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Who gets claimed by Vegas?

View Poll Results: Who go?
Plekanec 107 30.48%
Emelin 55 15.67%
Davidson 29 8.26%
DeLarose 28 7.98%
Hudon 122 34.76%
others 10 2.85%
Voters: 351. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-19-2017, 01:46 PM
  #226
ForeverTherrien
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
Hudon, without question, because I've seen this act played out too many times. Byron will fade into oblivion. I doubt LV takes Byron if given the chance, there is a ton of talent out there that can be had.
if you think they'll let it go you're mad
(you got another thing comin)

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06-19-2017, 01:49 PM
  #227
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Originally Posted by dmanfish90 View Post
Okay, now that I have had time to read all of these ridiculous posts (except for LaP and Lebowski I would say and some others). Here's how I look at everything over the past season and this offseason.

Beaulieu:

The guy I believe started on the 2nd D pairing w/ Petry and did not perform well. He did so because I believe Emelin was injured/not performing at times in the season as well. The guy was placed on the 3rd D pairing w/ Pateryn and then Benn and again was not performing. The guy was drafted 6 years ago so he would be 24 now. The guy, IMO, obviously his offensive skill was good but not nearly good enough when he was scouted as a QMJHL hockey player in Saint John. His defence was terrible IMO, especially for a guy on the 3rd D pairing. Getting a 3rd round pick is unfortunate given his potential, but I think it's an ok return. Since we got rid of Sergachev for Drouin though (essentially since I believe those conditional picks will not be exchanged), I believe it's a tad stupid to trade away a defenseman who IMO hasn't even reached his prime yet, a LHD that we are now going to be in need of since Davidson may even be claimed by LV in the ED.

Shaw

Look, I believe that MB slightly overpaid for this guy. This guy is a bottom 6 player who looks out of place sometimes on the 2nd line if he ever played there last year (not sure). The guy is a strong 3RW who brings grinding, penalty killing and some PP net front presence as well. Problem is and also can agree that he did take some bad penalties.

Hudon

I can only say that I watched him in some of the games he played with us in Montreal and not at all in Saint John's or possibly Hamilton. Looking at his stats and thinking about his time in Montreal with the big club, I can say that this year was not at all a step backward being 43rd in points in the AHL. Of the 42 people above him in the points standings, the only people to play less games than him were Brendan Leipsic of Toronto, Paul Carey of Hershey and Tim Heed of San Jose. PTS/G based on playing at least half a season or more (38+ games), he ranks 25th. Goals he ranks T-7th. So I don't frankly understand all this negative hype about Hudon. He should've been protected. Problem is that he doesn't play RW, AFAIK. So for RW you have to protect Gallagher and Shaw otherwise there's a hole, unless Chucky, Drouin, Lekhonen or Hudon can play that position. Therefore I believe it was in the best position of MB to protect Shaw. However if he doesn't have a deal in place to protect Hudon, he's an idiot. If LV picks Hudon, it's just another bone headed move by MB.

Next, with regards to who should be picked by LV. In their POV, they should pick either Plekanec, Hudon or Davidson for the following reasons:

1) Plekanec is a TDL rental acquisition waiting to happen. If he picks up his play from last season, he easily has 2nd round draft pick value. If he doesn't however, it's a bust and he gets 3rd or worse draft pick value.

2) As I mentioned above, Hudon is the best roster player to keep.

3) Davidson is IMO better than Emelin in that he is young, should be able to play at least top 6 minutes now for a LV team. Emelin does not add value to LV unless they make the playoffs in their first year, where his hard-hitting play comes into effect. His defence is horrible, his foot speed is terrible and his offence is negligible.

Lastly, Drouin and Chucky. Problem I have with the deal (and it's a minor problem I think) is that Drouin and Chucky are (as of last season with their respective clubs) LWs. They aren't centermen. We're missing a #1C. Pleks is not that and neither is Danault. So with that the following should happen:

1) Put Galchenyuk back at #1C playing with Patches and Radulov. We know what he could do with Patches. Problem is he really needs to work on the defensive side of his game. And I mean a lot. He could be a #1 offensive C. Otherwise stick him on the wing.
2) Trade Chucky for either defense or an actual #1C along with a first round pick and a prospect.

The Drouin trade is an amazing deal. Still needs to address D issues and #1C issues.

That's it. Oh and Plekanec if we get to keep needs to be traded at the TDL unless he picks his play up big time this year or we're out of contention. Same thing goes for Benn in terms of contention. That's about it. Our LW is now too deep. Something needs to happen here.
There is almost nothing to agree with in your post.

Beaulieu did not fetch an adequate return, according to the stats on how often draft picks make the NHL and play 225 games in their whole career, never mind by age 24.

Hudon can't skate at the NHL level. That's why he didn't make the NHL, or get the chances that deLaRose and Andrighetto got.

Drouin should be tried at C. You overlooked that.

Plekanec can be traded at the deadline if Habs are out of contention but not Benn ! Jordie has a second year remaining on his cheap contract, why trade him???

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06-19-2017, 01:54 PM
  #228
Captain97
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A journalist from Vegas suggested pleky as a target for the team this morning on the forum, don't remember his name but he seemed unaware of Hudon's existence. The reasoning was not many centres are unprotected and he thinks pleky would net a decent return at the TDL next year.

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Old
06-19-2017, 01:55 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrimStone64 View Post
Lemay said today on 690 it will be Plekanec.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrimStone64 View Post
Said he talked to McPhee. They think they can get a first round pick for Plekanec at the trade deadline. Said they can't get that value for Hudon, Emelin, DLR, etc...
Thank you! Long live the common sense...

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Old
06-19-2017, 01:58 PM
  #230
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
Hudon, without question, because I've seen this act played out too many times. Byron will fade into oblivion. I doubt LV takes Byron if given the chance, there is a ton of talent out there that can be had.
You have deluded yourself completely.

Paul Byron is by far the better player, and even the better OFFENSIVE player.

Yes, he had injury issues in his early pro career, but here are the stats for their final two years of Junior, both in the Q:

Byron - 167 points in 116 games
Hudon - 137 points in 115 games

I bet you didn't know that! Byron was over 1.54 ppg his final season!

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06-19-2017, 02:01 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
You have deluded yourself completely.

Paul Byron is by far the better player, and even the better OFFENSIVE player.

Yes, he had injury issues in his early pro career, but here are the stats for their final two years of Junior, both in the Q:

Byron - 167 points in 116 games
Hudon - 137 points in 115 games

I bet you didn't know that! Byron was over 1.54 ppg his final season!
Not sure how that's relevant... Max Talbot was a 1.5PPG player in the Q in his final season too.

As far as offensive skill goes, I think Hudon is a better shooter and a much better playmaker than Byron.

Obviously, Byron is an incredible skater, which is what makes him effective. On the PP, though, I'd have Hudon on the ice before Byron.

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Old
06-19-2017, 02:04 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Lebowski View Post
As Galchenyuk's days as a Habs might be coming to an end, he's the poster child of how you shouldn't develop a talented young player.
WTF??

How did Galchenyuk not develop?? Until Kopitar injured his knee, he was fifth in league scoring with 45 points in his past 46 games and a +9.

He was still over 0.7 ppg over the two complete seasons.

If he trains well this off-season, I'm expecting another big year from him.

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06-19-2017, 02:06 PM
  #233
Lebowski
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
WTF??

How did Galchenyuk not develop?? Until Kopitar injured his knee, he was fifth in league scoring with 45 points in his past 46 games and a +9.

He was still over 0.7 ppg over the two complete seasons.

If he trains well this off-season, I'm expecting another big year from him.
And we're still wondering if he's a winger or a center 5 years into his career.

Not making the transition at center sooner is inexcusable. Not ditching Desharnais sooner is inexcusable.

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Old
06-19-2017, 02:11 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by BrimStone64 View Post
Said he talked to McPhee. They think they can get a first round pick for Plekanec at the trade deadline. Said they can't get that value for Hudon, Emelin, DLR, etc...
Well, it's a good thing we rushed into trading Beaulieu because getting a 1st for Pleks sounds better for us if LV had taken Beaulieu, instead. I don't get MB most of the time, on account of the fact he'd rather be a jerk then do what's best for the organization.

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06-19-2017, 02:18 PM
  #235
Brainiac
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
Well, it's a good thing we rushed into trading Beaulieu because getting a 1st for Pleks sounds better for us if LV had taken Beaulieu, instead. I don't get MB most of the time, on account of the fact he'd rather be a jerk then do what's best for the organization.
Well, it makes 100% sense if he does something with the cap space. Because keeping Plek until the deadline means we can't sign/trade much during the summer/early in the season.

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Old
06-19-2017, 02:29 PM
  #236
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
Well, it's a good thing we rushed into trading Beaulieu because getting a 1st for Pleks sounds better for us if LV had taken Beaulieu, instead. I don't get MB most of the time, on account of the fact he'd rather be a jerk then do what's best for the organization.
So that's going to be the narrative, is it?

LV selects Plekanec and MB is an idiot because he should have traded him for a first instead?

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Old
06-19-2017, 02:34 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by Lebowski View Post
And we're still wondering if he's a winger or a center 5 years into his career.

Not making the transition at center sooner is inexcusable. Not ditching Desharnais sooner is inexcusable.
MT was ridiculed about his inability to not develop Galchenyuk as a center. Along comes Julien and he determines the same concerns after a few months. The problem with our development with Galchenyuk is we needed him to be a center desperately but he is a winger.

Yeah, we could of gotten rid of DD sooner but who was the replacement? We might loose Pleky in the expansion draft. Who is the replacement in our farm? This is the issue! Some people think we can easily replace players.... It's just not that easy when all 30 NHL teams are looking for the same things.

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06-19-2017, 02:36 PM
  #238
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
Well, it's a good thing we rushed into trading Beaulieu because getting a 1st for Pleks sounds better for us if LV had taken Beaulieu, instead. I don't get MB most of the time, on account of the fact he'd rather be a jerk then do what's best for the organization.
You are not taking into consideration the caproom. 6 million likely mean we keep Radulov. Losing TP makes us weak at center, see no doubt a center is coming our way. If I had to guess Galchenyuk and our first rounder will be traded. Little doubt Vegas be involved.

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06-19-2017, 02:37 PM
  #239
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Well, it makes 100% sense if he does something with the cap space. Because keeping Plek until the deadline means we can't sign/trade much during the summer/early in the season.
1) Who can we sign as a replacement to Pleky?

2) If we make a trade, don't you think Pleky goes the other way? Anybody GM negotiating a trade and trying to recoup assets for a player that other teams want knows they are getting a contract back to make the Cap work. All playoff contending teams have this problem of being against the cap or very close to it. Not just the Habs.

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06-19-2017, 02:38 PM
  #240
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I voted Plekanec.

My reasoning: Las Vegas is looking to build a team, the worst spot you can be in that process is in the middle. You are either competitive for playoffs to make some noise, or you should righteously suck so you have a shot at a generational player (You hope) in the draft year you suck in. Crosby / Malkin have made a bunch of people look like geniuses, but ask Brian Burke about the “Pittsburgh Model”. They sucked. Bad. And were fortunate enough to get two generational talents in those 5 years.

Complicating things is that Vegas has to sell this product in a new market, so they will want to be at least relatively competitive initially early on and try to build off of that as well. It’s a very unique situation. Using that as a basis, I think McPhee looks at players who can help him 1-2 years initially or picks / prospects 4-5 years down the road. For players in the 1-2 years categories, it would be established NHL’ers at premium positions who can help them short term be competitive, and can subsequently flipped this for the potential 4-5 year type players as they get close to their expiring contracts (think draft picks / prospects).

I’m betting he is compiling a mass amount of draft picks for the next couple of years and betting on the scouts to deliver. The more picks the better the chances, and I think last I heard there rumored to have 3-1st round picks this year? A guy like Hudon seems to be in the middle of those groups. Good young prospect but hasn’t found his footing yet. Will this help Vegas this year? Nope. Or to be fair a hard maybe, but they will have to gamble that given the ice time he may be productive. That ice time would be better invested, in my humble opinion, in a legitimate top 6 ish forward like Plekanec who you can then flip later on for something that should be good 4-5 years down the road.

That’s not an indictment against Hudon, I just don’t think Vegas is a fit for him and there are better options availalble.

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06-19-2017, 02:39 PM
  #241
Brainiac
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Originally Posted by lamp9post View Post
So that's going to be the narrative, is it?

LV selects Plekanec and MB is an idiot because he should have traded him for a first instead?
Knowing this place, it could happen!

But, seriously, losing Plekanec now is perfectly fine IF Bergevin does something nice with the newly freed 6M. It would give him plenty of options to land a top 6 center and/or dman.

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06-19-2017, 02:42 PM
  #242
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I think it's De la Rose unless some other NHL team wants Pleks or Emelin and will trade for them. Highly doubt it but never know.

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06-19-2017, 02:44 PM
  #243
Lebowski
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Originally Posted by HabsGorgeous View Post
MT was ridiculed about his inability to not develop Galchenyuk as a center. Along comes Julien and he determines the same concerns after a few months. The problem with our development with Galchenyuk is we needed him to be a center desperately but he is a winger.
Julien came along as Galchenyuk was on a cold streak coming back from a long term injury. He was doing fine earlier in the season, or to end the season before. And he was playing center then.

The concerns you're speaking of, namely face-offs and defensive play, are things that you learn through experience. How many times does this have to be repeated? Quite obviously, had Galchenyuk been groomed as a center 4 years earlier, he'd be a lot further along the road of development in terms of knowing how to play the position at the NHL level. And that was, as Bergevin claimed himself, during a period of time where the team was in a "transition". Maybe that would have been a good time to transition towards players with actual potential instead of wasting 5 years with Desharnais, no?

It's easy to say that "Chucky isn't a center, he's a winger" 5 years after playing him on the wing and somehow expecting him to learn how to play center at the same time. The bottomline is that they drafted him because they saw him as a center at the NHL level, and Therrien never lifted a finger to develop him as such. Because he had other "things" to worry about, apparently.

Quote:
Yeah, we could of gotten rid of DD sooner but who was the replacement? We might loose Pleky in the expansion draft. Who is the replacement in our farm? This is the issue! Some people think we can easily replace players.... It's just not that easy when all 30 NHL teams are looking for the same things.
Galchenyuk was the replacement, obviously.

Eller could have been Plekanec's replacement had Therrien explored his offensive potetial back when he had 30 points in 46 games at 23 years old. But again, he had other "things" to worry about.

It's not that easy to replace players when 30 NHL teams are looking for the same things, you say? How about the fact that this isn't something that should have been done over one summer? This has been going on for FIVE YEARS! People have been talking about it ever since Bergevin came along! So of course we're in a bit of a rush right now, because Bergevin and Therrien didn't have the foresight of planning for the future for the past 5 years.

If we're in a position where we have to fill two huge holes at center in the same summer, it's because of the decisions Bergevin has made since he took over. And he has made a series of bad decisions.

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06-19-2017, 02:45 PM
  #244
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I have a feeling, Plek will be claimed by Vegas.

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06-19-2017, 02:46 PM
  #245
habergeon
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Originally Posted by lamp9post View Post
So that's going to be the narrative, is it?

LV selects Plekanec and MB is an idiot because he should have traded him for a first instead?
It won't be my narrative.

Keeping him at the deadline was necessary for the playoffs. Potentially losing him in the expansion draft will hurt our depth at center, but the extra 6 million is delicious

If Tomas is taken, how he spends / invests that 6 million in savings will determine if I think MB is an idiot or not. Or to be honest, it will determine if I think he's really, REAALLLY an idiot as opposed to "Hey, he's been making some solid moves recently".

He has a lot of faith to restore, imho.

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06-19-2017, 02:46 PM
  #246
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Originally Posted by googlymoogly View Post
I think it's De la Rose unless some other NHL team wants Pleks or Emelin and will trade for them. Highly doubt it but never know.

ya man Las vegas will take a dedicated 4th liner in De la rose

Hudon has 0 value in the league

Plekanec is the only player with value.
if LV looks for picks.

Plekanec is the option

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Old
06-19-2017, 02:47 PM
  #247
Habaneros
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Originally Posted by Captain97 View Post
A journalist from Vegas suggested pleky as a target for the team this morning on the forum, don't remember his name but he seemed unaware of Hudon's existence. The reasoning was not many centres are unprotected and he thinks pleky would net a decent return at the TDL next year.
Coach Gallant knows Plek and the Habs pool of prospects...

I'm sure he will have a big say when it comes to the Montreal pick.

On top of that, George McPhee has watched Pleky against the Caps for all those years...

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06-19-2017, 02:52 PM
  #248
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ya man Las vegas will take a dedicated 4th liner in De la rose

Hudon has 0 value in the league

Plekanec is the only player with value.
if LV looks for picks.

Plekanec is the option
Why should Las Vegas use the expansion draft to pick Plekanec when they can probably get him for free if they want him as Montreal tries to ditch salary this summer for other moves?

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06-19-2017, 02:53 PM
  #249
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Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
Coach Gallant knows Plek and the Habs pool of prospects...

I'm sure he will have a big say when it comes to the Montreal pick.

On top of that, George McPhee has watched Pleky against the Caps for all those years...
I agree, I think they'll go with Plekanec. Even if it doesn't end up working out, he's only got 1 year left on his contract. He can still surprise and get 50-60 points and he's a good two way center.

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06-19-2017, 02:54 PM
  #250
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McPhee is talking about building through the entry draft to build a true cup contender. As injuries mount and teams look for playoff depth at a key position like centre, McPhee should be able to get another pick for plekanec. Chances are that the pick amounts to nothing, but you increase your chances by stockpiling as many picks as possible. If McPhee is true to his overall strategy, picking plekanec makes sense.

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