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How To Lose Belly Fat

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Old
03-07-2008, 01:05 PM
  #151
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Originally Posted by nni View Post
15 minute intervals, not 15 minute total workout.



Please shut up. You have no idea what you are talking about. If someone did HIIT for longer than 15 minutes I'd hand them a medal, tell them they weren't trying hard enough and then try to resuscitate them because they'd be dead.

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03-07-2008, 01:06 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by nni View Post
15 minute intervals, not 15 minute total workout.

as for burning off muscle, this is all dependant on your diet and pre workout nutrition.
If you add in the warmup and cool down it's 25 minutes, still not one hour. If you are truly exerting 100% there's no way you could continue on for an hour. After 10 - 15 minutes of doing just that you'll be shot. Even the moderate effort you put in between intervals becomes hard by the end of your workout.

They also say do 15-20 second intervals whereas the other says to do 60 seconds. You have to be in damn good shape to do a 60 second interval of 100% effort.

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03-07-2008, 01:10 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post


Please shut up. You have no idea what you are talking about. If someone did HIIT for longer than 15 minutes I'd hand them a medal, tell them they weren't trying hard enough and then try to resuscitate them because they'd be dead.
if anything you have proven that you are close minded as can be, please try not to get mad when someone differs in opinion from you. continue reading oyur workout magazines and preaching the gospel.

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If you add in the warmup and cool down it's 25 minutes, still not one hour. If you are truly exerting 100% there's no way you could continue on for an hour. After 10 - 15 minutes of doing just that you'll be shot.

They also say do 15-20 second intervals whereas the other says to do 60 seconds. You have to be in damn good shape to do a 60 second interval of 100% effort.
to be honest i am approaching this as more of a cycle type approach where you would do it for a period and then stop. so yes, if you wanted to do HIIT consistenyl week in and week out, i can get behind 15 minute sessions. i would recommend 30-45 minutes 2-3 times a week for 3-4 weeks, then 4 weeks of regular cardio and rotate. but yes, i agree with you if this is a constant. as for 60 seconds 100% effort, obviously your 100% will degrade, but it is very doable and very effective.

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03-07-2008, 01:17 PM
  #154
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if anything you have proven that you are close minded as can be, please try not to get mad when someone differs in opinion from you. continue reading oyur workout magazines and preaching the gospel.
And you're running your mouth about something you know exactly the sum total of 0 about. Because you're ignoring the ENTIRE science behind HIIT in the first place.

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to be honest i am approaching this as more of a cycle type approach where you would do it for a period and then stop. so yes, if you wanted to do HIIT consistenyl week in and week out, i can get behind 15 minute sessions. i would recommend 30-45 minutes 2-3 times a week for 3-4 weeks, then 4 weeks of regular cardio and rotate. but yes, i agree with you if this is a constant. as for 60 seconds 100% effort, obviously your 100% will degrade, but it is very doable and very effective.
Really, are you just talking to sound smart? The whole point of HIIT is to keep sessions under 20 minutes at most. Anything over that and your body becomes extremely distressed and it negates the benefits of doing HIIT in the first place. "Do it for a period and stop" Why, if you are doing cardio to boost your VO2max, would you do this and then stop, just to lose all your progress? You can't physically do HIIT for more than 20 minutes. If you do, you are cheating and not giving 100%. It is not "very doable" as it would place a ton of strain on the average persons heart. It's excessive, it's pointless, it's a waste of time and lastly; it's dangerous.

Just because some schmuck posts an article with his (stupid) take on HIIT does not make it the holy divine truth. Every single respectable trainer and scientist who has put this to the test has agreed on the 15-20 minute max range. You do not need 15 minutes of warmup, 5 is plenty. Same for cool down. And you will find precious few people who can go full tilt 100% for 60 seconds. Not even professional hockey players can manage that.

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03-07-2008, 01:29 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
And you're running your mouth about something you know exactly the sum total of 0 about. Because you're ignoring the ENTIRE science behind HIIT in the first place.



Really, are you just talking to sound smart? The whole point of HIIT is to keep sessions under 20 minutes at most. Anything over that and your body becomes extremely distressed and it negates the benefits of doing HIIT in the first place. "Do it for a period and stop" Why, if you are doing cardio to boost your VO2max, would you do this and then stop, just to lose all your progress? You can't physically do HIIT for more than 20 minutes. If you do, you are cheating and not giving 100%. It is not "very doable" as it would place a ton of strain on the average persons heart. It's excessive, it's pointless, it's a waste of time and lastly; it's dangerous.

Just because some schmuck posts an article with his (stupid) take on HIIT does not make it the holy divine truth. Every single respectable trainer and scientist who has put this to the test has agreed on the 15-20 minute max range. You do not need 15 minutes of warmup, 5 is plenty. Same for cool down. And you will find precious few people who can go full tilt 100% for 60 seconds. Not even professional hockey players can manage that.

id give you more credit if you sounded like you knew what you are talking about. you dont lose your gains if you continue working out, changing workout routines including cardio is necessary to prevent your body from adapting. alos considering how intensive HIIT is on the body is is wise to not make it a permanent fixture. doing a month of intense HIIT and the cycling off for a month is very effective. now this doesnt mean you do nothing for a month, you go back to standard cardio.

go 100% for 60 seconds, it is not impossible i used to do it regularly when i did HIIT.

seriously, try not to be such an ass, i have no issue having conversations with people about training, diet, supplements, but i do have issue with people who make it personal. you are not 100% right, there are many different ways to get desired results, its funny that you cant see that.

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03-07-2008, 01:38 PM
  #156
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id give you more credit if you sounded like you knew what you are talking about. you dont lose your gains if you continue working out,
You do. If you say, worked out for 3 hours in the gym with weights, you'd gain next to nothing and probably lose weight (muscle) because your body had been in a catabolic state for so long.

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changing workout routines including cardio is necessary to prevent your body from adapting.
Your body can't adapt to HIIT by design because you are always constantly changing the intensity of the workout and taking it to another level. After 4 weeks, your 100% effort is going to be way faster than that of when you first started.

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alos considering how intensive HIIT is on the body is is wise to not make it a permanent fixture.
Prove it. Show me evidence that says HIIT is even remotely dangerous. Again, due it its design, the total time spent working out isn't anywhere near enough to harm you unless you have heart problems. Most guys who workout only do it during their cutting cycles because it's too damn effective when it comes to the bulking cycle. But there is no danger in doing it constantly.

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Originally Posted by nni View Post
doing a month of intense HIIT and the cycling off for a month is very effective.
Very effective at dropping your VO2max and losing everything you worked for. Sorry, but walking or jogging will not bring up your max like HIIT. That is why professional athletes use it.

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now this doesnt mean you do nothing for a month, you go back to standard cardio.
See above. Standard cardio is boring and for the masses. It has its uses, like for those who can't physically do HIIT yet. Or have a heart problem etc... But if you want scientifically best workout, HIIT is the way to go. It's a pain in the ass. Even I hate doing it. But there is no denying it works.

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go 100% for 60 seconds, it is not impossible i used to do it regularly when i did HIIT.
Congrats, you must be a super freak. Because if you honestly managed to do 15 minutes of intervals lasting 60 seconds each at 100% effort flat out running, that's what you'd be. If you took an NHL player and asked them to full tilt for 60 seconds they might manage it, but definitely not on the next interval. If you've ever watched someone race for a lose puck, miss it, and the D passes it back up the ice the guy is noticeably laboring and slower after only 20-30 seconds of flat out effort.

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Originally Posted by nni View Post
seriously, try not to be such an ass, i have no issue having conversations with people about training, diet, supplements, but i do have issue with people who make it personal. you are not 100% right, there are many different ways to get desired results, its funny that you cant see that.
You are that person that sits there and no matter how many people correct him continues to go on and on about their opinion. That's fine, I guess I can just continue to rebut it or ignore it. But nothing pisses me off more than people giving dangerous advice which is what you were promoting with the 45 mins of HIIT ****. There are a lot of ways to get results. You can go on a keto diet of 1,000 calories a day and run for 4 hours straight and lose weight. Doesn't make it safe or effective.

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03-07-2008, 01:58 PM
  #157
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ill address it in your manner, and hopefully this will get through, and then i will have to take another break from you. i hope this is an age thing and you will grow out of it.

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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
You do. If you say, worked out for 3 hours in the gym with weights, you'd gain next to nothing and probably lose weight (muscle) because your body had been in a catabolic state for so long.
awesome, who said anything about this. i was talking about cycling cardio, you were talking about losing your vo2max, this has nothing to do with either. anyone who is in the gym working out legitmately and not socializing for more than 90 minutes is an idiot (and 90 minutes is being generous). stay on topic.

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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
Your body can't adapt to HIIT by design because you are always constantly changing the intensity of the workout and taking it to another level. After 4 weeks, your 100% effort is going to be way faster than that of when you first started.
your body certainly can adapt to it. if you do the same routine your body will adapt and you will see diminishing returns. this is a long term thing, it doesnt mean after 4 weeks you have tapped out. obviously you will see results at the end fo 4 weeks. you simply arent understand what i am saying, if you do this everyday for months you will see a drop in returns and you will have to cycle off of it.

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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
Prove it. Show me evidence that says HIIT is even remotely dangerous. Again, due it its design, the total time spent working out isn't anywhere near enough to harm you unless you have heart problems. Most guys who workout only do it during their cutting cycles because it's too damn effective when it comes to the bulking cycle. But there is no danger in doing it constantly.
dangerous? i didnt say that, but it is putting your body under an enormous amount of stress, including your joints, and really shouldnt be done for long term. it is an effective tool not to be abused, it is something that should be used for x amount of weeks, put aside, and then revisited.

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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
Very effective at dropping your VO2max and losing everything you worked for. Sorry, but walking or jogging will not bring up your max like HIIT. That is why professional athletes use it.
your vo2max will not drop as you are continuing with cardio. your vo2max will stay steady, and possibly rise abit from longer bouts of cardio. and professional athletes also regularly do long bouts of cardio in the standard format, which to you is a waste, so dont use that as an example.

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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
See above. Standard cardio is boring and for the masses. It has its uses, like for those who can't physically do HIIT yet. Or have a heart problem etc... But if you want scientifically best workout, HIIT is the way to go. It's a pain in the ass. Even I hate doing it. But there is no denying it works.
who gives a **** if it is boring. it is effective. you read one study and you are convinced? show me any study that uses HIIT long term? they dont exist. it is a useful tool, as is standard cardio, and in a successful serious routine, both should be used.

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Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
Congrats, you must be a super freak. Because if you honestly managed to do 15 minutes of intervals lasting 60 seconds each at 100% effort flat out running, that's what you'd be. If you took an NHL player and asked them to full tilt for 60 seconds they might manage it, but definitely not on the next interval. If you've ever watched someone race for a lose puck, miss it, and the D passes it back up the ice the guy is noticeably laboring and slower after only 20-30 seconds of flat out effort.
i think you are underestimating yourself and professional athletes. do it, thats all i can say. obviously your 100% effort level drops, but you are still giving all you have. if i remember correctly, i used to do 5 minutes medium effort, 60s all out, 30s less than medium, 3 minutes medium effort, 45s all out, repeat until you hit 15 seconds. the finish out your run.

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You are that person that sits there and no matter how many people correct him continues to go on and on about their opinion. That's fine, I guess I can just continue to rebut it or ignore it. But nothing pisses me off more than people giving dangerous advice which is what you were promoting with the 45 mins of HIIT ****. There are a lot of ways to get results. You can go on a keto diet of 1,000 calories a day and run for 4 hours straight and lose weight. Doesn't make it safe or effective.
no, as you can see, i corrected myself with respect to the other poster who was receptive and not insulting. i have my opinion, and i have the many articles, texts, books and studies i have read, and when i see someone who isnt understand it correctly i will chime in. when that person tells me i am wrong, and i know i am not, i wont back down and i will try to help them understand. when they are close minded ill give up. after all, i am simply here to help, this doesnt stroke my ego, i like helping people, if they dont want to be helped, then so be it.

nothing i said was dangerous. i have been in an atheletic environment for most of my life, and have been very lucky to be involved in things that most people arent, and i have gained some insight of which i will gladly share. now if you werent close minded, when you saw 45 minutes of hiit (of which is for only the most advanced or less intense, either way) you may have asked how, instead of deeming it dangerous. i know it is amazing that someone may have a routine that doesnt match your 100% it could be much different timing, but that never crossed your mind once. me, i am always open to learning new things because science has not discovered everything about hypertrophy and training, and new studies are released all the time changing our view. if you are set in your ways thinking what you are doing is the best, then you will also be set in your progression and never advace beyond that.

now, im done with you for now, if i see you misunderstanding something else, ill step in so that people dont take everything you say as fact, or not, you might just be a lost cause. who knows, but honestly, aside from you insulting me several times, good luck with your training.

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03-07-2008, 02:01 PM
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03-07-2008, 02:03 PM
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03-07-2008, 02:58 PM
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no, as you can see, i corrected myself with respect to the other poster who was receptive and not insulting. i have my opinion, and i have the many articles, texts, books and studies i have read, and when i see someone who isnt understand it correctly i will chime in. when that person tells me i am wrong, and i know i am not, i wont back down and i will try to help them understand. when they are close minded ill give up. after all, i am simply here to help, this doesnt stroke my ego, i like helping people, if they dont want to be helped, then so be it.
Anyone who has studied human physiology or nutrition knows that you are wrong. I don't need to say it. Others don't. Science says it for me. You continually dart around the topic, throwing out red herrings like they are going out of style. When I address these (like you attacking that I said that the longer you workout, the less you gain and may even have a net negative gain) you simply say I'm off topic.

Sometimes you need to know when to eat your humble pie. I learned that a long time ago, both on these boards and in the classroom. There ARE people out there that know more than you. I know that may scare you, but come on now. I'm not claiming to be one of those people, but I'm wondering what school of thought your books and teachings come from? They seem about 50 years out of date. You can harp on me all you want and claim your way is better, but to date you haven't backed up any of your positions (what few you have) with anything other than your opinion. The other posters in this thread, like PruBlue, have assembled coherent questions and arguments, backed with science. Is it so hard for me to ask you to do the same?

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now, im done with you for now, if i see you misunderstanding something else, ill step in so that people dont take everything you say as fact, or not, you might just be a lost cause. who knows, but honestly, aside from you insulting me several times, good luck with your training.
You are the lost cause and I wish you'd stay out of the thread. Everyone here is pretty much in agreement about HIIT and then you chime in, and yet you really aren't arguing things and 1 particular way. You have no position, which is the problem. You post in here with regards to certain subjects but you are not adding to the discussion, merely driving it off topic and not bringing up any valid points. That is where I get the whole "flapping your gums just to hear yourself talk" type thing. And you can't be any older than me, seeing how you type and *ahem* argue. And you certainly are not as familiar with medical literature, which is apparent. Either that or what you have claimed to have read is way out of date.

I don't profess to know everything and I am only here to argue the merits of what people are saying or helping when people ask questions. I would expect people to do research on their own after hearing things in this thread, so I really don't know why you bother me so much. I guess I just hate seeing someone ramble on totally believing 100% of what they say is true.

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03-07-2008, 03:11 PM
  #161
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Don't mean to be an ass, but don't always take what science says as the all-knowing truth. Science can always be wrong about many things, just look at how many kinds of medicines are said to be good for you one day and then they find out that it can kill you. Science will never be perfect...

While we do know what kind of benefits HIIT gives you, I don't believe there are any long term-studies on it that show how it effects your body if you do it for 5, 10, 20 years.
BTW, there's no reason to fight like this on a message board. Relax, we're here to have fun, talk about hockey and help each other. No need to flame each other. So smile and chill .

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03-07-2008, 03:17 PM
  #162
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Don't mean to be an ass, but don't always take what science says as the all-knowing truth. Science can always be wrong about many things, just look at how many kinds of medicines are said to be good for you one day and then they find out that it can kill you. Science will never be perfect...
That's a given What works, for the most part, has changed almost yearly in training circles of all kinds. There are certainly fundamentals that are established by science and what we know of the human body that can't be ignored, though. For the most part a lot of things will never be put entirely under the microscope because there are just so many theories and different practices out there. At best, you might have some clinical trials and studies, but even those can be roughshod. For instance creatine. It's still under debate even to this day whether or not it's truly beneficial. Pick and choose what you want to believe, but don't ever take anything said here for granted.

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03-07-2008, 03:19 PM
  #163
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....
you really havent read anything i have said, and your entire post goes against the reality of the situation. i am not against hiit, nor have i said it once, and dont talk to me about physiology, you are in no position to profess any type of experise.

for the good of the thread i am out, you are here simply to post what you feel and attack anyone who offers anything slightly different, even if they arent entirely disagreeing with you. again, good luck to you, hopefully youll grow up a little.

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03-08-2008, 10:41 AM
  #164
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HIIT is more effective than continuous aerobic training in many aspects. I decided to research Interval Training for a literature review, and believe me, there is plenty of evidence out there supporting it as an effective training method. I think it would be pretty rare to see an elite athlete requiring some form of conditioning not using it... hockey players, wrestlers, long distance runners...

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03-08-2008, 10:48 AM
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If you add in the warmup and cool down it's 25 minutes, still not one hour. If you are truly exerting 100% there's no way you could continue on for an hour. After 10 - 15 minutes of doing just that you'll be shot. Even the moderate effort you put in between intervals becomes hard by the end of your workout.

They also say do 15-20 second intervals whereas the other says to do 60 seconds. You have to be in damn good shape to do a 60 second interval of 100% effort.
Nobody can maintain the same intensity for 60 second intervals... even at 30 second intervals, your 8th interval will not be at as high intensity as the 1st.... even in highly trained people.

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03-08-2008, 09:03 PM
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learn how to use muscular energy

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03-09-2008, 01:09 AM
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wow there are alot of workout junkies here,

5 pages for one question,

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03-09-2008, 11:48 AM
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Just a quick question. I'm well informed as far as workout routines go, just need to work on the motivation part. But it's hard to eat healthy at school, especially now when I have to make my own meals. Does anyone have some links to recommended diets or recipes and stuff like that?

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03-09-2008, 01:07 PM
  #169
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Just a quick question. I'm well informed as far as workout routines go, just need to work on the motivation part. But it's hard to eat healthy at school, especially now when I have to make my own meals. Does anyone have some links to recommended diets or recipes and stuff like that?
I'm not a fan of these cliche type diets, but the abs diet is actually pretty good. It doesn't cut out any macronutrients, such as Atkins, which makes it a lot easier to follow throughout your life. It's more of a lifestyle change than say an 8 week program where you starve yourself, which is pretty much the worst thing you can do.

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