HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Expansion Draft Discussion Part III - The Final Haul

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-19-2017, 07:49 AM
  #826
WhiskeySeven
Enlarged member
 
WhiskeySeven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 23,657
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Dumping his salary would be great for us. He's done next to nothing the past two seasons. He's been a great soldier for us over his time but freeing up 6 mil in cap space for a player who isn't near worth the cash is a good thing. Even if he does bounce back, it's time for us to move on.
I'm down on Pleks but he hasn't done nothing. He plays tough minutes regularly. He's not effective or efficient or even good two-ways, but he does play hard minutes. I don't trust non-NHLer JDLR in that role, for instance.

WhiskeySeven is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 07:51 AM
  #827
get25
Registered User
 
get25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 1,248
vCash: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Michaels View Post
I read yesterday that with Staal exposed by Minnesota, an idea for Bergevin would be to have Vegas select Plekanec, then select Staal from Minnesota and offer them compensation to trade Staal to Montreal.
Getting Staal makes us a contender.

Even without Radulov:
Staal + Drouin >> Radulov.

Even if they don't take Plekanec (great third line center).

Now, if they take Plek, we could try to sign Radulov.
Then we have a really great offense.

get25 is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 08:11 AM
  #828
get25
Registered User
 
get25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 1,248
vCash: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Dumping his salary would be great for us. He's done next to nothing the past two seasons. He's been a great soldier for us over his time but freeing up 6 mil in cap space for a player who isn't near worth the cash is a good thing. Even if he does bounce back, it's time for us to move on.
Scored 54 points in the previous season.

I know his 28 points last season was really bad but saying he has done nothing for us in the past two seasons is totally lacking judgement and honesty.

There is at least 20 forwards who are paid 6M and more, are nowhere near Plek in defense and did not scored 54 points last season.
Actually, in this list of centers with 54 points or less, most of them are paid 6M and more.

Now, I agree that 28 points this season was really bad.

But the six previous seasons gave us: 57, 52, 33 (pace 58), 43, 60 and 54 for 5M X 6 years.
Pretty good deal if you ask me.
I do not remember so many complaining after the deal was signed BTW.

get25 is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 08:17 AM
  #829
417
7 day theory
 
417's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ottawa
Country: Haiti
Posts: 28,919
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by get25 View Post
Scored 54 points in the previous season.

I know his 28 points last season was really bad but saying he has done nothing for us in the past two seasons is totally lacking judgement and honesty.

There is at least 20 forwards who are paid 6M and more, are nowhere near Plek in defense and did not scored 54 points last season.
Actually, in this list of centers with 54 points or less, most of them are paid 6M and more.

Now, I agree that 28 points this season was really bad.

But the six previous seasons gave us: 57, 52, 33 (pace 58), 43, 60 and 54 for 5M X 6 years.
Pretty good deal if you ask me.
I do not remember so many complaining after the deal was signed BTW.
About half of that total was accumulated before December 1st of that year...basically, he's got roughly 50pts in the last 140 or so nhl games.

Given no other center on the Habs has come close to the amount of playing time he's gotten during that time, it's downright embarrassing.

417 is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 08:34 AM
  #830
Miller Time
Registered User
 
Miller Time's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
and what has that gotten the Habs?



or maybe the GM should of used Plekanec in order to acquire additional assets to acquire a top 6 talent AND allow Galchenyuk more icetime to progress as a center.



I'm not blaming the player for his cap hit, his cap hit is a direct result of being overused for years thus creating an artificial contract value that he was obviously never going to be able to live up too.

again, this was VERY predictable...i've been saying we'd be where we are today for YEARS.
Well there are many blunders made by our GM these past few seasons that were predictably bad... some try to argue that only hindsight allows for such criticism but I, like you, recognize that many of Bergevin's mistakes were clear from the start.

Miller Time is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 08:40 AM
  #831
HTTP 400
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,163
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
In the past 5 years, Plekanec has played a large number of games as a top 6 C for the Czech national team, and never looked out of place.

Perhaps had our GM actually addressed the need for top 6 talent that was present when he arrived, and remains today, pleks productivity during the same stretch would have been more consistent.

& Even if you disagree with that, instead of blaming the player for his cap hit, maybe you should focus on the actual decision maker...
Yeah, but 0 points in his last 11 game at international level. Plekanec isn't a bad player, but he should be considered a shudown center at this stage of his carrer. Expecting him to be a #2 is asking too much of him. His cap hit of 6M makes him very pricey for his role...

HTTP 400 is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 08:44 AM
  #832
le_sean
Registered User
 
le_sean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ottawa
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 18,954
vCash: 612
Quote:
Originally Posted by vokiel View Post
They won't select Staal when Dumba is available.
I think they will give up someone like Tuch to keep Dumba.

Then Montreal can trade McCarron and a 1st for Staal.

So Vegas gets Tuch, McCarron and a 1st. Maybe they value that more than Dumba. Two young, NHL ready and big bodied prospects plus a 1st rounder (just spitballing here). They have a lot of other defenders to choose from.

le_sean is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 08:50 AM
  #833
ForeverTherrien
grindingforeternity
 
ForeverTherrien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 7,929
vCash: 456
Quote:
Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
I think they will give up someone like Tuch to keep Dumba.

Then Montreal can trade McCarron and a 1st for Staal.

So Vegas gets Tuch, McCarron and a 1st. Maybe they value that more than Dumba. Two young, NHL ready and big bodied prospects plus a 1st rounder (just spitballing here). They have a lot of other defenders to choose from.
I wouldn't pass on Dumba for anything less than a gigantic overpayment if I'm Vegas.

ForeverTherrien is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 09:40 AM
  #834
Agalloch
EliteProspects
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Lachute, QC
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,777
vCash: 500
Crazy.


Agalloch is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 09:48 AM
  #835
Lafleurs Guy
Global Moderator
 
Lafleurs Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 43,019
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by get25 View Post
Scored 54 points in the previous season.
But he went AWOL when we really needed him. 24 points in 25 games and then fell off a cliff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by get25 View Post
I know his 28 points last season was really bad but saying he has done nothing for us in the past two seasons is totally lacking judgement and honesty.

There is at least 20 forwards who are paid 6M and more, are nowhere near Plek in defense and did not scored 54 points last season.
Actually, in this list of centers with 54 points or less, most of them are paid 6M and more.

Now, I agree that 28 points this season was really bad.

But the six previous seasons gave us: 57, 52, 33 (pace 58), 43, 60 and 54 for 5M X 6 years.
Pretty good deal if you ask me.
I do not remember so many complaining after the deal was signed BTW.
Even if I take back him sucking in 2016 he sucked ass this year for sure. He's 34 and we can't rely on him to be a 2nd line center anymore which is what he's being paid to be. It's time to move on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
I'm down on Pleks but he hasn't done nothing. He plays tough minutes regularly. He's not effective or efficient or even good two-ways, but he does play hard minutes. I don't trust non-NHLer JDLR in that role, for instance.
28 points.... sorry but no.

And btw, if he leaves and we don't replace him due to our GM's incompetence, I will not accept that letting him go was the wrong thing to do. Ditching him is the right move now. It's up to our GM to replace him.

__________________
- 40,000 & counting...
Lafleurs Guy is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 09:48 AM
  #836
Victorius
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 2,966
vCash: 500
that 2017 expansion draft is a joke, a circus....

How come a new team can have so much power on thefuture of 30 other ones ?

Victorius is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 09:51 AM
  #837
le_sean
Registered User
 
le_sean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ottawa
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 18,954
vCash: 612
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victorius View Post
that 2017 expansion draft is a joke, a circus....

How come a new team can have so much power on thefuture of 30 other ones ?
Wait for the 32nd team, then we will see this again.

I do enjoy this whole thing, mostly because the Habs won't lose anyone important. But I do find it a bit ridiculous that teams need to give up assets to keep their own players that they (for the most part) drafted and developed.

le_sean is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 09:55 AM
  #838
Puck Luck Run Amok
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: The void
Country: Canada
Posts: 338
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by get25 View Post
Getting Staal makes us a contender.

Even without Radulov:
Staal + Drouin >> Radulov.

Even if they don't take Plekanec (great third line center).

Now, if they take Plek, we could try to sign Radulov.
Then we have a really great offense.
I'd agree with you if Staal hadn't had a devastating concussion in the playoffs last year. Would be shocked to see him thrive after that.

Puck Luck Run Amok is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:05 AM
  #839
Burke the Legend
Registered User
 
Burke the Legend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,559
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
You guys don't have to take it from me...

Even Bob MacKenzie just scoffed at the idea that the Habs could get a 1st round pick for Plekanec.
The Habs wouldn't do it because the team is win-now. They aren't going to hold onto Plekanec just to flip him, they need good centermen all season long, and they need to know now who their guys are for next spring.

If Martin Hanzal, a player who is about equal to Plekanec, arguably worse, can get a 1st and a 2nd then so could Pleks. Depends a lot on market supply/demand at deadline, obviously, but I don't see how it's as far-fetched as MacKenzie thinks.

Burke the Legend is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:18 AM
  #840
417
7 day theory
 
417's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ottawa
Country: Haiti
Posts: 28,919
vCash: 500
Quote:
The Habs wouldn't do it because the team is win-now. They aren't going to hold onto Plekanec just to flip him, they need good centermen all season long, and they need to know now who their guys are for next spring.
How many bottom 6 centers do the Habs need? Because right now, that's ALL they have on their roster

- Plekanec
- Danault
- Mitchell
- McCarron
- De la Rose

All of these players are bottom 6 centers. They have 5 bodies for 2 spots.
Quote:
If Martin Hanzal, a player who is about equal to Plekanec, arguably worse, can get a 1st and a 2nd then so could Pleks.
In what world is Hanzal equal and even more laughable, arguably worse, than Tomas Plekanec?

Man, he's been overrated here for so long, but you'd think after the season he just had that people would finally realize how overrated he is, but no. Clearly not.

Hanzal got a 1st and 2nd because he's a better player, he's bigger, younger, cheaper, stronger, basically better at everything compared to Plekanec today.

It's not even up for debate.
Quote:
Depends a lot on market supply/demand at deadline, obviously, but I don't see how it's as far-fetched as MacKenzie thinks.
Of all people who cover the NHL, I'd say MacKenzie has the pulse of player value moreso than anyone else.

I think it's far-fetched (and that's putting it lightly) to think the Habs could get a 1st round pick for Plekanec, let a lot a 1st AND a 2nd.

417 is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:25 AM
  #841
Kafka
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Montreal
Country: Martinique
Posts: 5,301
vCash: 500
The timming of Hudon's signing + Drouin's trade now makes me believe that Bergevin made Hudon super attractive to Vegas so that McPhee pics him and leaves the team with Plekanec and Emelin.

I mean, there most be a reason why Bergevin gave a contract to Hudon that fast while Lindgren, Galchenyuk and De La Rose are left RFAs prior to the expansion draft.

If that's the case, either I made a wrong analysis of Hudon's top end talent, either my hypothesis is wrong, and Bergevin gave McPhee a little candy so he pics another player instead of Hudon. We'll know the answer within 24 hours.

Kafka is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:29 AM
  #842
habaholic
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,124
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kafka View Post
The timming of Hudon's signing + Drouin's trade now makes me believe that Bergevin made Hudon super attractive to Vegas so that McPhee pics him and leaves the team with Plekanec and Emelin.

I mean, there most be a reason why Bergevin gave a contract to Hudon that fast while Lindgren, Galchenyuk and De La Rose are left RFAs prior to the expansion draft.

If that's the case, either I made a wrong analysis of Hudon's top end talent, either my hypothesis is wrong, and Bergevin gave McPhee a little candy so he pics another player instead of Hudon. We'll know the answer within 24 hours.
It's the complete opposite. A 2 year contract with the 2nd year a 1-way makes him far less attractive to another team. The longer the term, the more the risk, especially with an unproven player such as Hudon. Add the 1-way and it adds to the risk as you absolutely have to pay him NHL $$$.

habaholic is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:32 AM
  #843
Uncle Gary
Habs/Preds
 
Uncle Gary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 3,208
vCash: 500
It is not so much losing Hudon that bothers me but rather that we won't lose Plekanec or Emelin. Had Hudon been protected over Shaw, there would be a much better chance of Plekanec going. I also would have protected Davidson over Benn.

Uncle Gary is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:35 AM
  #844
Deebs
Registered User
 
Deebs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,597
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Gary View Post
It is not so much losing Hudon that bothers me but rather that we won't lose Plekanec or Emelin. Had Hudon been protected over Shaw, there would be a much better chance of Plekanec going. I also would have protected Davidson over Benn.
And this is why you're the commissioner of the league instead of a GM

Deebs is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:39 AM
  #845
DDs not undersized
Former Partisan duCH
 
DDs not undersized's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bangkok
Country: Thailand
Posts: 3,599
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victorius View Post
that 2017 expansion draft is a joke, a circus....

How come a new team can have so much power on thefuture of 30 other ones ?
I'm starting to think that might be the reason why Quebec City didn't get an expansion team. They want Las Vegas to be a winning team right from the start and they made up expansion draft rules accordingly. It's their shiny new team in the game capital and they want it to be an instant success in this new market. If they gave a team to Quebec City too, they wouldn't need to make such a favorable expansion draft. They could afford to give a bad team to Quebec City and the arena would still be full every night.

I'm willing to bet that if Quebec gets an expansion team another year, expansion draft rules will be restricted so they cannot have so many good players.

DDs not undersized is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:40 AM
  #846
Kafka
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Montreal
Country: Martinique
Posts: 5,301
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by habaholic View Post
It's the complete opposite. A 2 year contract with the 2nd year a 1-way makes him far less attractive to another team. The longer the term, the more the risk, especially with an unproven player such as Hudon. Add the 1-way and it adds to the risk as you absolutely have to pay him NHL $$$.
Huge risk yes... One year at 650 000 $.

Come on.

Kafka is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:42 AM
  #847
habaholic
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,124
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kafka View Post
Huge risk yes... One year at 650 000 $.

Come on.
2 years --> my point!

2 years is riskier than 1 year (hence the extension)

Last year is a 1-way

habaholic is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:44 AM
  #848
DDs not undersized
Former Partisan duCH
 
DDs not undersized's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bangkok
Country: Thailand
Posts: 3,599
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kafka View Post
The timming of Hudon's signing + Drouin's trade now makes me believe that Bergevin made Hudon super attractive to Vegas so that McPhee pics him and leaves the team with Plekanec and Emelin.

I mean, there most be a reason why Bergevin gave a contract to Hudon that fast while Lindgren, Galchenyuk and De La Rose are left RFAs prior to the expansion draft.

If that's the case, either I made a wrong analysis of Hudon's top end talent, either my hypothesis is wrong, and Bergevin gave McPhee a little candy so he pics another player instead of Hudon. We'll know the answer within 24 hours.
It's funny because I thought the exact opposite, that Hudon's signing makes him less attractive to Vegas. By giving him a one way deal on the 2nd year, Vegas will have to think twice before selecting him because that's not a player they can keep in the AHL for too long. They have many other proven NHL players available to fill their roster already, and while they will also select many AHL players with upside, they'll want to make sure that these players can play in the AHL if they're not good enough to make the NHL roster.

DDs not undersized is offline  
Old
06-19-2017, 10:48 AM
  #849
BaseballCoach
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,278
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
I'm down on Pleks but he hasn't done nothing. He plays tough minutes regularly. He's not effective or efficient or even good two-ways, but he does play hard minutes. I don't trust non-NHLer JDLR in that role, for instance.
I think Danault can take some tough minutes, and meanwhile Drouin and Galchenyuk and DeLaRose should play and learn during the regular season. The Habs do have Mitchell as insurance. If at the TDL, MB thinks we need another defensive specialist C, he can probably find one not too expensively.

BaseballCoach is online now  
Old
06-19-2017, 11:13 AM
  #850
deandebean
Registered User
 
deandebean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Gatineau
Country: uriname
Posts: 15,328
vCash: 500
If LV picks up Plekanec, I'll be happy. It means the GM has money to spend on a true centre and/or more offensive ammo. Best scenario here. Would make for an exciting 2 weeks of NHL rumors.

deandebean is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:37 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. @2017 All Rights Reserved.