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All-Time Oilers vs. All-Time Penguins

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Old
06-18-2017, 10:50 PM
  #1
Thenameless
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All-Time Oilers vs. All-Time Penguins

This is an interesting comparison. Neither team is an Original 6 franchise, and they've both won the same number of Cups. So, which team would win? And please let me know if I've made a glaring omission and we'll fix up the teams. The only thing to keep in mind is that you get the player when he played his best season for that time. So, for instance, the Oilers have a better version of Paul Coffey.

Edmonton Oilers

Ryan Smyth - Wayne Gretzky - Jari Kurri
Craig Simpson - Mark Messier - Glenn Anderson
Taylor Hall - Connor McDavid - Bill Guerin
Esa Tikkanen - Doug Weight - Jason Arnott

Paul Coffey - Kevin Lowe
Charlie Huddy - Chris Pronger
Jason Smith - Steve Smith

Grant Fuhr
Bill Ranford

Pittsburgh Penguins

Kevin Stevens - Mario Lemieux - Rick Tocchet
Joe Mullen - Ron Francis - Jaromir Jagr
Evgeni Malkin - Sidney Crosby - Mark Recchi
Rick Kehoe - Syl Apps - Jean Pronovost

Larry Murphy - Paul Coffey
Kris Letang - Ulf Samuelsson
Ron Stackhouse - Randy Carlyle

Matt Murray
Tom Barrasso

I tried keeping players in their proper positions, but moved Malkin to LW and Arnott to RW to make better teams. Let's discuss!

Edit: I've been swayed to replace Kasparaitis with Randy Carlyle. A Norris winner who spent significant time with the team should not be left off of this list. I've also decided to replace Marc Andre Fleury with Matt Murray. Fleury's long tenure with the team since he was drafted is tough to pass up, but I'd actually feel better starting him over Fleury or Barrasso. Like Pronger for Edmonton, he's done just about all that can be expected from a player that hasn't been with the team for a long time.


Last edited by Thenameless: 06-20-2017 at 02:46 AM.
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Old
06-18-2017, 11:00 PM
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The Panther
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Holy cow, it's like The Justice League with these two...

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Old
06-18-2017, 11:07 PM
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Thenameless
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Yes, these teams would demolish real all-star teams (as long as none of these players are on them). Scary stuff really. Having Pronger on the Oilers is scary; that one year makes the Oilers a lot stronger imho.

I had to leave off guys like Petr Klima, Draisatl, RNH, Alexei Kovalev, Martin Straka, Moog, Gonchar, Matt Murray, Jordan Staal. And I wanted players representing different eras of greatness.

And I know Scotty Bowman coached the Pens for a while, but I'd want Badger Bob Johnson and Glen Sather as the bench bosses for this epic match.


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06-18-2017, 11:09 PM
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I'd pay to watch this hypothetical series

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06-18-2017, 11:44 PM
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The Panther
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thenameless View Post
Edmonton Oilers

Ryan Smyth - Wayne Gretzky - Jari Kurri
Craig Simpson - Mark Messier - Glenn Anderson
Taylor Hall - Connor McDavid - Bill Guerin
Esa Tikkanen - Doug Weight - Jason Arnott

Paul Coffey - Kevin Lowe
Charlie Huddy - Chris Pronger
Jason Smith - Steve Smith

Grant Fuhr
Bill Ranford
Love Ranford, but maybe I'll pull him off to have Curtis Joseph. Hm, tough call...

Bear in mind that Kent Nilsson played with the Oilers for about 4 months (mostly in 1987) when he was 30. So I think you'd have to add him to their roster, which is already scary enough. Some people consider Nilsson one of the most talented players of all time -- sort of akin to Alex Kovalev (with similar disappearing acts of consistency, but don't worry, Messier will take care of that!). Nilsson was the Flames' best forward for about six years, including a 131-point season.

I personally would get rid of Kevin Lowe. He was pretty good circa 1981 to 1987, but even then he was slow and prone to lazy slip-ups on defence. But maybe that's just my spite for his inexplicable incompetency in PR as an Oilers' executive in recent years...

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Old
06-19-2017, 12:06 AM
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No kovalev. When he wanted to play he was damn good. To me it's a wash really. This would be the greatest series in NHL history for sure.

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06-19-2017, 12:07 AM
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Idk. If we can peak each player at peak form. So a 91-92 playoff lemieux. 16-17 playoff crosby. And 08-09 playoff Malkin. That would be unreal...

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06-19-2017, 12:30 AM
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Idk. If we can peak each player at peak form. So a 91-92 playoff lemieux. 16-17 playoff crosby. And 08-09 playoff Malkin. That would be unreal...
Yes, you get all of them at their best, but only when playing for that team. Also, you only get one "version" of that player. You don't get 92-goal Gretzky with 163-assist Gretzky. You can choose a playoff year if you want. Like you, I'd choose a Lemieux that won the Stanley Cup over 199-point Lemieux.

It's almost unthinkable that an Oiler team with Gretzky on it might actually have slightly less firepower than the opposition, but that might actually be the case here. It would be interesting to revisit this after McDavid's career has played out a bit, like say in 12-15 years. Is he another Crosby - a little more, a little perhaps? Does he flame out? Or does he take off and make it a Big 5?


Last edited by Thenameless: 06-19-2017 at 12:36 AM.
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06-19-2017, 01:42 AM
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Brian Leetch was an Oiler for a few months.

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06-19-2017, 02:15 AM
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Holy cow, it's like The Justice League with these two...
Except the defense is kind of weak considering it's an all time team.

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06-19-2017, 03:31 AM
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It'd be no fun if you had perfect teams. I can imagine a beautiful, high scoring, creative affair a la the 1987 Canada Cup. Legendary offenses with decent goaltending and suspect defenses.

I find it amusing that everyone's being decent/shy about declaring a winner. Just saying that it would a spectacle is probably where it's best left at.

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06-19-2017, 05:02 AM
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The D and G would win it fot Oilers in my opinion (F os unreal on both sides,msybe little in favor of PIT..Crosby&Malkin on 3rd line...)

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06-19-2017, 06:50 AM
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Both Gonchar and Zubov are far better choices then Kasper. Gonch was at his best in Pitt, it's really understated just how much of an impact he had on those great teams.

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06-19-2017, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisen View Post
Except the defense is kind of weak considering it's an all time team.
I don't think it's weak at all. You've got Coffey and Pronger on the power-play...?

Steve Smith and young Charlie Huddy to round out the top-4.

Jason Smith was rock solid. It's that 6th defenceman spot where I'm having trouble coming up with the best candidate...

Think of it this way: When the Oilers didn't have Gretzky or Coffey or Pronger, they won the Stanley Cup. Defense was good.

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06-19-2017, 07:56 AM
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With respect to Grant Fuhr and Bill Ranford, I would give consideration to starting Curtis Joseph.

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06-19-2017, 08:06 AM
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That would be a crazy series.Both defense are rather weak.Would be an offensive circus.

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06-19-2017, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Panther View Post
I don't think it's weak at all. You've got Coffey and Pronger on the power-play...?

Steve Smith and young Charlie Huddy to round out the top-4.

Jason Smith was rock solid. It's that 6th defenceman spot where I'm having trouble coming up with the best candidate...

Think of it this way: When the Oilers didn't have Gretzky or Coffey or Pronger, they won the Stanley Cup. Defense was good.
Coffey, true. But then you have a season worth of Pronger. I don't know how much that counts. For what it's worth, it was one of his best seasons, in my opinion. Smith and Huddy are fine players, just not what I would expect in an alltime lineup. It's better than the Pens D, though.

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06-19-2017, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Panther View Post
I don't think it's weak at all. You've got Coffey and Pronger on the power-play...?

Steve Smith and young Charlie Huddy to round out the top-4.

Jason Smith was rock solid. It's that 6th defenceman spot where I'm having trouble coming up with the best candidate...

Think of it this way: When the Oilers didn't have Gretzky or Coffey or Pronger, they won the Stanley Cup. Defense was good.
I'd probably have Roman Hamrlik instead of Jason Smith. I mean, they were about the same age, were teammates for a few seasons and Smith was never used as much as Hamrlik was at any point as an Oiler.

J. Smith was an Oiler for longer though.

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06-19-2017, 11:30 AM
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The Penguins got my vote, still 2 very equal rosters here.

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06-19-2017, 11:34 AM
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Pens have two cup era rosters to draw from, hence i think they would come out ahead.

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06-19-2017, 02:44 PM
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With respect to Grant Fuhr and Bill Ranford, I would give consideration to starting Curtis Joseph.
With all due respect to Cujo, he's up against a Vezina winning HOFer in Fuhr and a Stanley Cup (1990) and Canada Cup (1991) MVP in Ranford. Sorry, no chance.

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06-19-2017, 04:59 PM
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With all due respect to Cujo, he's up against a Vezina winning HOFer in Fuhr and a Stanley Cup (1990) and Canada Cup (1991) MVP in Ranford. Sorry, no chance.
They were goaltenders on a dynasty winning those accolades; Joseph was the most important player on upsets over 15-point and 23-point favorites in Colorado and Dallas. You don't bring Bill Ranford to a Jaromir Jagr fight. Joseph thrives in high-SA environments, while Ranford had the Oilers outside of the playoffs four-straight years after the top players left. He wasn't necessarily the problem, but he's also not any type of solution unless he plays exactly like he did for a very, very small window of his Oilers career.

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06-19-2017, 05:24 PM
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The Panther
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Pens have two cup era rosters to draw from, hence i think they would come out ahead.
Well, the Oilers have 1984 and 1990, which are almost like different eras, and then 1994 as well (not to mention game-7 of the Finals run in 2006), plus McDavid.

Somewhere in hockey heaven, this will be the ultimate game of shinny.

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06-19-2017, 08:11 PM
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Penguins have more depth offensively. Just look at that 3rd line. Oilers are better defensively, imo.

Jason Arnott at wing would be interesting. I don't remember him being the fastest skater in the league. Also, shouldn't Kessel get some consideration? He played in Pittsburgh one more season than Pronger did in Edmonton.

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06-19-2017, 09:40 PM
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Originally Posted by quoipourquoi View Post
They were goaltenders on a dynasty winning those accolades; Joseph was the most important player on upsets over 15-point and 23-point favorites in Colorado and Dallas. You don't bring Bill Ranford to a Jaromir Jagr fight. Joseph thrives in high-SA environments, while Ranford had the Oilers outside of the playoffs four-straight years after the top players left. He wasn't necessarily the problem, but he's also not any type of solution unless he plays exactly like he did for a very, very small window of his Oilers career.
I struggled with this one too. CuJo was very good. The other one I considered was Moog, as he really was the perfect 1B to Fuhr. Sometimes, it's not necessarily the best outright player, but also how well he fits the roll/team. On this team, I have Fuhr as the clear starter even though there are other candidates.

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