HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Enforcer TOI

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-19-2008, 01:48 PM
  #1
Jaromir Jagr
New York Rangers Cup
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 6,263
vCash: 500
Enforcer TOI

Did a little test for Colton Orr vs Other Enforcers around the league for TOI.

Of course, this is brought to me because of Renney's extreme trust for his fourth line.

Colton Orr has played in all the Ranger's games to date: 61 GP.

Keep in mind that some enforcers may or may not have lost games due to injury, etc, I'm just basing it on pure playing time.

Orr
(NYR): 61 GP, 8:08 average TOI/G; 496:35 total minutes to date.

Belak (TOR): 28 GP, 4:02 average TOI/G; 113:12 total minutes to date.

Brashear (WSH): 59 GP, 7:42 average TOI/G; 455:13 total minutes to date.

Roy (TBL): 56 GP, 5:35 average TOI/G; 312:46 total minutes to date.

Laraque
(PIT): 51 GP, 7:58 average TOI/G; 406:50 total minutes to date.

Cote (PHI): 48 GP, 4:15 average TOI/G; 204:41 total minutes to date.

McGrattan (OTT): 34 GP, 2:54 average TOI/G; 99:08 total minutes to date.

Jackman
(NYI): 31 GP, 6:09 average TOI/G; 190:53 total minutes to date.

Rupp (NJD): 42 GP, 6:37 average TOI/G; 278:10 total minutes to date.

Peters (BUF): 37 GP, 2:53 average TOI/G; 107:03 total minutes to date.

Thornton
(BOS): 34 GP, 6:45 average TOI/G; 229:46 total minutes to date.

Boulton (ATL): 54 GP, 7:26 average TOI/G; 402:11 total minutes to date.

Please keep in mind that this is based on players that best fit the description for their teams, while they may not be enforcers in your eyes.

Also, please keep in mind that this is not a knock on Colton Orr, just an interesting analysis that says our coach over-uses him. In reality, Colton Orr's game has been knocked up quite a few notches and he has been really quite impressive.

No other enforcer (at least in the Eastern Conference, that's what I checked) has played in as many games as Orr, or has near his average TOI/G, except Laraque and Brashear (however, Laraque and Brashear are used more as a player than an enforcer over there now, and are relied upon in other situations as well).

Jaromir Jagr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 01:52 PM
  #2
LeftCoastRangersFan
Registered User
 
LeftCoastRangersFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 533
vCash: 500
Orr has picked up his game substantially (well, for him anyways) so I'm ok with his ice time (plus, see my avatar ). If someone steps up & takes some ice away from Colton, I'm ok withthat too.

LeftCoastRangersFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 01:54 PM
  #3
Carlos Ranger
Zucc-a-Rella
 
Carlos Ranger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 5,155
vCash: 67
Surprising, but not so much. Brash is the only one that comes close, and he's an alternate captain on the caps. Guess we should give Orr a letter..

Carlos Ranger is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:02 PM
  #4
BBKers
Registered User
 
BBKers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South Koster, Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 5,678
vCash: 500
Send a message via Skype™ to BBKers
Ever since the ugly debacle in Philly last year - Orr has been a regular

BBKers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:04 PM
  #5
Levitate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 20,514
vCash: 500
Less to do with Orr himself, I think, and more to do with coaches philosophies on how to use the 4th line. It seems to me that a lot of coaches just use it as an energy line that gets a few shifts here and there, while the Rangers use it as more of a checking/energy line. While other teams might use their 3rd line as a checking line, the Rangers rely on theirs to provide more offense and forechecking pressure.

So basically Renney wraps up the traditional roles of 3rd and 4th lines into one package

Levitate is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:22 PM
  #6
rickyrod
Registered User
 
rickyrod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: nyc
Country: United States
Posts: 1,294
vCash: 500
His -14 looks like a stinker on paper, but his line only has 5 goals on the season. Renney's faith is well-earned for Orr, in my opinion.

rickyrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:48 PM
  #7
Jackson Ranger
Registered User
 
Jackson Ranger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 2,571
vCash: 500
Two things surprise me. Laracque's total, i thought it would be more around 5 to 6 minutes/game.

Also, a Ranger draft choice has more minutes than I thought...Eric Boulton. He seems to have progressed to a point where he is seeing more minutes. I know the few Atlanta games I've seen this year, he looks like he can keep up with the flow of the game.

Jackson Ranger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:49 PM
  #8
vipernsx
Flatus Expeller
 
vipernsx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 6,518
vCash: 566
I've got no problem with his ice time so long as he's not giving up goals. Who does the opposition take out of their lineup to make sure they have the toughness that the Rangers are going to ice? Isn't that a nice thing to think about rather than who are the Rangers going to put on the ice so they don't get beat up? How many times have we seen top Ranger players getting run at this season? There has been no Fedoruk incidents or Shanahan Brashear fights this season. Nothing even remotely similar and that's because the Sheriff is watching and he gets a regular shift at your team!

vipernsx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:55 PM
  #9
squishy
Registered User
 
squishy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,149
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherapanov View Post
Also, please keep in mind that this is not a knock on Colton Orr, just an interesting analysis that says our coach over-uses him.
Alternately, it could say he's a better hockey player than the rest of them...

squishy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:57 PM
  #10
Jaromir Jagr
New York Rangers Cup
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 6,263
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by squishy View Post
Alternately, it could say he's a better hockey player than the rest of them...
It could, but he's not.

Laraque and Brashear play a better all around game and are better at fighting than Orr, at least right now.

The others, Orr is better than, all around.

Jaromir Jagr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:58 PM
  #11
NYROrtsFan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,931
vCash: 500
Orr is a better pure player than a few of those guys to be honest. Not so much with the puck, but he makes good decisions defensively and he can make plays with his stick defensively. He works hard too and very rarely allows the physical stuff to take precedence over the Rangers team goals. Although Brash and Laraque are both better with the puck, I'd take Orr defensively any day, especially over Brash.

NYROrtsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 02:59 PM
  #12
chosen
Registered User
 
chosen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,624
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
I've got no problem with his ice time so long as he's not giving up goals. Who does the opposition take out of their lineup to make sure they have the toughness that the Rangers are going to ice? Isn't that a nice thing to think about rather than who are the Rangers going to put on the ice so they don't get beat up? How many times have we seen top Ranger players getting run at this season? There has been no Fedoruk incidents or Shanahan Brashear fights this season. Nothing even remotely similar and that's because the Sheriff is watching and he gets a regular shift at your team!
I've seen Jagr run on a fairly regular basis. This notion that other teams won't run Rangers because Orr is here is like the logic of:

A serial killer drank milk as a child. Therefore, milk contributed to his becoming a serial killer.

chosen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 03:00 PM
  #13
NYROrtsFan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,931
vCash: 500
Disagree...

We seen the definition of a team getting run last year against Philly.

The team has never been run like that again, and it is because Orr is in the lineup.

NYROrtsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 03:08 PM
  #14
TomLaidlaw
Registered User
 
TomLaidlaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Transylvania
Country: Romania
Posts: 3,177
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
Less to do with Orr himself, I think, and more to do with coaches philosophies on how to use the 4th line. It seems to me that a lot of coaches just use it as an energy line that gets a few shifts here and there, while the Rangers use it as more of a checking/energy line. While other teams might use their 3rd line as a checking line, the Rangers rely on theirs to provide more offense and forechecking pressure.

So basically Renney wraps up the traditional roles of 3rd and 4th lines into one package
Exactly.

In a way it is a testament to Orr's self control. Many enforcers can't be trusted with a regular shift throughout a game. So they are usually relegated to 3-5 minutes a night when the coach taps them on the shoulder to go do something. Orr fights for a purpose. Wheter it is to defend a teammate, swing the momentum in the rangers favor or send a message that the rangers aren't gonna be pushed around. I can't remember him having a selfish fight. (by selfish fight I mean fighting someone when the rangers have the momentum and the lead). Some may say that renney has a leash on Orr, that may be partially true but I also think Orr understands when he needs to do what he does. If someone would have told me 2 years ago when we claimed Orr off waivers that he would lead all enforcers in TOI I would have said you were nuts.

TomLaidlaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 03:29 PM
  #15
BBKers
Registered User
 
BBKers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South Koster, Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 5,678
vCash: 500
Send a message via Skype™ to BBKers
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
Exactly.

If someone would have told me 2 years ago when we claimed Orr off waivers that he would lead all enforcers in TOI I would have said you were nuts.
I believe only the Eastern Conference goons are included - but still...

BBKers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 03:49 PM
  #16
Merlin401
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 357
vCash: 500
Also from the East:

W. Brookbank: gets very little ice time 3/4 minutes

Here's the Western Enforcers:

Koci (18 games): 3:38
Boogaard (25): 3:44
Parker (17): 4:05
Downey (40): 4:22
Hordichuk (31): 4:49
Shelley (39): 4:50 (but playing 8/9 with SJ it seems)
Godard (51): 4:59
King (43): 5:21
Parros (54): 5:55
Barch (35): 6:30
Ivanans (54): 7:27
Stortini (45): 7:45
Fedoruk (46): 9:57 (only pure enforcer who beats Orr in TOI)

Not really enforcers but kinda: Cowan, Brad May, Winchester, Matt Walker

Merlin401 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2008, 04:27 PM
  #17
TheSchwab
Registered User
 
TheSchwab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 2,080
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to TheSchwab
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin401 View Post
Also from the East:

W. Brookbank: gets very little ice time 3/4 minutes

Here's the Western Enforcers:

Koci (18 games): 3:38
Boogaard (25): 3:44
Parker (17): 4:05
Downey (40): 4:22
Hordichuk (31): 4:49
Shelley (39): 4:50 (but playing 8/9 with SJ it seems)
Godard (51): 4:59
King (43): 5:21
Parros (54): 5:55
Barch (35): 6:30
Ivanans (54): 7:27
Stortini (45): 7:45
Fedoruk (46): 9:57 (only pure enforcer who beats Orr in TOI)

Not really enforcers but kinda: Cowan, Brad May, Winchester, Matt Walker
I was just about to ask about the west, nice.

And LOL @ Peters and Mcgratton, worthless. I would say Neil is Ottawa's tough guy though.

TheSchwab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2008, 04:58 PM
  #18
Jaromir Jagr
New York Rangers Cup
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 6,263
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSchwab View Post
I was just about to ask about the west, nice.

And LOL @ Peters and Mcgratton, worthless. I would say Neil is Ottawa's tough guy though.
McGrattan is the heavyweight over there, I guess Neil could fit into that too but as for fighting I think McGrattan is superior to Neil.

Jaromir Jagr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2008, 06:22 PM
  #19
nyr7andcounting
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,919
vCash: 500
I don't mind it too much. Even considering that Orr is a college level skater and has absolutely no ability to make a play with the puck, he hasn't really been that bad. He's better defensively that most goons probably are and he's also probably more discipline, or at least it seems so to me.

Plus as someone said, his ice time is a result of Renney using our 4th line in a checking role. I don't mind that and although we need a little more talent on the 4th line for it to be effective, the guy I would dump for an upgrade is Hollweg not Orr.

nyr7andcounting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2008, 07:24 PM
  #20
Blueshirt Brawler
Registered User
 
Blueshirt Brawler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Yonkers, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 607
vCash: 500
The fourth line is definitely on the ice too much considering that Orr and Hollweg don't kill penalties or play on the PP. If you figure that the average PIM combined for both teams is about 16-18 minutes a game that would leave about 42 minutes to be played at even strength.

So with 8 min of TOI out of 42 min of even strength time (19%) that means that Orr is on the ice nearly once every 5 shifts. I guess that doesn't sound all that bad but when you have scored only 5 goals combined in 61 games it does seem like it may be too much.

Blueshirt Brawler is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:41 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.