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Old
04-21-2017, 12:40 AM
  #426
Atas2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cska78 View Post
Popugaev does NOT suck, just not panning out a super star I had hoped he would

Not even having a look at Smirnov? NCAA is a stronger league, than CHL and he had a good season there, actually a very decent
This really trying to find diamonds in the rough. Those are not the players.

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04-21-2017, 12:53 AM
  #427
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Originally Posted by wings5 View Post
idk, Abramov and Korostelev were surprising omissions, Sokolov and Smirnov could have helped too.
Abramov was an underager. He will get his wjc this year if available. I understand and support Bragin's policy of not taking underagers unless they are future elite superstars OR cover a position of need. If Abramov was a promising d-man he'd be on the roster. Bragin is rightfully giving the older guys their exposure in their last year of availability. For all the popularity of the tournament recently it is not a senior one. Winning no matter what is not the ultimate goal. It is evaluating one birth year as a bunch. Sometimes (like 97) we have a weaker group.

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04-21-2017, 01:06 AM
  #428
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Originally Posted by Pavel Buchnevich View Post
He had players, he just didn't puck them. Svechnikov, Lipanov, Chekhovich, Popugayev, Khovanov, Kravtsov, Shvyryov, Kosorenkov, Abramov. He couldn't have picked two or three of those players?
You list a bunch of serious underagers. I remind you how uneventful McDavids showings were when he played in those tournaments as an underager. Those guys you list aren't even the "right" age this coming December.

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04-21-2017, 09:39 AM
  #429
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Chekhovich has been really impressive. He has the complete package - size, speed, great skater, great hands! Watch out for that guy!

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04-21-2017, 10:32 AM
  #430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atas2000 View Post
You list a bunch of serious underagers. I remind you how uneventful McDavids showings were when he played in those tournaments as an underager. Those guys you list aren't even the "right" age this coming December.
So what? Finland won a few years ago with their two best players being first year draft eligibles. They were the two best players at that whole tournament. Obviously the whole team shouldn't be such young players, but in a year lacking talent in the older forwards, it might be a smart strategy to take two or three younger players that might've not otherwise been taken. Svechnikov could've helped, even if he was young. Did Rasmus Dahlin not help Sweden? The coach didn't play him much, but when he played, he was pretty good.

Bragin has had a lot of success. He's a very good coach, but he ran into a problem this year. He had a year where he just didn't have the requisite talent in the age group he usually picks from, and he refused to adjust.

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04-21-2017, 11:36 AM
  #431
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Bragin is not the problem. There is no comparison between his decisions and Golubovich's.

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04-21-2017, 01:33 PM
  #432
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The only omissions I question are Abramov and Smirnov. I liked Bragin's roster otherwise. As triple underragers, Svechnikov and Khovanov were rightly not included. They wouldn't have added much.

And lets not forget the Yurtaikin-Alexeyev-Rubtsov like was ineffective for much of the tourney because of injuiries.

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04-21-2017, 07:01 PM
  #433
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Hello Russian fans.
What are your feelings and thoughts before U18 WJC semifinal Finland vs Russia.

I haven't seen your games but i guess your team is good when they have advanced to semifinal.
Finland has been unbeaten in this tournament 5 games 5 wins so we are ready to play.

Few notes on Finland's team
1 Our top line Vesalainen Ikonen Nyman has been very good.
2 Miro Heiskanen is probably whole tournaments best d-man and he's scored 12 points in 5 games he's only 2 points away to break defenceman's scoring record in U18 WJC's.
3 Finland is 2nd worst team on the tournament in penalty killing 78% if Russia wants win they have to force Finland to take idiotic penalties.
4 Finland's powerplay is tournaments best with 39%
5 Finland is scored at least 5 goals per game during the tournament.

Players to follow
Kristian Vesalainen ( tournaments scoring leader with 13 points).
Miro Heiskanen ( tournaments best d-man so far)
Joni Ikonen ( 2017 eligible C / RW who's fast and incredibly dangerous player)
Linus Nyman ( Best goal-scorer of OHL rookies with 26 goals)
Ukko Pekka Luukkonen ( 2017 draft's top ranked European goalie)
Jepseri Kotkaniemi ( 2000 born and 2018 draft eligible Finnish center)
Jesse Ylönen (2018 draft eligible RW and son of Finnish ex NHL player Juha Ylönen).

Lets make this semifinal good and exciting game like 2016 world juniors gold-medal game was.

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04-22-2017, 02:49 AM
  #434
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Hard to tell what to expect from the semifinals: our D is pretty bad, Zhukov is unstable, Svechnikov missed the last practice and some of the guys that should've been among the leaders are underperforming so far (Alexeyev, Bitsadze). I think we're the underdogs this time.

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04-22-2017, 06:04 AM
  #435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavel Buchnevich View Post
So what? Finland won a few years ago with their two best players being first year draft eligibles. They were the two best players at that whole tournament. Obviously the whole team shouldn't be such young players, but in a year lacking talent in the older forwards, it might be a smart strategy to take two or three younger players that might've not otherwise been taken. Svechnikov could've helped, even if he was young. Did Rasmus Dahlin not help Sweden? The coach didn't play him much, but when he played, he was pretty good.

Bragin has had a lot of success. He's a very good coach, but he ran into a problem this year. He had a year where he just didn't have the requisite talent in the age group he usually picks from, and he refused to adjust.
So now you are going to claim Abramov to be a Laine level talent or what?

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Old
04-22-2017, 06:08 AM
  #436
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Originally Posted by FinnHockeyFan View Post
Hello Russian fans.
What are your feelings and thoughts before U18 WJC semifinal Finland vs Russia.

I haven't seen your games but i guess your team is good when they have advanced to semifinal.
Finland has been unbeaten in this tournament 5 games 5 wins so we are ready to play.

Few notes on Finland's team
1 Our top line Vesalainen Ikonen Nyman has been very good.
2 Miro Heiskanen is probably whole tournaments best d-man and he's scored 12 points in 5 games he's only 2 points away to break defenceman's scoring record in U18 WJC's.
3 Finland is 2nd worst team on the tournament in penalty killing 78% if Russia wants win they have to force Finland to take idiotic penalties.
4 Finland's powerplay is tournaments best with 39%
5 Finland is scored at least 5 goals per game during the tournament.

Players to follow
Kristian Vesalainen ( tournaments scoring leader with 13 points).
Miro Heiskanen ( tournaments best d-man so far)
Joni Ikonen ( 2017 eligible C / RW who's fast and incredibly dangerous player)
Linus Nyman ( Best goal-scorer of OHL rookies with 26 goals)
Ukko Pekka Luukkonen ( 2017 draft's top ranked European goalie)
Jepseri Kotkaniemi ( 2000 born and 2018 draft eligible Finnish center)
Jesse Ylönen (2018 draft eligible RW and son of Finnish ex NHL player Juha Ylönen).
3
Lets make this semifinal good and exciting game like 2016 world juniors gold-medal game was.
You'd have to know that Russia is icing a roster far from the best available due to injuries andequestionable decisions by the coaching staff.

Russia is going to have a hard time performing well in that game.

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04-22-2017, 06:11 AM
  #437
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Originally Posted by Caser View Post
Hard to tell what to expect from the semifinals: our D is pretty bad, Zhukov is unstable, Svechnikov missed the last practice and some of the guys that should've been among the leaders are underperforming so far (Alexeyev, Bitsadze). I think we're the underdogs this time.
I don't have seen Russia's games so i don't know much of your team.
But at least this younger Svechnikov looks really promising player.

Of course he's underage but still he's played well i don't expect Finland will dominate this semifinal today i think this game will be really close.
But if Russia starts taking stupid penalties Finland will score at least one goal on powerplay.
If Russia wants to win they have to stay out of penalty box Finland is best powerplay team in the tournament.

Our goalie Luukkonen is really promising and he'll go rounds 2-4 in NHL draft.
But in Czech Republic game he was a bit unsure and most of those Czechs goals came mistakes what Finland's defence did.

Joni Ikonen who's Finland's 1st center is played well in every game.
But in game against Canada he got some minor injury he can play but he's quite careful in his games one example is that he won't take much face-offs anymore.

Finland has also three underage players on the team.
They are C Jesperi Kotkaniemi, C / RW Rasmus Kupari and D Toni Utunen.

Lets have good and exciting semifinal today.
Good luck Russia and best team today goes to Final.


Last edited by FinnHockeyFan: 04-22-2017 at 06:21 AM.
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04-22-2017, 06:19 AM
  #438
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Originally Posted by Atas2000 View Post
You'd have to know that Russia is icing a roster far from the best available due to injuries andequestionable decisions by the coaching staff.

Russia is going to have a hard time performing well in that game.
I'm not seen Russia's games so i don't judge or underestimate them.
But i don't expect that Finland will dominate this game.

Yes Finland is unbeaten but all winning streaks will end at some point.
Also we lost four our best U18 players for their respective team playoff duties.

Those guys were Eeli Tolvanen, Aleksi Heponiemi, Sami Moilanen and Henri Jokiharju.
Three of those guys are players who played Finland's gold medal winning team in Grand Forks last year.

I wish good luck to Russia in today's semifinal.

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04-22-2017, 10:02 AM
  #439
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Samourakov is having a terrible game so far. A complete passenger on the goal (100% his fault), stripped of the puck coming out of his zone leading to a good scoring chance for Finns and lets Finnish guy skate right through for breakaway chance leading to Finn PP.

Also Russians are trying to play too much a NA game - way too much dump and chase which has been largely ineffective. Every time they do it they just give it to the Finns who storm right back. The Finns are looking like the more Russian team today.


Last edited by malkinfan: 04-22-2017 at 10:36 AM.
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04-22-2017, 10:09 AM
  #440
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caser View Post
Hard to tell what to expect from the semifinals: our D is pretty bad, Zhukov is unstable, Svechnikov missed the last practice and some of the guys that should've been among the leaders are underperforming so far (Alexeyev, Bitsadze). I think we're the underdogs this time.
Alexeyev is the biggest disappointment for me so far. Last year he had a great tournament, obviously with Kostin not being there it has some effect. But his line mates this year are no slouches. Where did his skill go?


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04-22-2017, 11:12 AM
  #441
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Finland deserved the win, they were the better team by a long shot.

Embarrassing last shift by Svechnikov which lead to the goal. In the defensive zone he was abysmal today (lack of effort or interest) and his offensive activity was mediocre at best. For a projected #1 overall you expect much, much more in a big game like this.

He had one nice toe drag play, but the shot he released after it was something you would expect from a pewee.

Slepets on the other hand, was much more impressive than any other forward by a long shot. The shift he had in overtime was phenomenal, showed his talent and composure with the puck. Yeah people who look at stats will say he had a bad year, but most of that team (notable Kayumov) had poor stats there so I dont know what the situation was. But after this tournament anyone that thinks a guy like Lipanov is better than Slepets (most of the draft rankings) are nuts.

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04-22-2017, 11:40 AM
  #442
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that's a pretty good result from such a bad team coached by an idiot. disappointed by svechnikov. might be like his brother, not the brightest bulb in the box.

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04-22-2017, 11:44 AM
  #443
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I agree with your analysis, particularly in light of the fact that turnovers in their own zone are especially dangerous because there is almost no defensive support. Samorukhov may have some physical talent, but I have never seen a hockey player at any level make as many unforced mental errors as he has throughout the tournament, particularly today. He deserved an assist on the first Finnish goal, where, instead of trying to block the attacker's path, he just stepped out of his way (to avoid screening Zhukov, no doubt), and offered the attacker an open path to pass to another forward standing uncovered in front of Zhukov. Sorry to attack a kid that young, but he is absolutely brainless out there, and in a very nonchalant way.

You have to wonder whether the RHF has considered firing all the coaches and just allowing the kids to coach themselves? It couldn't hurt anything. It is obvious that there has been no effort to revise the same old repetitive and failed strategies to clear the puck out of the defensive zone. They still demand that all clearing passes go along the side boards, even though the opponents will be waiting for them. And they still allow the opponents to freely carry the puck into the zone at full speed while the defense collapses around the goaltender. This ensures that the opponents will possess in the defensive zone at least 75% of the game, unloading volleys of shots one after another.

This was not a Gold Medal team to begin with, and a Bronze Medal would be a reasonable accomplishment for this group. But you have to wonder if things couldn't have turned out differently if the kids were given adequate coaching and held to adequate standards of execution.

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04-22-2017, 11:56 AM
  #444
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I dunno guys why you blame Svechnikov, guy is playing hurt and still one of the better forwards on the team.

Funnily enough, this was probably one game where braindead energy style was working, Finns didn't handle it that well, but the lack of talent still killed our team.

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04-22-2017, 12:10 PM
  #445
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingvar View Post
I dunno guys why you blame Svechnikov, guy is playing hurt and still one of the better forwards on the team.

Funnily enough, this was probably one game where braindead energy style was working, Finns didn't handle it that well, but the lack of talent still killed our team.


Because his last shift was an embarrassment to top off a very mediocre game, see for yourself:

@7:10 terrible turnover - Finns charge the other way
@7:20 terrible effort, loses puck again - allows Finns to charge in again
@7:30 embarrassing defensive effort - lol what the hell
@7:35 loses another battle to get the puck out
@7:54 Finns end Svechnikovs misery

One terrible shift that costed team the game.


Last edited by malkinfan: 04-22-2017 at 12:17 PM.
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04-22-2017, 12:24 PM
  #446
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
I agree with your analysis, particularly in light of the fact that turnovers in their own zone are especially dangerous because there is almost no defensive support. Samorukhov may have some physical talent, but I have never seen a hockey player at any level make as many unforced mental errors as he has throughout the tournament, particularly today. He deserved an assist on the first Finnish goal, where, instead of trying to block the attacker's path, he just stepped out of his way (to avoid screening Zhukov, no doubt), and offered the attacker an open path to pass to another forward standing uncovered in front of Zhukov. Sorry to attack a kid that young, but he is absolutely brainless out there, and in a very nonchalant way.

You have to wonder whether the RHF has considered firing all the coaches and just allowing the kids to coach themselves? It couldn't hurt anything. It is obvious that there has been no effort to revise the same old repetitive and failed strategies to clear the puck out of the defensive zone. They still demand that all clearing passes go along the side boards, even though the opponents will be waiting for them. And they still allow the opponents to freely carry the puck into the zone at full speed while the defense collapses around the goaltender. This ensures that the opponents will possess in the defensive zone at least 75% of the game, unloading volleys of shots one after another.

This was not a Gold Medal team to begin with, and a Bronze Medal would be a reasonable accomplishment for this group. But you have to wonder if things couldn't have turned out differently if the kids were given adequate coaching and held to adequate standards of execution.
I agree with you completely. What I would like to see is these old regime coaches fired and bring in new guys like Mogilny, Bure, Fedorov etc. I know they have current roles but I think the kids would be better served being coached by someone younger who had tremendous success at NHL/International/KHL. When a good Russian player is close to retiring, I wish they would talk them into being coaches at the younger levels. Hopefully Datsyuk soon. Also I thought Prokhorov was adequate selection,

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04-22-2017, 12:56 PM
  #447
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Originally Posted by malkinfan View Post
Because his last shift was an embarrassment to top off a very mediocre game, see for yourself:

@7:10 terrible turnover - Finns charge the other way
@7:20 terrible effort, loses puck again - allows Finns to charge in again
@7:30 embarrassing defensive effort - lol what the hell
@7:35 loses another battle to get the puck out
@7:54 Finns end Svechnikovs misery

One terrible shift that costed team the game.
"Schtirlitz knew - the last phrase stucks in memory." Yup, his last shift was bad but this defensive effort is not normal for him. Between him being overrated terrible player who can't be bothered to play defense in OT in semifinals and him being physically unable to properly return to defense because he's been playing hurt all game I'm choosing the latter, what about you? And despite Svechnikov being unable to be his normal physically dominating self he still showed his vision and hands in this game, I'm cutting him some slack.

If you want to pin the blame for loss on someone, pin it on Koltygin who totally lost his man.

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04-22-2017, 02:10 PM
  #448
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Originally Posted by Ingvar View Post
"Schtirlitz knew - the last phrase stucks in memory." Yup, his last shift was bad but this defensive effort is not normal for him. Between him being overrated terrible player who can't be bothered to play defense in OT in semifinals and him being physically unable to properly return to defense because he's been playing hurt all game I'm choosing the latter, what about you? And despite Svechnikov being unable to be his normal physically dominating self he still showed his vision and hands in this game, I'm cutting him some slack.

If you want to pin the blame for loss on someone, pin it on Koltygin who totally lost his man.
Like you, I'm just going to assume that Svechnikov was hurt.

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04-22-2017, 02:12 PM
  #449
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Of course we didn't need Kravtsov or anything. Or Marchenko. Or Denisenko. Or Khovanov. Or Yaremchuk.

What a putz this Golubovich is.

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04-22-2017, 02:59 PM
  #450
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I understand that every Russian is disappointed today's semifinal loss.
But still it's quite brutal to blame one of the youngest player in the team.

So what if Svechnikov didn't have his best game today he's a 16 yrs old for god sake he'll become better every hockey player has good and bad games.
Sudden death overtime is brutal way to lose hockey game but that happens.

If Zhukov would have been able he would have saved Utunen's game winning goal.
But it wasn't his goal it was real cannon blast by Utunen and Zhukov had no chance to save it.

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