability, he was not expected to score, but he has.

By virtue of the fact that Hamrlik has played in nearly 900 games, he is past his prime. Kalinin has played in less than 300 games. His prime is yet to come. That is why right now, I'd take Kalinin. I think he's better than Hamrlik right now.

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Old
04-08-2004, 01:37 AM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielBriere48
Uh Kalinin was even and to let you know there were 3 players who had a +...Drury,Hecht and Patrick.2 forwards and 1 d-man who played limited minutes.

And Please,Hamrlik's top 65 point year was 9 years ago when scoring was way up and he was the number one threat on offense.What was he?A -24.Hamrlik is not a 50 point d-man,more like a 30-40.


AKalinin is not that far away from Hamrlik defensively.Kalinin just completed his 4th season.Look at Kalinin's +/- for a bottom 5 team last year....-7.Hamrlik's was almost 4 times that on an equally bad team.I know that Kalinin will surpass Hamrlik next year,if he hasn't already.

Right. Kalinin had a +/- rating of 0 on a team that let up only 11 goals more than the Isles. Under very similar circumstances, Aucoin was +29 and Kenny J. was +25. You claimed that Kalinin was a top 2 man on any team in the NHL. Well, he wouldn't even crack the top four on the Island, and the Isles are not an elite team defensively.

And, yeah, Hamrlik is a 30 - 40 point man, largely because he gets hurt a lot. When he manages to stay in one piece, he usually scores in the 50 point range. Besides, you said that Kalinin was already past Hamrlik's best offensively and the truth is he is not there now and probably never will be.

I do think Kalinin will outscore Hamrlik over the next few seasons, primarily because I think Hamrlik's offense is in decline. I think his future is as a defensively oriented player who maybe gets 30 points a year.

That said, Kalinin is far away from Hamrlik defensively now. For one thing, Kalinin has a way to go before he can match Hamrlik's physical game.

You "know" that Kalinin will surpass Hamrlik defensively, eh? I hope you are enjoying use of that crystal ball. As far as I can tell, you can't see into the future any further than me. Kalinin MAY surpass Hamrlik eventually, but I doubt that happens next season, or even the season after that. He still has a long way to go in his own end of the ice.


Last edited by Darth Milbury: 04-08-2004 at 01:41 AM.
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Old
04-08-2004, 01:38 AM
  #21
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Heck, I'd almost take Kalinin now over Hamrlik. I see Kalinin as a future top 5 defenseman mind you

Hamrlik is very good, and usually I choose veterans over kids, but Kalinin isn't your average kid, and Hamrlik's game is really starting to slip lately.

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04-08-2004, 01:43 AM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
Heck, I'd almost take Kalinin now over Hamrlik. I see Kalinin as a future top 5 defenseman mind you

Hamrlik is very good, and usually I choose veterans over kids, but Kalinin isn't your average kid, and Hamrlik's game is really starting to slip lately.

Appreciate the perspective, Mizral. But, I have to disagree. Hamrlik has a misserable first half but has actually come on quite strong in the second half. His offensive game is (IMO) in decline, but he is still very strong in his own end of the ice.

But, I do respect your opinion.

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