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Mark Messier Looking For Ways Get Canadian Kids To Play Hockey

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Old
05-18-2017, 12:57 PM
  #26
Oleg Petrov
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I believe the structure of Hockey Canada needs to be consistent from region to region and should have a cost structure that gets kids playing in House League.

To me House League is $300 for the Winter you get one game a week and one practice every 2 weeks and the coaches are volunteers. Whatever is leftover cost wise is then subsidized by Hockey Canada.

The AAA, AA & A programs then have the latitude to charge whatever they see as appropriate, however if they do not run a subsidized House League Program that meets Hockey Canada's standards then they are not eligible to play in the AAA, AA or A Leagues.

Right now there are too many hands in the pockets of Parents.

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05-18-2017, 01:30 PM
  #27
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How many teams would a high school typically support? In high school hockey here in Canada you typically have maybe two teams per school (junior and senior), perhaps just one, and so kids have to try out and most are left on the sidelines. It doesn't really address the issue of getting kids to play hockey. (not to mention that the ones on the team are the ones who have played since they were small so you're not going to get any kids new to the sport)

Do they support multiple teams in MN, and do they tier them so you can get a lot of kids through the system and increase the participation levels (and have a place for kids with less talent or new kids)? That might be the way to address it. Otherwise the high schools only take the place of competitive hockey (which is not really an issue here, there are still lots of kids pursuing the dream) and kids who just want to play for fun are left with local minor hockey programs which is what they are trying to keep kids in, and attract new kids to.
In Minnesota HS there is a Varsity and Junior Varsity team. Those that don't make their HS team can continue playing hockey in the Junior Gold league. Many freshman in HS are still in the youth programs playing Bantam hockey because Minnesota does not follow the USA Hockey birth year system, the MN age classifications differ by 6 months. They do this because HS hockey is so important and they want a place for the freshman to play. Typical progression is Freshman - Bantam, Sophomore - JV, Junior/Senior - Varsity.

Yes, it is highly competitive and players do get cut, but those players can choose to play Junior Gold. Junior Gold is still competitive hockey too, don't kid yourself.

The major point I make about their system is that it is cost effective. In the USA Tier 1 system it costs about $10,000 and you have to send your 15 year old off to live with another family and go to school somewhere else. In Minnesota, the players get to stay at home with their parents, go to their high school, and the cost is nominal, maybe $500 or so. Which system do you think would attract and retain more players, and especially more parents? Which is more affordable?


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05-18-2017, 02:10 PM
  #28
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You never hear these stories because participation in football is almost statistically insignificant in Canada. It's almost an order of magnitude less than hockey according to a 2010 Statscan study. Someone is probably worried about it, but when you're talking about boosting participation rates among the youth in Canada (the point of this thread), football is pretty much the opposite of what you should be looking at.

Also, a lot of minor football is happening with independent clubs as high schools get out of the football business due to expense and insurance.


Fair but the club route is the wrong route. A lot of people did play football in the GTA around the time I left, but that was years ago.
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Do you have any idea how expensive it is to maintain an indoor ice-rink compared to a football field, which is basically required at each public school for your football analogy to work? Football in the States is also heavily funded by benefactors (aka alumni donations), which doesn't tend to carry over to how Canadians opperate.

Football you don't hear about because most equipment is reusable. That is not true for sticks, which are expensive and break, or to a lesser extent skates, which you can only re-mould a few times before running into issues.
Okay so we have to find a way to bring the costs of the rinks down. But if the club system remains, less people will play hockey.

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This is absolutely correct. Unfortunately the USA is starting to follow Canada's model of Tier 1 Midgets, Juniors, etc.

When you think of hockey in the USA which state comes to your mind first? Minnesota? Yeah, I'd say Minnesota. Minnesota has a community based hockey system that funnels kids through the system into the local high school program, and high school hockey is HUGE in Minnesota. Huge participation at the youth levels. There are some huge associations in Minnesota and any town with a population over 3,000-5,000, some even smaller, have a team. Shoot, Walker, MN has 900 people in the dang town and they have a youth hockey program.

What needs to happen in EVERY more traditional hockey market in the USA, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, North Dakota, New York, Massachusetts, Illinois, etc. is to imitate the Minnesota/North Dakota/Wisconsin model of community based teams and high school hockey. It needs to mimic the path of stick and ball sports in order to bring the game to more people and keep it affordable. Unfortunately the Tier 1 AAA model is starting to creep into these states too. For the good of the game it needs to trend the other direction and become more community based.

In Canada, community based hockey, neighborhood park rinks, and a high school style model would help to bring hockey back to the people. It needs to be accessible, affordable, and realistic that you can come up through your community and not have to leave home until 18 for hockey. In both countries this tiering model and kids having to leave home and the great expense of the sport is turning people away and limiting its growth.

I'm speaking from experience. My son is entering Midgets and is going through the tryout process with several different Tier 1 teams. We're looking at him having to move away from home to live with a billet family and shelling out about $8,000-$10,000 for the season. It's freaking ridiculous that this is what kids and parents have to go through to get a sniff at moving up the ranks into juniors and possibly college hockey someday. I grew up in the sport so I accept it and can't imagine him playing anything else. For non-hockey families, they look at this and say, "no thanks, my kid will play basketball instead."
Amen. I have a serious problem to begin with in regards to 14 year olds being "drafted" and spending the school year on a bus going from town to town. People have started moving towards soccer already, and it will only get worse until the minor hockey and the CHL step aside.

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Cart before the horse.

We're talking about getting kids ages 5-10 playing the game. The CHL could take on a greater grass roots role, but this issue is really far removed from the 5% of kids between the ages of 16 and 20 that are good enough to play at that level.

Besides, for those that aren't good enough, AND have played up through Midget, most provinces have high school level hockey, tier 2, etc.

There are fundamental things that can be done to make the game more accessible.

1. Go back to wooden sticks. The use of composite sticks sets a far too unrealistic expectation. It's one thing for big clubs to spend 100s of thousands a year on stick budgets. It's another thing for parents to drop $100-300 on a stick only to see it break in the first use. The rest of the gear does provide a certain level of varying degrees for varying budgets. You don't HAVE to go out and drop $300 on a pair of skates. As someone who was 6' by the time they were 13, growth rate was the biggest hurdle for me growing up. That hasn't changed, so you buy a little big.

2. Rinks need to drastically reduce the cost of ice rentals. IMO this is the biggest hurdle. That cost is directly passed onto families who have to pay the fees associated with joining leagues/teams. I'd like to see a study done on what it actually costs a barn to operate an ice surface for an hour and compare that to the inflated prices they charge. I think this is where municipalities need to get involved and legislate/cap costs to teams

3. Availability of ice is an issue too. I don't think it matters what city you are in. There never seems to be enough ice or hours in a day.

...

I think exposure to the sport through cheaper means, like ball/road hockey is a great step. I grew up in the 'burbs and was fortunate enough to live on a "side street" that made playing on the street possible. Parents letting me play in the street was also a requirement lol. I had a net. Best friend had a net. We dragged them all over playing with groups on various streets throughout the community. Where streets aren't an option, parking lots are great. Schools, churches, etc. But, the kids have to want to get out and play.

A street hockey stick, a three pack of tennis balls, and a net are a not a huge investment for most families. If no net, grab some chalk and draw one on a brick wall.

... but the kids still have to want to get out and play.
This is the problem: the rinks are too expensive, but how to lower the costs. What's the incentive?

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Old
05-18-2017, 11:45 PM
  #29
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basketball is much more "hip" then hockey and the NBA actually market it stars unlike the NHL.

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05-18-2017, 11:46 PM
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Fair but the club route is the wrong route. A lot of people did play football in the GTA around the time I left, but that was years ago.
Okay so we have to find a way to bring the costs of the rinks down. But if the club system remains, less people will play hockey.

Amen. I have a serious problem to begin with in regards to 14 year olds being "drafted" and spending the school year on a bus going from town to town. People have started moving towards soccer already, and it will only get worse until the minor hockey and the CHL step aside.



This is the problem: the rinks are too expensive, but how to lower the costs. What's the incentive?
don't forget the changing demographic of major canadian cities and the NHL completely ignoring that demographic.

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05-19-2017, 08:51 AM
  #31
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don't forget the changing demographic of major canadian cities and the NHL completely ignoring that demographic.
Does any other North American sports league have regularly broadcasts in Punjabi?

How exactly is the NHL "ignoring" the "changing demographic"?

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05-19-2017, 09:12 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by joelef View Post
don't forget the changing demographic of major canadian cities and the NHL completely ignoring that demographic.
True.

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Originally Posted by Pilky01 View Post
Does any other North American sports league have regularly broadcasts in Punjabi?

How exactly is the NHL "ignoring" the "changing demographic"?
They were forced to by the CBC and there's no uptick in Indian Canadian kids playing hockey to show for it.

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Old
05-19-2017, 09:24 AM
  #33
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no doubt. Messier will line his pockets somehow in this deal if it happens

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05-19-2017, 09:24 AM
  #34
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.... so his Sister is the Director of Marketing for Bauer which under new ownership after seeing it's profits dwindle, barely surviving the most recent recession, retail closings, out of control equipment costs which Bauer itself amongst others is wholly responsible for, sky-high Pony Club like minor-hockey Registration & Ice-Time Fee's... so they come out with this "First Shift" program; $199 gets a kid dressed from tip to toe and includes 6 introductory on-ice sessions... Ok. Thats brilliant, great. But how can they do that, manufacture & sell a complete outfit, all new including skates, a stick, shin, shoulder & elbow pads, gloves, socks/pants/jersey, helmet & cage PLUS 6 on ice sessions for two hundred bucks all in yet the minute the kid goes to sign up for a House League and grows out of that equipment, Mom & Dad are looking at probably a 1000% + increase in costs minimum.... Then after a year or two of House, the kids good enough for Single, Double or AAA, and Mom & Dad are looking at a 7000%+ increase to that original $200 investment and thats pretty much every year. Complete kit plus ice-time for $200 and thereafter, your looking at three hundred bucks just for a stick? Thats like a Krack Dealer offering Free Introductory Samples on the street corner. Kids hooked only his parents cant afford to keep feeding his now habit & addiction to a game he may have fallen in love with.... This problem is systemic. Touches every single amateur organization & without the full backing of the CAHA, provincial & local authorities & leagues/organizations along with equipment manufacturers & arena convenors really what's going to change? Sure the kid could go on to have a "brilliant road hockey career" but thats a poor substitute for the real deal. Its a wonderful ideal, "First Shift" like the NHLPA's "Dreams & Goals" program that you cant help but applaud. But what comes after for these kids & their parents are costs & investments in time that only the Upper Middle Classes can any longer afford.... And of course it wasnt always so. Outdoor rinks as far as the eye could see, hockey truly the "peoples game", amateur leagues, Junior, Minor-Pro & the NHL populated bu the Sons of hardscrabble blue collar workers, farmers, miners. Back in the day it was actually quite unusual for a pro player to come from an upper-middle-class background. Yet here we are. All gone topsy-turvy. Priced themselves out of the reach of all but the wealthy, ever shrinking middle-class, lower income families theres just no way.


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Old
05-19-2017, 09:26 AM
  #35
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They were forced to by the CBC and there's no uptick in Indian Canadian kids playing hockey to show for it.
Still more than the Raptors, Blue Jays or anyone else have done.

Do we have stats on indian kids playing hockey? Anecdotally I play shinny every week in Pickering and there has always been lotsa brown guys playing with us. Hell I have been playing hockey with brown dudes since the 90's in Malvern.

Anyway, everything I hear from ex players is Messier is a total *****.


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05-19-2017, 09:59 AM
  #36
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Still more than the Raptors, Blue Jays or anyone else have done.

Do we have stats on indian kids playing hockey? Anecdotally I play shinny every week in Pickering and there has always lotsa brown guys playing with us. Hell I have been playing hockey with brown dudes since the 90's in Malvern.

Anyway, everything I hear from ex players is Messier is a total *****.
Malvern. Theres a name havent heard in years. Back in the 60's I played House League in Willowdale getting started at like 6 followed by several years in the then called MTHL playing AA (there was no AAA back then, AA, A & B). Even with inflation Registration Fee's & including game & practice ice-time a fraction of what they are today. Maybe $100 at the House League levels; $175 at the MTHL level. Equipment costs (I started as a skater but switched to goal) also a fraction of todays costs. CCM Tacks or Bauer Supremes new costing maybe $80 with lower range options such as CCM Mustang or Bauer Panther skates, excellent products ranging from about $30-60. Top end Cooper pads, GP 59's running maybe $200, GM 12 Blocker & Trapper (used by the pro's) about the same for a set with a lower range also available for a lot less in junior, intermediate & senior sizes. Sticks all wood of course, and you could buy a cheap Wally for shinny for like a $1.29 or 3 for $3 (straight blade) or a really good stick, Victoriaville, CCM, Northland Pro for anywhere from about $7.99 to $15. Back then there was more a sense of "community" in Toronto & elsewhere, equipment & skate exchanges (kids grow fast) also quite popular & you could find 1 season used Tacks or whatever for like five bucks & so on.... I got out of the game early 70's and noted that by the early to mid-80's costs had really begun to escalate for equipment, ice time & Registration Fee's, through the 90's & 00's reaching levels that only the well heeled could any longer afford.... So while I applaud this "first Shift" program as I mentioned above & yes, given Messiers rep, the fact his Sister is Bauer Director of Marketing, hard not to be somewhat cynical about this program as it fails to address what happens after the kids gone through the First Shift program yet cant go on as his folks cant afford it............ I mean on paper, looks good, 5000 kids so far & counting but whats the retention rate? How many do go on to Register in House or Rep Hockey Leagues?


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Old
05-19-2017, 10:15 AM
  #37
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.... so his Sister is the Director of Marketing for Bauer which under new ownership after seeing it's profits dwindle, barely surviving the most recent recession, retail closings, out of control equipment costs which Bauer itself amongst others is wholly responsible for, sky-high Pony Club like minor-hockey Registration & Ice-Time Fee's... so they come out with this "First Shift" program; $199 gets a kid dressed from tip to toe and includes 6 introductory on-ice sessions... Ok. Thats brilliant, great. But how can they do that, manufacture & sell a complete outfit, all new including skates, a stick, shin, shoulder & elbow pads, gloves, socks/pants/jersey, helmet & cage PLUS 6 on ice sessions for two hundred bucks all in yet the minute the kid goes to sign up for a House League and grows out of that equipment, Mom & Dad are looking at probably a 1000% + increase in costs minimum.... Then after a year or two of House, the kids good enough for Single, Double or AAA, and Mom & Dad are looking at a 7000%+ increase to that original $200 investment and thats pretty much every year. Complete kit plus ice-time for $200 and thereafter, your looking at three hundred bucks just for a stick? Thats like a Krack Dealer offering Free Introductory Samples on the street corner. Kids hooked only his parents cant afford to keep feeding his now habit & addiction to a game he may have fallen in love with.... This problem is systemic. Touches every single amateur organization & without the full backing of the CAHA, provincial & local authorities & leagues/organizations along with equipment manufacturers & arena convenors really what's going to change? Sure the kid could go on to have a "brilliant road hockey career" but thats a poor substitute for the real deal. Its a wonderful ideal, "First Shift" like the NHLPA's "Dreams & Goals" program that you cant help but applaud. But what comes after for these kids & their parents are costs & investments in time that only the Upper Middle Classes can any longer afford.... And of course it wasnt always so. Outdoor rinks as far as the eye could see, hockey truly the "peoples game", amateur leagues, Junior, Minor-Pro & the NHL populated bu the Sons of hardscrabble blue collar workers, farmers, miners. Back in the day it was actually quite unusual for a pro player to come from an upper-middle-class background. Yet here we are. All gone topsy-turvy. Priced themselves out of the reach of all but the wealthy, ever shrinking middle-class, lower income families theres just no way.
What needs to happen is the development of an alternative path for lower income city kids and rural kids. It will need to involve USA Hockey, Hockey Canada, and the NHL. There needs to be an organizational structure put into place and support given to it.

This kind of happens right now in some areas organically, like when you compare how things are done in the Twin City metro areas at places like Edina versus what goes on up north from the northwest to the Iron Range. Rich affluent suburbs who spend tons of money on the sport against the working class northern families. Those northern programs turn out some great hockey players at a much lower cost. It can be done. That system and approach needs to be mimicked in other areas.

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05-19-2017, 10:17 AM
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I am convinced that Tier 1 and AAA were invented just so the rich could financially separate themselves from the rest of the hockey world and give their kids a leg up.

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05-19-2017, 10:28 AM
  #39
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I am convinced that Tier 1 and AAA were invented just so the rich could financially separate themselves from the rest of the hockey world and give their kids a leg up.
.... thats certainly been the case in quite a few instances, yes. There was a guy in Toronto who bought up a bunch AAA teams, charging through the nose, running them for profit. Thing is his teams were winning so Parents were lining up with their checkbooks though fortunately the GTHL (formerly MTHL, THL) broke it up. Yet you still hear crazy stories. Coaches being paid 6 figures to coach Pee Wee, Bantam, Midget. Former NHL'r Rick Vaive for example. All kinds of nonsense like that & it still goes on.

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05-19-2017, 10:37 AM
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http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/m...k-game-hockey/

hockey is getting to be expensive...mark messier, teaming up with Bauer, is trying to get more canadians kids to play hockey without having to pay a lot of money just to get onto the ice..
I dont have any children but, I could not afford to have them play hockey...

I cant remember where I've read this but they were estimating 12,000-15,000 a year to have one kid play hockey (Equipment, tuition, seminars, hotels, meals, gas...) and the price was almost double for elite AAA hockey

so if Canada (Mark Messier) wants more hockey players, they should comeup with some sort of programs to finance yearly cost for minor hockey

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05-19-2017, 11:01 AM
  #41
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I dont have any children but, I could not afford to have them play hockey...

I cant remember where I've read this but they were estimating 12,000-15,000 a year to have one kid play hockey (Equipment, tuition, seminars, hotels, meals, gas...) and the price was almost double for elite AAA hockey

so if Canada (Mark Messier) wants more hockey players, they should comeup with some sort of programs to finance yearly cost for minor hockey
Or the system needs to be changed to reign costs in.

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05-19-2017, 11:03 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
I dont have any children but, I could not afford to have them play hockey...

I cant remember where I've read this but they were estimating 12,000-15,000 a year to have one kid play hockey (Equipment, tuition, seminars, hotels, meals, gas...) and the price was almost double for elite AAA hockey

so if Canada (Mark Messier) wants more hockey players, they should comeup with some sort of programs to finance yearly cost for minor hockey
Yeah, those numbers about right, maybe a little high for a place like Toronto, Montreal, Winnipeg etc however there youve also got Spring/Summer Leagues, Clinics & Camps & that'll set you back several more thousands. In the US, Southern California etc, easily drop that & more if your kids on a "Travel Team". Basically Single A or AA level.... And ya, as Ive said, great, wonderful, but what comes next for these kids after going through the $200 "First Shift" program?... they grow, need all new equipment every other or every year, play in a reasonably priced House League, skills improving, wanna step up to A, AA or even AAA in some cases.... what then? Youd like to "think" that if some kid from the lower economic rungs would be perhaps "sponsored" in some way however, thats just not happening. It used to happen all the time up until the 70's early 80's but no longer. Organizations cant afford it.

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05-19-2017, 11:35 AM
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Still more than the Raptors, Blue Jays or anyone else have done.

Do we have stats on indian kids playing hockey? Anecdotally I play shinny every week in Pickering and there has always been lotsa brown guys playing with us. Hell I have been playing hockey with brown dudes since the 90's in Malvern.

Anyway, everything I hear from ex players is Messier is a total *****.
The Raptors have pit guys into the NBA. The make up of NHL players is largely the same as it was during the post expansion era, white kids from the suburbs of Toronto and Montreal. Messier is telling the truth here. Soccer is killing hockey youth wise.

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Malvern. Theres a name havent heard in years. Back in the 60's I played House League in Willowdale getting started at like 6 followed by several years in the then called MTHL playing AA (there was no AAA back then, AA, A & B). Even with inflation Registration Fee's & including game & practice ice-time a fraction of what they are today. Maybe $100 at the House League levels; $175 at the MTHL level. Equipment costs (I started as a skater but switched to goal) also a fraction of todays costs. CCM Tacks or Bauer Supremes new costing maybe $80 with lower range options such as CCM Mustang or Bauer Panther skates, excellent products ranging from about $30-60. Top end Cooper pads, GP 59's running maybe $200, GM 12 Blocker & Trapper (used by the pro's) about the same for a set with a lower range also available for a lot less in junior, intermediate & senior sizes. Sticks all wood of course, and you could buy a cheap Wally for shinny for like a $1.29 or 3 for $3 (straight blade) or a really good stick, Victoriaville, CCM, Northland Pro for anywhere from about $7.99 to $15. Back then there was more a sense of "community" in Toronto & elsewhere, equipment & skate exchanges (kids grow fast) also quite popular & you could find 1 season used Tacks or whatever for like five bucks & so on.... I got out of the game early 70's and noted that by the early to mid-80's costs had really begun to escalate for equipment, ice time & Registration Fee's, through the 90's & 00's reaching levels that only the well heeled could any longer afford.... So while I applaud this "first Shift" program as I mentioned above & yes, given Messiers rep, the fact his Sister is Bauer Director of Marketing, hard not to be somewhat cynical about this program as it fails to address what happens after the kids gone through the First Shift program yet cant go on as his folks cant afford it............ I mean on paper, looks good, 5000 kids so far & counting but whats the retention rate? How many do go on to Register in House or Rep Hockey Leagues?
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Originally Posted by SCBlueLiner View Post
I am convinced that Tier 1 and AAA were invented just so the rich could financially separate themselves from the rest of the hockey world and give their kids a leg up.
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Originally Posted by Killion View Post
.... thats certainly been the case in quite a few instances, yes. There was a guy in Toronto who bought up a bunch AAA teams, charging through the nose, running them for profit. Thing is his teams were winning so Parents were lining up with their checkbooks though fortunately the GTHL (formerly MTHL, THL) broke it up. Yet you still hear crazy stories. Coaches being paid 6 figures to coach Pee Wee, Bantam, Midget. Former NHL'r Rick Vaive for example. All kinds of nonsense like that & it still goes on.
Guys making the team because of family, etc. Happens even today although the number of hockey players hasn't increased that much.

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05-19-2017, 11:54 AM
  #44
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The Raptors have pit guys into the NBA. The make up of NHL players is largely the same as it was during the post expansion era, white kids from the suburbs of Toronto and Montreal. Messier is telling the truth here. Soccer is killing hockey youth wise.
What?!

Subban(s), Simmonds, Kadri, Byfuglien, Jones (who is actually a symptom of the real problem with all pro sports nowadays), Okposo, Daley, Ward, Kane, Ho-Sang, etc...

I don't disagree that soccer (and every other sport that doesn't require a trust fund) is eating hockey's lunch right now but to argue that nothing has changed since the 'post-expansion era' is absurd.

The problem facing hockey isn't even exclusive to hockey. Costs in all sports are pricing out any and everybody who doesn't have the money for elite training.....https://theundefeated.com/features/g...ge-basketball/

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05-19-2017, 01:17 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
I cant remember where I've read this but they were estimating 12,000-15,000 a year to have one kid play hockey (Equipment, tuition, seminars, hotels, meals, gas...) and the price was almost double for elite AAA hockey
As long as you understand that that number would still be for a pretty high level of competitive hockey, involving a lot of out of town travel. I pay about $1000/year total for my kid to play house league - $500+ for registration, $300 for team fees (tournaments, extra ice etc.) and around $200 to replace whatever piece of equipment he's grown out of (not everything, but there's something every year and get a lot of it used) plus tape and misc stuff. Parents voted to not have any tournaments requiring overnight stays, so we didn't go anywhere further than an hour or two away. If you want to add in some hockey camps, then add a few hundred.

My understanding is that you should be able to do low level competitive hockey for around $5K per year.

Hockey's not cheap but part of hockey's problem is that there's a perception that it's more expensive than it has to be.

It would also be helpful if competitive hockey, such as AAA, was a lot more selective than they are today. There are a lot of people out there chasing the dream and paying out the nose who really don't have a hope in hell of being selected in a CHL draft or landing the full ride D1 scholarship. Organizations and business people are using these people as ATMs and while they should be free to spend their money as they see fit, they better end up with some great memories and life lessons because most of the time, that's all you're left with while you play in the beer leagues!

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05-19-2017, 01:21 PM
  #46
Melrose Munch
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Originally Posted by Pilky01 View Post
What?!

Subban(s), Simmonds, Kadri, Byfuglien, Jones (who is actually a symptom of the real problem with all pro sports nowadays), Okposo, Daley, Ward, Kane, Ho-Sang, etc...

I don't disagree that soccer (and every other sport that doesn't require a trust fund) is eating hockey's lunch right now but to argue that nothing has changed since the 'post-expansion era' is absurd.

The problem facing hockey isn't even exclusive to hockey. Costs in all sports are pricing out any and everybody who doesn't have the money for elite training.....https://theundefeated.com/features/g...ge-basketball/
There are still less then 100 black players. Less then 50 iranian players. Almost no indo canadian and little chinese or japanese canadian Compared that to the amount of kids interested in basketball, soccer, etc. The costs are too much and only the upper middle class and rich can afford it.

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05-19-2017, 01:22 PM
  #47
BadgerBruce
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Originally Posted by Killion View Post
.... so his Sister is the Director of Marketing for Bauer whior... so they come out with this "First Shift" program; $199 gets a kid dressed from tip to toe and includes 6 introductory on-ice sessions... Ok. Thats brilliant, great. But how can they do that, manufacture & sell a complete outfit, all new including skates, a stick, shin, shoulder & elbow pads, gloves, socks/pants/jersey, helmet & cage PLUS 6 on ice sessions for two hundred bucks all in . . .
Its a wonderful ideal, "First Shift" like the NHLPA's "Dreams & Goals" program that you cant help but applaud. But what comes after for these kids & their parents are costs & investments in time that only the Upper Middle Classes can any longer afford.... And of course it wasnt always so.
We've had this discussion a few times in the past, but still it is important to remind everyone that the "Bauer First Shift" initiative (originally named "Bauer First Assist") is NOT a philanthropic program in any way.

No, the program is part of a negotiated settlement Bauer reached with the Canadian Competition Bureau to avoid hefty fines (and horrible press) after the CCB concluded that Bauer's Canadian advertising of its RE-AKT helmets misrepresented the bucket's ability to reduce concussions.

The CCB ruling is here:

http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/e...eng/03839.html

There's lots more about that story (anyone ever heard of Messier's M-11 Helmet? Not a bauer product .....and no longer even mentioned by ol' #11 himself), but I wouldn't give Bauer much credit here. Their negotiated settlement with the Competition Bureau was a gift.

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Old
05-19-2017, 01:29 PM
  #48
Davegarri
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Change the whole sport from Ice to Roller. From youth to the NHL. That'll cut back on ice costs and rinks having to pay energy bills to keep it cold.

All you need is boards and a tile floor that needs to be mopped every now and then.


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Old
05-19-2017, 01:40 PM
  #49
joelef
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Originally Posted by Pilky01 View Post
Does any other North American sports league have regularly broadcasts in Punjabi?

How exactly is the NHL "ignoring" the "changing demographic"?
no but they have spanish tv deals to try get very fast growing hispanic market. The NHL is the only NA league without one.

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05-19-2017, 01:43 PM
  #50
joelef
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Originally Posted by Pilky01 View Post
What?!

Subban(s), Simmonds, Kadri, Byfuglien, Jones (who is actually a symptom of the real problem with all pro sports nowadays), Okposo, Daley, Ward, Kane, Ho-Sang, etc...

I don't disagree that soccer (and every other sport that doesn't require a trust fund) is eating hockey's lunch right now but to argue that nothing has changed since the 'post-expansion era' is absurd.

The problem facing hockey isn't even exclusive to hockey. Costs in all sports are pricing out any and everybody who doesn't have the money for elite training.....https://theundefeated.com/features/g...ge-basketball/
and the NHL does jack squat to market them.

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