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Who's better

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Old
04-20-2004, 01:23 PM
  #1
West
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Who's better

I've been looking at the mock draft board and I just wanted to see what people thought about the following comparisons ...

Schremp(04) vs. O'Sullivan(03) for me O'Sullivan wins this easily.

Barker vs. Thelen I've seen Barker enough that I worry about his defensive game and pick Thelen based mostly on what I've heard.

Bolland vs. Adam Berti both are great skaters but I'm picking Berti based on the fact that once he fills in his game will noticably improve(like his game as is but I expect major improvement).

Ladd vs Malkin After the under 18's Malkin strike me as a little better than Chipchura and I think Ladd is much better than Chipchura so I say Ladd wins this.
p.s. I've barely seen any of Malkin but watched Ladd a couple of times and realize this is a kind of thin basis for a pick I'm just surprized that no one has Ladd over Malkin.

Anyways realize that most people won't agree with these but if you have anything more constructive than Your dead wrong because I say so (or scouts who yes I realize do this professional) I'd like to hear it.

Thanks

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Old
04-20-2004, 01:40 PM
  #2
montreal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by West
I've been looking at the mock draft board and I just wanted to see what people thought about the following comparisons ...

Schremp(04) vs. O'Sullivan(03) for me O'Sullivan wins this easily.

Barker vs. Thelen I've seen Barker enough that I worry about his defensive game and pick Thelen based mostly on what I've heard.

Bolland vs. Adam Berti both are great skaters but I'm picking Berti based on the fact that once he fills in his game will noticably improve(like his game as is but I expect major improvement).

Ladd vs Malkin After the under 18's Malkin strike me as a little better than Chipchura and I think Ladd is much better than Chipchura so I say Ladd wins this.
p.s. I've barely seen any of Malkin but watched Ladd a couple of times and realize this is a kind of thin basis for a pick I'm just surprized that no one has Ladd over Malkin.

Anyways realize that most people won't agree with these but if you have anything more constructive than Your dead wrong because I say so (or scouts who yes I realize do this professional) I'd like to hear it.

Thanks

I don't think O'Sullivan is that far ahead of Schremp. As both are highly skilled and have a lot of offensive upside. I'd be happy to have either player.

Barker vs Thelen, I haven't seen too much of Barker (only 2 games) but I have seen Thelen several times this year, and imo he's the top prospect in the NCAA this year. tough call over Barker, again I'd taken either in a heartbeat. Both should be fine players down the road, but if I had to chose, I'd go with Thelen as I've seen more of him and was impressed every time I saw him.

Bolland vs Berti, is tough cause of the size difference. Bolland isn't very big but he can play. Berti I've seen less of, but his size and strength are approaching NHL level already. Bolland seems like such a great all round player, though so it would be hard to chose. I'd go with Bolland only cause I've seen him more and he seems like a very safe pick compared to Berti who's had some injury troubles in the past.

Ladd vs Malkin is a tough based on that i've only seen them 1 time each. I saw Malkin and his team beat CSKA 8-2. Malkin had an assist, but for a rookie he didn't look out of place. Ladd I only saw in the prosects game (unless he played in the remax games I don't remember off hand) but I would take Malkin for sure, although I'd like to see more of Ladd.

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Old
04-20-2004, 02:03 PM
  #3
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Bolland has a scorer's hands, Berti doesn't.

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Old
04-20-2004, 02:53 PM
  #4
rnyquist
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Quote:
Originally Posted by West
I've been looking at the mock draft board and I just wanted to see what people thought about the following comparisons ...

Schremp(04) vs. O'Sullivan(03) for me O'Sullivan wins this easily.

Barker vs. Thelen I've seen Barker enough that I worry about his defensive game and pick Thelen based mostly on what I've heard.

Bolland vs. Adam Berti both are great skaters but I'm picking Berti based on the fact that once he fills in his game will noticably improve(like his game as is but I expect major improvement).

Ladd vs Malkin After the under 18's Malkin strike me as a little better than Chipchura and I think Ladd is much better than Chipchura so I say Ladd wins this.
p.s. I've barely seen any of Malkin but watched Ladd a couple of times and realize this is a kind of thin basis for a pick I'm just surprized that no one has Ladd over Malkin.

Anyways realize that most people won't agree with these but if you have anything more constructive than Your dead wrong because I say so (or scouts who yes I realize do this professional) I'd like to hear it.

Thanks

alright, I don't want to be rude but it seems like your passing your decisions on 1 or 2 games. Unfair, its kind of like watching Tie Domi score a goal in the one game you watch and assuming he's a 50+ goal scorer type thing, ya know?


As for your comparisons

Schremp vs. O'sullivan. Basically look at it like this: Schremp, all world skills, more skills than even Ovechkin (not overall game, but raw skills). O'sullivan is immensly skilled but he's not up there with Schremp, sorry. Also O'sullivan had a troubled past and many are worried about his mental health, regardless of whether it should be relevant or not in your opinion, it is massive cause for concern, especially with the latest on Danton

Barker vs. Thelen- The odd thing here is that you might be the only one to say Thelen over Barker. Yes Barker has defencive zone work to do, but he's not that bad, and his overall game is above Thelen's. There is a reason why Barker is in everyones top 4 and Thelen not in some people's top 8. Not saying Thelen is bad, but Barkers easily the best defencemen in the draft, bar none.

Malkin vs. Ladd- Before i even start, i'm not a ladd fan, so i will try and be as non-biased as possible; but frankly Ladd doesn't compare to Malkin. Ladd plays bigger but skill wise, no comparison. Malkin has outshined almost everyone in the draft, even Ovechkin at times, while a step down from Ovechkin he's a big step up from CHipchura and Ladd, bar none. Many talk of Chipchura falling into the bottom 15, no one talks of Malkin making it out of the top 3. Malkin is a bull on the ice, he scores he's agressive and would easily go first overall if Ovechkin wasn't around. He's much more NHL ready than Ladd and his skills are refined. Not to mention his on ice play is outstanding.


Didn't want to bash you, but i think you need to talk to more people and watch more games before you go out and make, dare i say, [odd] statements such as those

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Old
04-20-2004, 03:38 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rnyquist
alright, I don't want to be rude but it seems like your passing your decisions on 1 or 2 games. Unfair, its kind of like watching Tie Domi score a goal in the one game you watch and assuming he's a 50+ goal scorer type thing, ya know?
I get to see the OHL a fair bit live, the WHL by statelite and as for Malkin and Thelen I've been pretty up front about how much I've seen and why I made the pick.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnyquist
Schremp vs. O'sullivan. Basically look at it like this: Schremp, all world skills, more skills than even Ovechkin (not overall game, but raw skills). O'sullivan is immensly skilled but he's not up there with Schremp, sorry. Also O'sullivan had a troubled past and many are worried about his mental health, regardless of whether it should be relevant or not in your opinion, it is massive cause for concern, especially with the latest on Danton
I guess that I should mention that I don't think much of Scremp based on what I've seen of his regular season play although I could see how people who just watched him in the top prospects game could be way higher on him. I think that his defensive play is weaker than O'Sullivans (which is passable) and that compared to last year he improved very little if at all (which for me is a kiss of death to a prospect).

Also after digging to find his results for the Prospects skill contest showed that he was agile and quick but lacking in top speed which (pretty much my opinion of him before but some players surprise you). I think this will seriously hurt him at higher levels (although O'Sullivan has similar issues). Mostly why I pick O'Sullivan over Schremp is that O'Sullivan is a difference maker on the ice and I didn't think Schremp was in London (granted that London is a much better team).

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnyquist
Barker vs. Thelen- The odd thing here is that you might be the only one to say Thelen over Barker. Yes Barker has defencive zone work to do, but he's not that bad, and his overall game is above Thelen's. There is a reason why Barker is in everyones top 4 and Thelen not in some people's top 8. Not saying Thelen is bad, but Barkers easily the best defencemen in the draft, bar none.
Not trying to bash Barker here but I've heard some very good things about Thelen and just looking at stat's he's done some really impressive things this year. I take Thelen mainly based on what people say about his play without the puck, but I've also heard lots of glowing reports of Barkers defensive play (which while fixable) I just don't see. I expect that they will be very close in the final CSS and see both of them going in the top ten.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnyquist
Malkin vs. Ladd- Before i even start, i'm not a ladd fan, so i will try and be as non-biased as possible; but frankly Ladd doesn't compare to Malkin. Ladd plays bigger but skill wise, no comparison. Malkin has outshined almost everyone in the draft, even Ovechkin at times, while a step down from Ovechkin he's a big step up from CHipchura and Ladd, bar none. Many talk of Chipchura falling into the bottom 15, no one talks of Malkin making it out of the top 3. Malkin is a bull on the ice, he scores he's agressive and would easily go first overall if Ovechkin wasn't around. He's much more NHL ready than Ladd and his skills are refined. Not to mention his on ice play is outstanding.
I suspect that people are just seeing the tip of the iceberg with both of these players and expect to see Ladd rated no. 1 in the final CSS NA list. Ladd seems to do everything under the radar sort of way and I made this comparison more because I don't think Ladd gets enough respect than because I think Malkin is a bad pick. Ladd is a very smart player who always seems to make the right play and be in the right spot. Time will tell but I expect anyone who picks Ladd outside the top five will be very pleased in a few years.

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Old
04-20-2004, 04:24 PM
  #6
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Schremp is a little better rounded IMO
Barker!
Berti, I'm a little biased, fav player in this years draft
Ladd over Malkin, Chipchura over both!

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Old
04-21-2004, 05:19 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent_TheGreat
Schremp is a little better rounded IMO
Barker!
Berti, I'm a little biased, fav player in this years draft
Ladd over Malkin, Chipchura over both!

U'd take Ladd over Malkin?
I hope u're joking.

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Old
04-21-2004, 05:31 PM
  #8
Jacob
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Vincent is a novelty poster with his Canadian bias.

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Old
04-21-2004, 05:49 PM
  #9
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Wow, I'm surprised by the people who think Ladd is better than Malkin. Some people need to see some games from the RSL.

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Old
04-21-2004, 05:58 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. kØUkLØs
U'd take Ladd over Malkin?
I hope u're joking.
Well, Malkin is and will be the better player, but since this is a personal opinion, I'd rather have the bigger physical forward. You ask me in a month I might be saying Malkin, I still need to learn more about him I guess. Chipchura is just a fav of mine, I threw that in for a joke, nobody has bit one it yet though.

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Old
04-21-2004, 06:35 PM
  #11
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Originally Posted by Jacobv2
Vincent is a novelty poster with his Canadian bias.
Wow, I never even realized it until now.


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Old
04-21-2004, 06:40 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrKnowNothing
Wow, I never even realized it until now.

I wouldn't say I have a Canadian bias, maybe a NA bias, but I try to be more objective, but I base players on how I like the style and skill sets, I'm not a scout and frankly don't try to be.

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Old
04-21-2004, 08:18 PM
  #13
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Malkin is better than Ladd.

I agree wholeheartedly with the post by montreal. Every one of these guys has great upside, but Barker, Schremp, and Malkin are better than their counterparts on this list.

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Old
04-22-2004, 11:32 AM
  #14
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Also after digging to find his results for the Prospects skill contest showed that he was agile and quick but lacking in top speed which (pretty much my opinion of him before but some players surprise you). I think this will seriously hurt him at higher levels (although O'Sullivan has similar issues).

Uhmm.....what? Have you seen O'Sullivan?????

O'sullivan is immensly skilled but he's not up there with Schremp, sorry.

Again....have you SEEN this guy play? Why do you think Schremp left Mississauga anyway??? Geez.....even Robbie knew he couldn't compete....

Also O'sullivan had a troubled past and many are worried about his mental health, regardless of whether it should be relevant or not in your opinion, it is massive cause for concern, especially with the latest on Danton

:mad: That just pissed me off. How dare you mutter about O'Sullivan's past by comparing it in any way to Danton's situation???

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Old
04-22-2004, 12:24 PM
  #15
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Schremp vs. O'Sullivan
Barker vs. Thelen
Bolland vs. Adam Berti
Ladd vs Malkin

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Old
04-22-2004, 01:26 PM
  #16
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I like both but i would take Schremp over O'Sullivan every day of the week.

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