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AHL Signings (Agozzino, Warsofski, Cannata)

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Old
07-10-2017, 01:12 PM
  #51
cgf
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Letting Jost get used to manstrength at a level he can dominate isn't about learning about hockey.

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07-10-2017, 01:40 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cgf View Post
Letting Jost get used to manstrength at a level he can dominate isn't about learning about hockey.
I really think that the narrative about Jost being a weakling is overblown. He can handle the NHL now, especially after a full summer of training. He may not be at his physical peak but I don't believe he'll have any problems.

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07-10-2017, 03:49 PM
  #53
tigervixxxen
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There's idealistic and realistic. Ideally, yes I believe AHL time can benefit everyone and they should take that step first. Realistically there are politics and org processes. Getting a little time in the AHL and then a callup a month or so later isn't how they do things. Jost also didn't leave school where he would have been named captain and probably the WJC captain to just go to the AHL. They already gave him his real number, touted him as only going to dev camp to be a leader and put him on Altitude radio giving the speech about how different next year is going to be. They plan for him to be on the team. I'm sure there's a point he can play himself out of it but he's going to get the spot to start. There's also the state of the developmental system to consider, the state of the org after they tanked it harder than the Avs did at the end of the season and the gong show potential with them taking on Blues players. Some guys are going to have to go through it but the guys who showed that they can play in the NHL should be given those developmental minutes at the NHL level.

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07-10-2017, 04:28 PM
  #54
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I agree with that last bit on principle, TV, but Greer would be behind Landy, Ghetto, and Wilson at LW in the NHL, and I would rather see him get heavy minutes in a scoring role at the AHL level than 4th line minutes in the NHL. I don't want to see his growth stunted by being outside the top 9.

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07-10-2017, 04:32 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by McMetal View Post
I agree with that last bit on principle, TV, but Greer would be behind Landy, Ghetto, and Wilson at LW in the NHL, and I would rather see him get heavy minutes in a scoring role at the AHL level than 4th line minutes in the NHL. I don't want to see his growth stunted by being outside the top 9.
Not to mention Jost or Compher could end up there as well, because lets be honest, Duchene is still going to be here.

MacK
Duchene
Jost/Compher
Soderberg

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07-10-2017, 04:37 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McMetal View Post
I agree with that last bit on principle, TV, but Greer would be behind Landy, Ghetto, and Wilson at LW in the NHL, and I would rather see him get heavy minutes in a scoring role at the AHL level than 4th line minutes in the NHL. I don't want to see his growth stunted by being outside the top 9.
Everyone thinks prospects are given top line/pair minutes in the AHL like it's their junior team but the reality is that vets and now the freaking Blues players are going to be in the mix to take time away from prospects at that level. They are there for development but it's also a team that sells tickets and operates as its own entity. So my point is good prospects even play 3rd line roles in the AHL because giving guys like Girard, Bourque and Vogelhuber minutes is what coaches trust to lead to wins.

But of course I don't want Greer or any of the young guys playing 4th line minutes or scratched in the NHL. I'm just saying if it's 3rd line NHL vs. 2/3 line AHL it's not so clear cut.


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07-10-2017, 04:58 PM
  #57
henchman24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tigervixxxen View Post
Everyone thinks prospects are given top line/pair minutes in the AHL like it's their junior team but the reality is that vets and now the freaking Blues players are going to be in the mix to take time away from prospects at that level. They are there for development but it's also a team that sells tickets and operates as its own entity. So my point is good prospects even play 3rd line roles in the AHL because giving guys like Girard, Bourque and Vogelhuber minutes is what coaches trust to lead to wins.
That is my biggest issue with the Blues sending players there... I don't want Meloche/Beaudin/Boikov/Nantel/Martin's development screwed up because they get pushed down. A player like Bigras is good enough he'd get his minutes regardless... the others have issues.

I don't mind the player's not getting top line/pairing minutes (Meloche and Beaudin are not ready for those minutes anyway)... I just don't want them stuffed on the 4th line or scratches. It doesn't do players that you are developing any good to be there consistently. Nantel had enough of an issue with that last year, next year might be tougher if the Blues send too many players our way.

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07-10-2017, 05:17 PM
  #58
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I'd say the chances of NHL/AHL to start the year for each three are:

Compher - 85/15
Jost - 65/35
Greer - 40/60

Things can change depending on a Duchene trade and how much Bednar is sick of playing Colborne/Soderberg.

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07-10-2017, 05:19 PM
  #59
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I'll go

Compher 99/1
Jost 90/10
Greer w/o Duchene trade 30/70
Greer w/ Duchene trade 65/35

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07-10-2017, 05:34 PM
  #60
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I think Compher and Jost will both be up regardless. I don't think Jost should be up, but that is a different debate. Greer... I just have a hard time seeing him up to start. Right now (counting JTC and Jost) the Avs have 12 NHL forwards under contract. That will be 13 when Nieto gets signed. Then I see the 6/7 top 9 wing spots already locked up (Landy, Rants, Ghetto, Yakupov, Wilson, Comeau, and maybe Duchene... which would send Comeau to the 4th). That would put Greer on the 4th line, and that just isn't the spot for him especially with no threat of waivers. On the waivers, I think that put Grimaldi in line for the 13 or 14th forward spot. So... I only see Greer starting out with the Avs if there is a top 9 spot or two opened up by injury. It might take two.

Defense is still too unknown at this point. There is too much hinging on a Duchene trade.

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07-10-2017, 05:44 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
That is my biggest issue with the Blues sending players there... I don't want Meloche/Beaudin/Boikov/Nantel/Martin's development screwed up because they get pushed down. A player like Bigras is good enough he'd get his minutes regardless... the others have issues.

I don't mind the player's not getting top line/pairing minutes (Meloche and Beaudin are not ready for those minutes anyway)... I just don't want them stuffed on the 4th line or scratches. It doesn't do players that you are developing any good to be there consistently. Nantel had enough of an issue with that last year, next year might be tougher if the Blues send too many players our way.
If those guys do get bumped down too far in the pecking order, you could always send them to the Eagles for big minutes......

Seriously, Nantel and Boikov seemed to really gain confidence as the playoffs went on, and by the finals were playing outstanding. Why not load up the Eagles, win another championship, and move them to the AHL the following year?

I know it's really far-fetched, but it could possibly be a solution to the idiotic affiliation sharing......

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07-10-2017, 05:55 PM
  #62
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The concern with a guy like Jost would be if he was getting 4th line minutes. He'll likely get 15 or more minutes a night and play in the top 9 and even get some PP time so I'm fine with him being up.

He was physically outmatched a bit last year but with some extra bulking up and hopefully a bit of acceleration, it should be enough to get him by. He did improve from his first to his sixth game last season.

Also I thouhgt you guys would be rejoicing at a shared affiliation with the Blues. They're much better at player development than we are, if we're sharing an AHL affiliate with them for this year then that's probably better than whichever guys the Avs alone would place in charge. Our AHL prospect group isn't big enough for it to be a concern in terms of the better AHL prospects we have.

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07-10-2017, 06:02 PM
  #63
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None of the coaches are coming from the Blues, it's still our developmental system.

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07-10-2017, 06:02 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tigervixxxen View Post
Everyone thinks prospects are given top line/pair minutes in the AHL like it's their junior team but the reality is that vets and now the freaking Blues players are going to be in the mix to take time away from prospects at that level. They are there for development but it's also a team that sells tickets and operates as its own entity. So my point is good prospects even play 3rd line roles in the AHL because giving guys like Girard, Bourque and Vogelhuber minutes is what coaches trust to lead to wins.

But of course I don't want Greer or any of the young guys playing 4th line minutes or scratched in the NHL. I'm just saying if it's 3rd line NHL vs. 2/3 line AHL it's not so clear cut.
This is true, I just think that Greer is not really a tweener prospect anymore who would get pushed down for Bourque and Girard. He's had a full season in the AHL and a cup of coffee in the big leagues. He's not only capable of being on a scoring line, but once you add in his character and compete level I think that even if he's young coaches will trust him with those minutes given a free choice.

Beaudin as a rookie is definitely a guy the coaches would put outside the top six to start and he'll have to work his way up, which is proper for him just coming into the pros, but Greer isn't the same anymore.

If top 9 minutes are in the cards for him in the NHL, I think that could be beneficial, given that we actually might have some non-trash players on a third line for him to play with now. But the depth chart to me right now seems like 4th line is his likely role and he would be better served as the first forward callup when injury strikes.

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07-10-2017, 06:06 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by tigervixxxen View Post
None of the coaches are coming from the Blues, it's still our developmental system.
This is the one saving grace that has kept me from getting too worried. Whatever damage happens to the Avs is by the Avs from being too generous either with ice time or the prospects that are sent over.

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07-10-2017, 09:31 PM
  #66
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I think Greer, Grimaldi & Colborne (who should be 13th forward) miss out.

Andrighetto - Mackinnon - Rantanen (had plenty of chemistry)
Landeskog - Duchene - Yakupov (All supposed to be top end guys, no more excuses)
Wilson - Jost - Compher (Wilson adds exp. Compher matched speed)
Nieto - Soderberg - Comeau (Sodo + Comeau have to re-earn their line promotions)
(Colborne)

EDIT: Mix up that bottom 6 however you like tbh.

Honestly, I really feel that looks amazing. Call-ups in the event of injury per below:

1. Borque
2. Grimaldi
3. Greer
4. Agozzino
5. Smith

Honestly, I think our forwards actually look a lot better (even the depth) than I thought they would. If you have Comeau and Soderberg on your FOURTH line, you're doing ok quality wise.

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07-11-2017, 12:21 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by cgf View Post
Eh. Jost clearly wasn't physically ready last season, so even if he's added the necessary muscle, it would be best if he was given a little time at a lower level to get used to using that new muscle against manstrength...which he still needs to adjust to.

And Greer's consistency needs to improve, not his play when at his best. He can come into camp and crush it and still not be ready to consistently make things happen offensively.
Again, if they are good enough to win a spot out of camp, they need to be in the NHL. If they need seasoning or aren't ready then they will start out in the AHL, but I don't see Jost not making the NHL club.

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07-11-2017, 07:58 AM
  #68
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I'd be really disappointed if Compher started the year in the A. It would either mean he took a step back/showed up out of shape or something like that OR the Avs have lost their damn minds. I was incredibly impressed with JTC the final 10 games of the season.

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07-11-2017, 08:18 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sea Eagles View Post
Call-ups in the event of injury per below:

1. Borque
2. Grimaldi
3. Greer
4. Agozzino
5. Smith
Who is Smith?

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Old
07-11-2017, 08:46 AM
  #70
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Who is Smith?
It oughta be Brad Smith. Decent size, right-handed winger.


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Old
07-11-2017, 03:25 PM
  #71
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AHL head coach is possibly the most thankless job in all of sports. They're expected to make the team successful and fun to watch and all at the same time break in a bunch of kids so that they can then get taken away right when they're making a positive contribution. I remember the Rangers firing then-Wolf Pack coach Ryan McGill in the wake of taking the team to the AHL ECF, publicly citing his refusal to sacrifice winning in order to develop talent. And this was back when the Rangers didn't have much in terms of a prospect base anyway (I know, I know).

Obviously the vets they brought in last season didn't work, so if a mix of new additions from the parent club and some from the Blues organization finally move the needle, that feels like a win for everyone.

And Eric Veilleux was brought in with an eye toward player development. They made it clear that the same system is being implemented at both the AHL and NHL levels, an attention to detail that was not, to my knowledge, in place with guys like Chynoweth and his predecessors. I'm not too concerned that player development will suffer all that adversely with Blues plugs coming in. I just hope they're actually good AHL players.

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07-11-2017, 03:29 PM
  #72
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I'd be really disappointed if Compher started the year in the A. It would either mean he took a step back/showed up out of shape or something like that OR the Avs have lost their damn minds. I was incredibly impressed with JTC the final 10 games of the season.
He was, but I'm also of the mind that players like him sometimes take longer to develop. He also missed a substantial amount of time his first pro season due to injury.

And, word to the wise, Sven Baertschi had such an impressive debut to finish the year in Calgary they immediately put him in the lineup at the start of next season. You can see how that turned out.

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07-11-2017, 04:03 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sea Eagles View Post
I think Greer, Grimaldi & Colborne (who should be 13th forward) miss out.

Andrighetto - Mackinnon - Rantanen (had plenty of chemistry)
Landeskog - Duchene - Yakupov (All supposed to be top end guys, no more excuses)
Wilson - Jost - Compher (Wilson adds exp. Compher matched speed)
Nieto - Soderberg - Comeau (Sodo + Comeau have to re-earn their line promotions)
(Colborne)

EDIT: Mix up that bottom 6 however you like tbh.

Honestly, I really feel that looks amazing. Call-ups in the event of injury per below:

1. Borque
2. Grimaldi
3. Greer
4. Agozzino
5. Smith

Honestly, I think our forwards actually look a lot better (even the depth) than I thought they would. If you have Comeau and Soderberg on your FOURTH line, you're doing ok quality wise.
I'd go:

Andrighetto - Mackinnon - Rantanen
Wilson - Jost - Duchene
Landeskog - Compher - Yakupov
Nieto - Soderberg - Comeau
(Colborne)

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07-11-2017, 04:28 PM
  #74
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And Eric Veilleux was brought in with an eye toward player development. They made it clear that the same system is being implemented at both the AHL and NHL levels, an attention to detail that was not, to my knowledge, in place with guys like Chynoweth and his predecessors. I'm not too concerned that player development will suffer all that adversely with Blues plugs coming in. I just hope they're actually good AHL players.
For Dean's first couple of years, he got to run his system and they did ok with what they had. In Patrick's 2nd year they asked him to run what the Avs did and it didn't go so hot for a variety of reasons.

In Dean's last year they were horrible until he said screw it and started running his own system for the last few weeks, they ended up winning all but one. Then he got fired.

You can't run everything the same in the AHL/NHL. Smart coaches and Dev guys figure out what needs to be the same to prepare guys for the NHL and what has to be adapted to the minors so the players and team will be successful. I think the Avs are zeroing in on that at this point but lots of work still to be done.

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07-25-2017, 05:01 PM
  #75
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I guess this belongs here


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