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Sens are divers and cheap shot artists

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Old
04-20-2004, 09:18 AM
  #26
MacDaddy TLC*
 
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I'm ******* tired of the Leafs taking the brunt of the negativity for it. Everyone does it. I may even go so far to say guys wearing shields that can't/won't back it up are the worst offenders. Every team gives some cheapshots every game, some more than others.

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04-20-2004, 11:08 AM
  #27
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You guys better start defining what a cheap shot is as I'm sure you all know that Darcy Tucker is a fan favorite for 29 other teams in the NHL with his acts on the ice.

Every team has agitators (or as you seem to call them, cheapshot artists) and some are more effective than others. Some teams have a few known divers although I'm pretty sure that they don't just dive out of nowhere and actually do get hit.. they're just trying to draw a penalty which is no different than agitators trying to draw a retaliation penalty.

Now, quit whining and complaining about these little things and worry about supporting your team for Game 7. There will be plenty of these types of threads to go around once your team is eliminated (whether it's by Ottawa or another team.. can't stop the trend now, right? I mean.. you guys represent Canada and it took Canada 50 years to win it at the Olympics, didn't it?)

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Old
04-20-2004, 12:03 PM
  #28
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They should rename the team the Ottawa Swanetors!


Last edited by thatcanadianguy23: 04-20-2004 at 12:04 PM. Reason: typo
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Old
04-20-2004, 12:16 PM
  #29
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tucker and domi are taking hits in this series without retaliating

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04-20-2004, 12:23 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f.
tucker and domi are taking hits in this series without retaliating
Tucker did take a stupid penalty against Varada a few games back. All in all, it's a little more difficult for him to retaliate when he's lying on the ice in tangled heap, unable to get up most of the time

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04-20-2004, 12:49 PM
  #31
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If you call tons of clean open ice hits by Fisher, Neil, Schaefer, Chara and Phillips dirty..then yeah, I guess we are. The Leafs have been manhandled in the physical department this series...so I understand why you feel the need to whine.

Dirtiest play of the series: Knowing his team is going to lose, Domi grabs Curtis Leschyshyn's head, and rams it into the glass.

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Old
04-20-2004, 12:52 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting004
If you call tons of clean open ice hits by Fisher, Neil, Schaefer, Chara and Phillips dirty..then yeah, I guess we are. The Leafs have been manhandled in the physical department this series...so I understand why you feel the need to whine.
.
The Leafs get called dirty for the same things, it is annoying isn't it?

Quote:
Dirtiest play of the series: Knowing his team is going to lose, Domi grabs Curtis Leschyshyn's head, and rams it into the glass
Alfie crosscheck to the face of Marchment.
Bondra crosscheck to the face of Tucker.

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Old
04-20-2004, 12:58 PM
  #33
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Originally posted by Leaf Defender
Bondra crosscheck to the face of Tucker.
If you happen to see the replay, both players made cross check motions, but Tucker had his own stick shoved back in his face. It was a bad call. Bondra ought not been penalized two extra minutes for drawing blood, when its Tucker's own freakin stick.

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04-20-2004, 12:59 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting004
Dirtiest play of the series: Knowing his team is going to lose, Domi grabs Curtis Leschyshyn's head, and rams it into the glass.

Ummm, are we watching the same series?

Dirtiest play of the series: Knowing that his team is going to lose, Varada takes a run from near his own blueline and tries to snap Sundin's leg as he comes out from behind the net.


Domi has done some stupid things in the past, but he has some talent and works hard at developing an honest game. Varada has zero talent, I mean come on, he lost the handle on the puck on a breakaway. He has no business being in the league.

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Old
04-20-2004, 12:59 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Varada
If you happen to see the replay, both players made cross check motions, but Tucker had his own stick shoved back in his face. It was a bad call. Bondra ought not been penalized two extra minutes for drawing blood, when its Tucker's own freakin stick.
Bondra shoved Tucker's stick into his face, he caused the injury.

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Old
04-20-2004, 01:14 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f.
thats how it was
phillips went after sundin's skates and not the puck.
it was sad

varada going after his knees was bad too.

and what the hell was bonk doing last night, trying to swat the puck out of eddie's glove all night
It wasn't even Phillips, it was Redden. Get your facts straight before making all Leaf fans look like giant whiners.

 
Old
04-20-2004, 01:21 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f.
thats how i remember it
phillips stuck out his stick on sundins partial breakaway, tripping him dangerously off the post and falling awkwardly into the boards
You can't even complain properly. It was Redden not Phillips that became tangled up with Sundin on that play.

If you can't even determine that much, how can you decide who is or isn't diving.

You do, however, get full marks for complaining. While you are at it, complain about the effort the Leafs are making in this series. If it wasn't for Belfour they would all be golfing by now.

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04-20-2004, 01:24 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barney Rubble
You can't even complain properly. It was Redden not Phillips that became tangled up with Sundin on that play.

If you can't even determine that much, how can you decide who is or isn't diving.

You do, however, get full marks for complaining. While you are at it, complain about the effort the Leafs are making in this series. If it wasn't for Belfour they would all be golfing by now.
If it wasn't for injuries the Sens would be golfing already

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Old
04-20-2004, 01:46 PM
  #39
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Priceless. Just priceless. :lol

Setting yourselves up already? This way, if they lose you have reason to complain and say that the only reason Ottawa won is related to constant cheating.

If Toronto wins, they're all heroes for battling through the dirty play of Ottawa and coming together as a team through all their injuries.

Both teams have been dirty - it's called the NHL. The higher you go in sports the dirtier it gets.

Bottom line is this - whoever wins deserves it. If Ottawa can't win after outshooting Toronto so badly they don't deserve it. If Toronto can't win because they can't keep up with Ottawa's speed then they don't deserve it.

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Old
04-20-2004, 01:52 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HF2002
Priceless. Just priceless. :lol

Setting yourselves up already? This way, if they lose you have reason to complain and say that the only reason Ottawa won is related to constant cheating.

If Toronto wins, they're all heroes for battling through the dirty play of Ottawa and coming together as a team through all their injuries.

Both teams have been dirty - it's called the NHL. The higher you go in sports the dirtier it gets.

Bottom line is this - whoever wins deserves it. If Ottawa can't win after outshooting Toronto so badly they don't deserve it. If Toronto can't win because they can't keep up with Ottawa's speed then they don't deserve it.
well said

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Old
04-20-2004, 02:03 PM
  #41
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Being that I only got to see game 5 (ESPN IS SO STINGY :mad: ), I'd say it's hard to call this a dirty series. Niel Smith, the analyst doing the game, voiced my opinion by saying it was the boringest play off game he's seen in a while.

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Old
04-20-2004, 02:15 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoRyanMalone
Being that I only got to see game 5 (ESPN IS SO STINGY :mad: ), I'd say it's hard to call this a dirty series. Niel Smith, the analyst doing the game, voiced my opinion by saying it was the boringest play off game he's seen in a while.
definately not a series for non Leafs/ Sens fans to enjoy. Been lower scoring and tight checking. Great stuff if you ask me.

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Old
04-20-2004, 02:38 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting004
Get your facts straight before you post this crap. You obviously haven't seen more than 5 minutes of each game because if you had, you'd have noticed the Leafs were diving left and right in Game 6 as well. Nieuwendyk dove while Leafs were on the PP, which caused the 5 on 3, and in turn the Leafs only goal. There's a lot more...the worst being in OT when I believe Neil had his stick grabbed and he was slammed to the ice when he was nowhere near the puck.
Who dove where won't really affect my thoughts on this series much after tonight no matter which way it goes. It's just the main reason why I find it impossible to admire the Ottawa team despite their talent level, and don't see how anyone can like them. But that's just me.

It's annoying to see self-deception rear its ugly head. The Ottawa Senators led the league for the most Unsportsmanlike Conduct - Diving calls in the NHL with 8 along with Minnesota, and proceeded to add 3 more in Round 1 of the playoffs (so far) to take the #1 place in the league for the most diving calls.

The Leafs have been penalized for 1 Unsportsmanlike Conduct - Diving call in the regular season (Tucker) and zero in the playoffs.

It's fine to argue about talent, hitting, shooting, and goaltending all you want, but please don't argue that the Leafs dive anywhere near as much as the Senators. It just makes you look really, really, really silly.

Edit: And the guy below me is right, starting this thread was pretty silly too.


Last edited by Sil: 04-20-2004 at 03:50 PM.
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Old
04-20-2004, 03:44 PM
  #44
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Wow, this thread is a joke.

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Old
04-20-2004, 03:49 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sil
Who dove where won't really affect my thoughts on this series much after tonight no matter which way it goes. It's just the main reason why I find it impossible to admire the Ottawa team despite their talent level, and don't see how anyone can like them. But that's just me.

It's annoying to see self-deception rear its ugly head. The Ottawa Senators led the league for the most Unsportsmanlike Conduct - Diving calls in the NHL with 8 along with Minnesota, and proceeded to add 3 more in Round 1 of the playoffs (so far) to take the #1 place in the league for the most diving calls.

The Leafs have been penalized for 1 Unsportsmanlike Conduct - Diving call in the regular season (Tucker) and zero in the playoffs.

It's fine to argue about talent, hitting, shooting, and goaltending all you want, but please don't argue that the Leafs dive anywhere near as much as the Senators. It just makes you look really, really, really silly.
Spewing stats doesn't go anywhere either. Toronto, as they do every year, was near the top in total penalty minutes. Does that make them tough? Are the refs biased against them? Or, is it an indication of overall stupidity? The answer cannot be determined by looking at a number. What's the breakdown of cross-checking, charging and boarding calls in the NHL? Where do the Leafs fit in there?

Maybe if it were analyzed on a league wide perspective, it would be found that the quicker teams are more prone to be assessed "diving" penalties and the slower teams were the ones who get penalized with more obstruction, tripping and holding. The Leafs are not the quickest team out there and if they get out of position or are beaten by fleet-footed players, they have to commit a foul to prevent a scoring chance. The Senators are one of the fastest teams in the NHL and they are continually hooked and held whenever the opposition feels they will get beat. Maybe they do go down the odd time to provoke a well deserved reaction but maybe the refs should be blowing the friggin whistle in the first place. Who knows, maybe the refs don't give the Leafs diving penalties since they spend half the time in the box anyways? "Time for an even up call, let's put somebody in the box for a phantom infraction...they're not doing anything wrong so I'll call diving."

I witnessed Chara receiving one of those "diving" penalties this year. The call was predicated on the fact that Chara's so damn huge, he should not have gone down. Any other player would have, and he lost his balance so, it was a dive. And like all of those other calls, they gave the other player a penalty as well. It's either one or the other.

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Old
04-20-2004, 03:55 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by SumOfUs
Wow, this thread is a joke.


than why are you here

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Old
04-20-2004, 03:58 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odiedog
Spewing stats doesn't go anywhere either.
Ah, good ol' logical odiedog comes to the rescue. Yeah, when the stats you're debating are stacked 11 to 1 against the point you're trying to make I can see why you wouldn't want to lend them any credence. Anyhow, I'm not about to waste my time explaining to you why the world is round so carry on, you just look really dumb arguing the fact. But that's never stopped you before around here.

And yes, Occam's Razor applies here for the Toronto team too. The simplest explanation is the best explanation. The reason Toronto is the most penalized team is because their infractions warrant them the most penalties. Hello McFly, is anyone home??? Likewise, the reason Ottawa is the most penalized team for diving calls is because their infractions warrant them the most diving calls.

P.S. You'll notice I didn't say anything about Ottawa being cheap-shot artists because I don't think they're more renowned for that than your average team. But they sure dive above the norm. Give your head a shake.


Last edited by Sil: 04-20-2004 at 04:18 PM.
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Old
04-20-2004, 04:08 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Blueblood
Ummm, are we watching the same series?

Dirtiest play of the series: Knowing that his team is going to lose, Varada takes a run from near his own blueline and tries to snap Sundin's leg as he comes out from behind the net.


Domi has done some stupid things in the past, but he has some talent and works hard at developing an honest game. Varada has zero talent, I mean come on, he lost the handle on the puck on a breakaway. He has no business being in the league.
I am not a fan of either team but I've seen Domi deak himself out on a brakeaway. The Varada hit was not dirty from my point of view he was lining up Sndin who swerved out of the way at the last second thus the knees met.

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Old
04-20-2004, 05:31 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f.
thats how it was
phillips went after sundin's skates and not the puck.
it was sad
how much credibility shall we give to someone who gets all of his claims all wrong?

1. Phillips was not on the ice. Redden was.
2. Sundin never came close to the goal post. That was Tucker, in a totally different game.
3. The game was 2-1 for the Sens by then, not 1-0 for the Leafs, as you're trying to claim ("Sundin was trying to make it 2-0)
4. Sundin stepped on Redden's stick as Redden dove to try and bat the puck away from him. A play deserving of a penalty? Sure. An attempt to injure? You're out of your mind.

You're giving all of your fellow Leafs fans on this board a very bad name. What are you doing here anyway? Didn't you break your own leg jumping off the bandwagon after game 4? Go play in traffic.

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