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Old
04-22-2004, 10:35 AM
  #1
Donnie Marcotte Fan
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First off I want to say that next year is another year, and I hope the Bruins provide me with as much excitement in 2004-05 as they did this year. Since the late 50's I have never stopped being amazed at the Bruins penchant for coming up with new ways to break my heart, it appears their capacity is unlimited, and after leading the series 3-1, I have to say this one is one of the better ones. Oh well, on an excellent Web Page devoted to each and every player who has ever suited up for the Bruins there is a quote. It says:

"It takes neither courage nor intelligence to cheer for a team only when that team wins. The true test of a fan's mettle is the same as it is for a player: Were you there when you were needed?"

I firmly believe that, and despite my disappointment at the Bruins final game of the season, every season since 1972, I was very proud the day after the Game 7 loss to proudly wear my Bruins colors, and my heart on my sleeve. When it comes to the Bruins I am as big a sheep as there is, and I will proudly remain so, win or lose.

I had meant to send this to KDP privately, but his mailbox is full, so here it is. I'm not usually given to nit picking, and no doubt my disappointment at recent events colors part of this post, but here it is. I am especially disappointed in the underlying theme of Team Captaincy since very recently a Team Captain gave up on his team to follow personal goals, and that didn't seem to ruffle a single feather in Boston from the Fifth Estate, nor most fans for that matter. This latest furor only serves to re-enforce my believe that the Boston media, in the words of the late Spiro Agnew remain, *the nattering nabobs of negativism*

The ONLY thing that bothers me about the entire series is that no one in the Bruins orgination higher than Mike Sullivan seemed to come Joe's defence when the chips were down. I'm as a big a fan of Harry Sinden as there is, but on this matter I say, *Shame on you Harry Sinden.*


My first language is French, so take this with the number of grains of salt you feel it deserves. While I disagree with your premise, and I appreciate you are in the HoF as a writer, I have a couple of points, and please bear in mind my first language is French.

Very Unique. - no such thing. Something is either unique, or it's not unique, but nothing is *very unique* ( The clever among you will note that I am being redundant as well )

I think it's always dangerous to speak for anyone other than oneself, but when I think of the Bruins, Joe Thornton isn't the first thing/person, I think of, and I would hope it's not the first thing any Bruin fan thinks of. I think of the Bruins, an entity unto themselves. As such Joe Thornton is no important than Ian Moran is. They are all Bruins.

In the forward of Gerry Cheevers' book, Trent Frayne talked about how Cheevers insisted that Eddie Johnson not be blamed for the short comings and failure of the team in Game 2 in 1971. Central to the team concept of hockey is that you win as a team, you lose as a team. Joe Thornton is just a part of the team. Pretty harsh for you to lay the blame at his feet, especially when a former Captain asked out of Boston to follow personal goals, and that got not a single negative comment from you, or any other writer in Boston. Finally, if as you say Joe is the face of the Bruins:

> The captain is
> the face of the franchise. Here in Boston, as in many cities, the team asks
> a lot of the captain. In Joe's case, he is the center of their marketing
> campaign.

Then it is the franchise which has the responsibility of taking him to task and removing the captaincy.


Last edited by Donnie Marcotte Fan: 04-22-2004 at 01:13 PM.
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Old
04-22-2004, 11:44 AM
  #2
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Bravo!

Outstanding. Just outstanding.

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04-22-2004, 12:53 PM
  #3
JOHNNY V
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Donnie outstanding post

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Old
04-22-2004, 12:58 PM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stock Rocks
Bravo!

Outstanding. Just outstanding.
Thanks Stock Rocks. I have a small favour I'd like to ask if you don't mind. A few years ago I wrote an open letter to the Globe, which they declined to publish, no doubt it wasn't an outstanding example of writing, but be that as it may, I'd like your opinion on it. If you were to send me a private message with an email address where I can write you, I'd like to send it to you and get your opinion on it.

Thanks

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04-22-2004, 01:05 PM
  #5
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You've got mail

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Old
04-22-2004, 01:06 PM
  #6
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DM Fan: I disagree that Bourque's departure from Boston constitutes "giving up on a team to pursure personal goals". So in that instance, I see no reason for KPD or any member of the media to criticize him for this. The fact is that Bourque's allegiance to the franchise only goes as far as the franchise's to him. The Bruins never dedicated themselves to winning a Cup with him on board for twenty years, so why, just because he's a captain, can he not pursue personal goals when the owner and powers that be put their own personal goals (money) ahead of his and his teammates? Frankly I think Ray Bourque did more for his teammates and the future of this franchise by leaving than he would have by staying. His departure brought to light just how egregious the actions of management have been over the years. In hindsight, I view his departure as a very captain-like manuever, and his teammates uniformly supported him. You might argue that the media could have criticized him for bailing on fans, which would be a stretch, but he certainly did not bail on his teammates.

As a total aside, I think it's highly possible that Joe would LOVE to give up the "C", as KPD suggests. I'd contend he never really wanted it....but instead it was forced upon him. So with that in mind, perhaps KPD should have called on MOC to strip it rather than for Joe to give it up.

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04-22-2004, 01:21 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bp13
DM Fan: I disagree that Bourque's departure from Boston The Bruins never dedicated themselves to winning a Cup with him on board for twenty years, so why, just because he's a captain, .
Hi bp. That's a personal opinion, and I don't begrudge you for holding it. I certainly don't want to get into a discussion about something that is in the past. In short all writers on the sport of hockey have forgotten what it is to be a Team Captain, and the mere fact you start a season in the NHL is a *chance at the Stanley Cup* Certaintly this instance is hardly the first time it has happened, Gretzky did the same thing, and he wasn't the first, but it is a relatively new thing. Certainly when the Bruins were elimanted from the playoff hunt by American Thanksgiving, like they were for most of Johnny Bucyk's time as Captain, had he asked out, he would have been vilified by the hockey writers of the day. No less a player than Bobby Orr was vilified by Fran Rosa for asking too much money at one time. Things change for some people. I'm sure Stockrocks shares your views, I'm sure 99.9% percent of hockey fans do as well. That doesn't change the fact that a well written article/letter/essay, pointing out things other owners desires might change your mind. It probably wouldn't, but Stockrocks might have a different view. I bet when he reads the letter the Globe refused to publish he will admit that it at least gave him pause to think about his position.

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04-22-2004, 06:03 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donnie Marcotte Fan
Oh well, on an excellent Web Page devoted to each and every player who has ever suited up for the Bruins there is a quote. It says:

"It takes neither courage nor intelligence to cheer for a team only when that team wins. The true test of a fan's mettle is the same as it is for a player: Were you there when you were needed?"
You know, the guy who coined that phrase- Ian Wilson- taught me more about what it means to be a Bruins fan than anyone else I have ever encountered.

I am honored to call him my friend.

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04-22-2004, 06:06 PM
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Gee Wally
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirk- NEHJ

You know, the guy who coined that phrase- Ian Wilson-
Yup... the "kid" has potential...


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BOSTON STRONG !!!
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04-22-2004, 06:18 PM
  #10
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"It takes neither courage nor intelligence to cheer for a team only when that team wins. The true test of a fan's mettle is the same as it is for a player: Were you there when you were needed?"
--------------------------------------

i haven't been able to post or even really visit here since the loss. i want to thank DMF (and others) for picking me up and dusting me off - head held as a high as possible. this site, time and time again amazes me - its the brother (symbolic) that i never had.

while every idle momment flashes the hollow look on glen wesley's face and DC's jaw dropped by the too many men penalty - the ribero smirk tops them all.

anyway, thanks again DMF for the post

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Old
04-22-2004, 06:31 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirk- NEHJ
You know, the guy who coined that phrase- Ian Wilson- taught me more about what it means to be a Bruins fan than anyone else I have ever encountered.

I am honored to call him my friend.
I'm sure who ever he is, he is honored to count you among his friends as well. I bet if you asked this fellow he'd tell you that he didn't mean to lump you in with *all hockey writers* when he mentioned they have all forgotten what it means to be a Team Captain.

I also visit that page quite often, and I have to say Kirk that the quality of player profiles have picked up a lot since you joined Ian and Jim in their efforts on The Bruins Legends Page.

I also wanted to pick up on a point bp13 made about Joe wanting the Captaincy. I have no really idea if he does, or doesn't, but I do think the idea of being a team Captain has changed a lot in recent years. It seems to me that most of the time in today's game the team's best player gets named Captain. That isn't to say a team's best player isn't a leader, but one doesn't necessarily follow the other. When it comes to Bruin Captains I always thought Taz was a great example, and I tell you why. If I'm sitting on the bench and I'm watching Ray Bourque, what can I do? I can't play like Ray could. On the other hand if I'm watching Terry O'Reilly, and I am in the NHL I almost certainly can skate better, stick handle better, shot better. What I probably can't do is something intangible. But at least I can try and do what Terry did. If I tried to do what Ray did, it would be harmful to the Bruins because I couldn't do it. It's certainly changed since the days when a guy like Terry Ruskowski captained every team he played on, and today's game where likely as not the Captain is the team's best player. Is that an improvment? I don't think so, but it might explain why a team Captain can ask to be traded today, and virtually nothing is said about it.

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04-22-2004, 06:44 PM
  #12
sarge88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donnie Marcotte Fan
I'm sure who ever he is, he is honored to count you among his friends as well. I bet if you asked this fellow he'd tell you that he didn't mean to lump you in with *all hockey writers* when he mentioned they have all forgotten what it means to be a Team Captain.

I also visit that page quite often, and I have to say Kirk that the quality of player profiles have picked up a lot since you joined Ian and Jim in their efforts on The Bruins Legends Page.

I also wanted to pick up on a point bp13 made about Joe wanting the Captaincy. I have no really idea if he does, or doesn't, but I do think the idea of being a team Captain has changed a lot in recent years. It seems to me that most of the time in today's game the team's best player gets named Captain. That isn't to say a team's best player isn't a leader, but one doesn't necessarily follow the other. When it comes to Bruin Captains I always thought Taz was a great example, and I tell you why. If I'm sitting on the bench and I'm watching Ray Bourque, what can I do? I can't play like Ray could. On the other hand if I'm watching Terry O'Reilly, and I am in the NHL I almost certainly can skate better, stick handle better, shot better. What I probably can't do is something intangible. But at least I can try and do what Terry did. If I tried to do what Ray did, it would be harmful to the Bruins because I couldn't do it. It's certainly changed since the days when a guy like Terry Ruskowski captained every team he played on, and today's game where likely as not the Captain is the team's best player. Is that an improvment? I don't think so, but it might explain why a team Captain can ask to be traded today, and virtually nothing is said about it.

Amazing point that is overlooked today. I just think back to some captains from years past that weren't close to being the best player on their teams.

Gerard Gallant - Det.
Ruskowski - As you mentioned.
Paul Reinhart - I believe was captain of the Canucks at one time.
Bruce Driver - Again, I think he was captain of the Devils.

I'm sure that you old timers can come up with some others - Maybe Maloney in New York? Rod Buskas?

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Old
04-22-2004, 06:53 PM
  #13
Tim O'Reilly
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Great post Don!

Your as good a poster as Marcotte was a player - and for those that never saw him play Don Marcotte was as hard working and honest as any player that ever wore the spoked B.


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Old
04-22-2004, 07:18 PM
  #14
Donnie Marcotte Fan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarge88
Amazing point that is overlooked today. I just think back to some captains from years past that weren't close to being the best player on their teams.

Gerard Gallant - Det.
Ruskowski - As you mentioned.
Paul Reinhart - I believe was captain of the Canucks at one time.
Bruce Driver - Again, I think he was captain of the Devils.

I'm sure that you old timers can come up with some others - Maybe Maloney in New York? Rod Buskas?
Hi Sarge,

Off the top of my head, and since you mentioned Gerard Gallant, Alex Delvecchio was Captain in Detroit while Gordie Howe was still the best player in the game.

Pat Stapleton in Chicago when Hull and Mikita were in their primes

George Armstrong in Toronto

Along with Dave Maloney the Rangers had Camille Henry and Bob Nevin as Captains when Jean Ratelle and Rod Gilbert were in their primes.

Team Captains is kind of my pet peeve. The Bruins should be ashamed of themselves for not correcting a major mistake in their historical record. Jack Crawford was never Captain of the Bruins, and they refuse to acknowledge that Bobby Bauer was a team Captain. Certainly when Bauer was Captain, the best player on the team was Milt Schmidt, but generally speaking having the teams best players as Captain is a fairly new thing.

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