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Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap/Lines etc. Part LXXXIV -- The Doggiest Days (Woof!) 2017

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Old
07-17-2017, 01:06 PM
  #401
twabby
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Originally Posted by trick9 View Post
I disagree. If you score 8 goals in 7 games, it's not the goalie with 2 shutouts who is to blame.
I guess this is where I say watch the games:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jn7V_bvrQUw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7Cgz5He_fY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fR4GxigC9PU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm9boBMWqEw

Plenty of early soft goals against in the games they lost that completely changes the complexion of the games and led to blowouts. If the goaltending weren't so lopsided that series easily goes the other way. Maybe if Thomas let in an early stinker in one of the games the Canucks would have easily won? Maybe if Luongo doesn't give up soft goal after soft goal the Canucks would have easily won?

The series was very much tilted in Vancouver's favor, even if it wasn't reflected in the scoreboard. They absolutely could have done more to win but let's not pretend they had any luck either. Similarly the Bruins could have done more to ensure a victory but they didn't need to because they had insanely good fortune that postseason, something the Capitals have not had (and something the Bruins haven't had since then either).

But luck isn't a factor, everyone makes their own luck, etc.

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07-17-2017, 01:18 PM
  #402
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
Living off your credit cards until your new paychecks start coming in?
Signing bonuses very likely mean they already have in his case.

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07-17-2017, 01:52 PM
  #403
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Future of John Carlson

Hey guys. Devils fan coming here.

What do you think is going to happen with John Carlson? Is it likely that he stays in Washington longterm? I know Carlson rooted for the Devils and Bruins growing up, and as a Devils fan, I would definitely offer Carlson a 7 year, $52.5 (7.5 AAV) million contract on July 1 next year. I am really hoping he tests the market, as the Devils need a serious upgrade on defense.

Also, thank you for Mojo! We are looking forward to seeing what he can do for us.

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07-17-2017, 02:04 PM
  #404
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Originally Posted by twabby View Post
I guess this is where I say watch the games:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jn7V_bvrQUw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7Cgz5He_fY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fR4GxigC9PU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm9boBMWqEw

Plenty of early soft goals against in the games they lost that completely changes the complexion of the games and led to blowouts. If the goaltending weren't so lopsided that series easily goes the other way. Maybe if Thomas let in an early stinker in one of the games the Canucks would have easily won? Maybe if Luongo doesn't give up soft goal after soft goal the Canucks would have easily won?

The series was very much tilted in Vancouver's favor, even if it wasn't reflected in the scoreboard. They absolutely could have done more to win but let's not pretend they had any luck either. Similarly the Bruins could have done more to ensure a victory but they didn't need to because they had insanely good fortune that postseason, something the Capitals have not had (and something the Bruins haven't had since then either).

But luck isn't a factor, everyone makes their own luck, etc.
Lots of if's there, that's for sure.

Maybe the Canucks are not even in the Finals if they don't get the luckiest goal of this century on the OT of an elimination game against the Sharks?

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07-17-2017, 02:13 PM
  #405
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Originally Posted by trick9 View Post
Lots of if's there, that's for sure.

Maybe the Canucks are not even in the Finals if they don't get the luckiest goal of this century on the OT of an elimination game against the Sharks?
Luck is not a factor in hockey, according to many.

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07-17-2017, 02:45 PM
  #406
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Originally Posted by twabby View Post
I've already acknowledged that bad luck doesn't explain everything and especially their poor Game 7 performance. Sorry you don't believe that it's a factor at all though.

It's funny how there aren't any real perennial chokers in a sport like basketball where luck isn't a factor at all due to the nature of the game.

I think we're conditioned to believe that we are in complete control of everything in our lives rather than just accepting that random chance plays such a huge part in everything.
Don't put words in my mouth. I never said luck wasn't a factor. In a 7 game series, the better team just typically overcomes bad breaks. I just don't think it's an intelligent excuse to stand behind when analyzing this era's failures.


Last edited by CapitalsCupFantasy: 07-17-2017 at 02:55 PM.
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07-17-2017, 03:12 PM
  #407
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Originally Posted by Ovechkins Wodka View Post
Glad to see our players are partying like they won the cup this off season
If you're referring to Kuznetzov he is under no obligation to work out in the offseason and most players don't. Do you honestly think the Penguins are working out right now?
They're probably drinking Labatt Blue and playing NHL 17 as we speak

Let me tell you something...they're just like the rest of us. When the preseason camps roll around then come back to America and start working. Who cares what he does in his free time.

There is no way an athlete can train 24/7 every day. Your body would break down.

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07-17-2017, 03:20 PM
  #408
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
Don't put words in my mouth. I never said luck wasn't a factor. In a 7 game series, the better team just typically overcomes bad breaks. I just don't think it's an intelligent excuse to stand behind.
I'm not excusing their lack of Cups, I'm trying to put it in context. There are many things they can control and they need to do their best to address these issues. Management, coaching, the right player mix, mindset, etc. all need to be optimized to the best extent possible. But while that's part of the equation (and probably a significant majority), it's not the entire thing and it doesn't guarantee success. They need to get hot at the right time and it's not simply a matter of them choosing to get hot, they need to get lucky bounces and fortunate timing due to the random nature of the sport. The Penguins were not close to a perfect team either of the past two seasons but they certainly got hot at the right time.

I guess I'm just not as down on the Ovechkin era as many people here are. They've been contenders year after year with a few years as an exception. It sucks that they haven't won it all and they certainly have had room to improve but they aren't the colossal failures that everyone seems to believe. It's not an accurate or fair portrayal IMO. Are they perfect? Hell no. But they are closer to a model franchise than they are a failure.

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07-17-2017, 03:28 PM
  #409
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If you're referring to Kuznetzov he is under no obligation to work out in the offseason and most players don't. Do you honestly think the Penguins are working out right now?
They're probably drinking Labatt Blue and playing NHL 17 as we speak

Let me tell you something...they're just like the rest of us. When the preseason camps roll around then come back to America and start working. Who cares what he does in his free time.

There is no way an athlete can train 24/7 every day. Your body would break down.


Hogwash. They're not like everyone else. The amount of focused, directed practice one puts in has been found to be the difference between average and exceptional performance. Want to improve? Put in more FOCUSED, DIRECTED work than the other guys.

Top athletes do something athletic just about every day, maybe barring a vacation here and there. Many are on 6 day programs. They all know it only takes a few weeks to backslide. Use it or lose it. And if you want to get better you keep upping your load and working on your weaknesses.

https://www.nhl.com/news/fitness-tra...eason/c-538817

Quote:
One of the biggest things the 23-year-old Crosby has learned is that the grind of an NHL season -- especially one that runs into June -- places incredible demands on his body.

So he makes a point of using his summers not only to relax, but to also get down the best possible physical base to prepare him for the tests he will encounter in the coming season.
Quote:
Crosby also has shown a willingness to work on his game during the offseason. After his Penguins won the Stanley Cup in 2009, Crosby spent a good deal of the short summer working on parts of his game he thought to be deficient.

He spent that summer taking faceoff after faceoff and firing off shot after shot as he tried to lose a reputation as a pass-first player and make himself harder to defend.
Quote:
"He's kind of a multi-sport trainer, and so for me I enjoy being athletic," Crosby told NHL.com. "I don't mind lifting weights, but I like trying to be athletic when I'm doing it, too. I've been with him for nine years, and it's been good.

"He's got a pretty good feel on things, and I enjoy the stuff we do. It's always new and when you train every day in the summer, it needs to be new. I think he does a good job of that."

That's the competition. That guy has 3 Cups and Ovechkin has ZERO. Yet the guy with the Cup is working in the offseason, daily, even after winning the Championship.

THAT is what makes champions. Much more than sitting back and hoping to get in shape as the season goes along, and then riding the luck train in the playoffs.

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07-17-2017, 03:28 PM
  #410
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Originally Posted by twabby View Post
I'm not excusing their lack of Cups, I'm trying to put it in context. There are many things they can control and they need to do their best to address these issues. Management, coaching, the right player mix, mindset, etc. all need to be optimized to the best extent possible. But while that's part of the equation (and probably a significant majority), it's not the entire thing and it doesn't guarantee success. They need to get hot at the right time and it's not simply a matter of them choosing to get hot, they need to get lucky bounces and fortunate timing due to the random nature of the sport. The Penguins were not close to a perfect team either of the past two seasons but they certainly got hot at the right time.

I guess I'm just not as down on the Ovechkin era as many people here are. They've been contenders year after year with a few years as an exception. It sucks that they haven't won it all and they certainly have had room to improve but they aren't the colossal failures that everyone seems to believe. It's not an accurate or fair portrayal IMO. Are they perfect? Hell no. But they are closer to a model franchise than they are a failure.
Nice Post twabmind. I agree with you 100%. In all facets of this discussion.

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07-17-2017, 03:28 PM
  #411
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I'm not saying it's all luck. The points you mentioned in your second paragraph certainly ring true, but take the Bruins, Ducks, and Hurricanes as examples. They all have major organizational issues yet they have all won Cups in the past 11 years due to some great goaltending performances and good luck. The Bruins had no right beating the Canucks but Thomas put the team on his back. Thus they are not chokers. Same with Cam Ward and Carolina. Imagine if the Capitals had a similar hot run in the postseason. It's certainly possible, and the talk of being chokers would be completely eradicated.

From a purely mathematical point of view, the favorites are generally around 80% to not win the Stanley Cup in a given year and most other playoff teams are 90+% to not win it all in a given year. It's really not that outlandish to think that the Capitals simply haven't been lucky given these odds. But it doesn't make for an interesting story especially compared to piling on the "choking dogs" angle.

They have a lot they can improve and it's not all bad luck. But maybe with a little luck they would have already won.

Every winning team has some luck but it tends to even out over the long run.

The Bruins and Canes won in part because of hot goaltending and in part because of really good team play and chemistry. Both of those squads had "it" that year. Their locker rooms were outstanding from what I recall, and the Bruins played some of the best support hockey I've ever seen over a full playoff run (they had to with that horrible PP). I remember the Canes being a very, very driven bunch with some solid veteran leaders as well.

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07-17-2017, 03:57 PM
  #412
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Originally Posted by G F O P View Post
There is no way an athlete can train 24/7 every day. Your body would break down.
That's what steroids are for.

It's about knowing your body and maintaining the right lifestyle. Athletes can ditch time off if they're training in a flexible, adaptive fashion that isn't maximally taxing. After all, these are athletes that have mostly been training for ten years if not more. The amount of information at their disposal is only limited by their own desire to seek it out.

There's a pretty decent case to be made that not maintaining the right lifestyle in the off-season which then leads to compensating via training cramming or fasting and the like can be far more detrimental. Avoiding extremes tends to be the wiser, healthier course. Players still party and some are lazier than others but it seems like the vast majority are pretty mindful of that lifestyle and taking care of themselves so that they can enjoy as long of a career as possible.

Edit: Reading that Crosby article...I don't want to be one of those people but the guys gets it.


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07-17-2017, 04:28 PM
  #413
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Are people here seriously getting on Ovi for partying and being overweight?

Do we not all know where the videos are from, the guys wedding celebration!!! If he was partying and having a great time I would be upset with him. Ovi will be fine leave him alone. I wish someday I can have that crazy of a wedding celebration

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07-17-2017, 04:52 PM
  #414
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Originally Posted by OV Rocks View Post
Are people here seriously getting on Ovi for partying and being overweight?

Do we not all know where the videos are from, the guys wedding celebration!!! If he was partying and having a great time I would be upset with him. Ovi will be fine leave him alone. I wish someday I can have that crazy of a wedding celebration
This is not a one time thing. It's not about one pic.

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07-17-2017, 04:57 PM
  #415
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Every winning team has some luck but it tends to even out over the long run.

The Bruins and Canes won in part because of hot goaltending and in part because of really good team play and chemistry. Both of those squads had "it" that year. Their locker rooms were outstanding from what I recall, and the Bruins played some of the best support hockey I've ever seen over a full playoff run (they had to with that horrible PP). I remember the Canes being a very, very driven bunch with some solid veteran leaders as well.
The problem is people don't recognize what the long run really is. It can in many cases take hundreds of games before results are likely to stabilize to something approaching a reasonable result. Hockey isn't basketball. It's a low scoring game with evenly matched rosters which by its nature leads to a wide variation in outcomes.

Regarding certain teams having "it": how is this not a prime example of confirmation bias? They didn't have "it" until they won. And then in the following season they suddenly didn't have "it" any more. The Bruins had "it" in 2011, returned most of the roster (most in their primes) and coaching staff the following season, and flamed out in 2012 against the team that never has "it" in the Capitals. Did the Bruins suddenly lose "it"? Did the Capitals temporarily have "it", then lose "it" in Round 2?

Seems like no one really knows what "it" is other than whoever won must have had it. That doesn't sound very useful. Skill, tactics, and random chance seem to explain mostly everything without having to refer to nebulous concepts.


Last edited by twabby: 07-17-2017 at 05:02 PM.
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07-17-2017, 05:55 PM
  #416
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Ovi has been in the gym and running 5km a day while on his honeymoon.

But he isn't working hard

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07-17-2017, 05:56 PM
  #417
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The problem is people don't recognize what the long run really is. It can in many cases take hundreds of games before results are likely to stabilize to something approaching a reasonable result. Hockey isn't basketball. It's a low scoring game with evenly matched rosters which by its nature leads to a wide variation in outcomes.

Regarding certain teams having "it": how is this not a prime example of confirmation bias? They didn't have "it" until they won. And then in the following season they suddenly didn't have "it" any more. The Bruins had "it" in 2011, returned most of the roster (most in their primes) and coaching staff the following season, and flamed out in 2012 against the team that never has "it" in the Capitals. Did the Bruins suddenly lose "it"? Did the Capitals temporarily have "it", then lose "it" in Round 2?

Seems like no one really knows what "it" is other than whoever won must have had it. That doesn't sound very useful. Skill, tactics, and random chance seem to explain mostly everything without having to refer to nebulous concepts.
Its not nebulous to anyone who isn't mired in dualistic thinking that either things are quantifiable digits or they're crap.

Yes, it's possible to have "it" for a while and then lose it. Absolutely. That's the nature of it. "It" is generally a combination of synergistic and complementary traits, habits, skills, mentalities, and motivations that can propel an individual or a team to great achievements. It can come from the existing personalities in the room as combined in a different way around a specific cause. It can just be a burning desire to win that combines harmoniously with the ability to do the right things at the right times. "It" is a blend of champion qualities that can wax or wane because they are so elusive. "It" comes mostly from the mind.

You may not want to hear this, but the human body is linked to the human mind, and the human mind is a vastly complex function of only partially understood neurological functions. Much of what we do is possible because we have basic tasks stored in deeper parts of the brain, which allow us to perform higher level tasks without having to recount the exact steps of all the pedantic little components. We learn to tie our shoes when we're young and we never really think about the steps later. Where did that awkwardness and conscious manipulation of fingers and strings go? It became what people inaccurately call "muscle memory", which is really just storage of automatic processes in deeper parts of our brain so that we can concentrate on other things. The more we practice and heap new skills on top of others the better we become at even the most complex tasks. We cut neural pathways like water creating a channel down the side of a mountain. That is how mastery is achieved, usually through directed and intense practice over a long period of time. And that is also how choking becomes ingrained...when we learn bad habits and mentalities and imprint them in our minds through repetition and intensity (intense emotion aids imprinting).

It's not magic but it can appear that way when a master is at work. A classical pianist does not have to think about playing the notes. A basketball player simply reacts to the flow of the game, and the basket. Kobe Bryant has described the zone in excellent terms, including how everything just became "one noise". Old time athletes used to call it "the trance", or "going unconscious" or "lights out". It's really just "getting out of your own way" and letting those channels in the mountain flow.

The reason this is important is because having "it" often means getting to a stage where you simply TRUST your abilities and let them loose without a shred of conscious direction. There is no sense of doubt or "I don't know what to do". There is only flow and being in the moment. Everyone does this during the day,
but not everyone can call on it when it matters or under pressure. When a person can turn on this ability during clutch moments he has "it". When a team can inspire and push each other into these flow states, especially at the end of a game 7, they have "it".

Teams that don't have "it" lose those game 7s time and time again. And they blame "nebulous" **** like luck.

Performance psychology is not nebulous, it's real. Every single high level athlete will tell you about it, if you ever meet one. You won't find it in your stat sheets but it's the most important thing in all of sports, and it's why sports psychology trumps analytics. Without the former you can't have the latter, and if someone can improve his mental game he can buck his statistical trends. It's also why a player can put up numbers in one environment and not another, which makes the value of some statistics suspect.

So yeah, those teams found "it" for a time. It doesn't mean you have "it" forever. It takes work like any other skill.


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07-17-2017, 06:09 PM
  #418
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Ovi has been in the gym and running 5km a day while on his honeymoon.

But he isn't working hard
5k isn't much for a professional hockey player. That's like a warm up.

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07-17-2017, 06:19 PM
  #419
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5k isn't much for a professional hockey player. That's like a warm up.
20 or so minutes of running/jogging and probably about 500 or so calories burned depending on weight and intensity. If your average joe did this 3-4 times a week it would be a good aerobic maintenance component but nothing special. Certainly not elite. Eating the same diet as before, Ovie would probably lose about a pound a week if he did it just about every day.

Of course, we don't know what else he's doing on top of that.

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07-17-2017, 07:01 PM
  #420
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Long distance running isn't beneficial for hockey players

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07-17-2017, 07:03 PM
  #421
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The guy is on his honeymoon, if he is doing anything besides curling a russian drink from his seat to his mouth it is more than enough in my eyes.

This is pathetic

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07-17-2017, 07:05 PM
  #422
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The guy is on his honeymoon, if he is doing anything besides curling a russian drink from his seat to his mouth it is more than enough in my eyes.

This is pathetic
If he was in shape before his honeymoon not one single person would say anything. But he's out of shape. With a lil over a month till training camp. That's the pathetic part

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07-17-2017, 07:12 PM
  #423
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Coming off the worst season of his career and he will be age 32 when the season starts. His conditioning has been questioned its not pathetic to bring up. It's a legit concern

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07-17-2017, 07:45 PM
  #424
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Cut him some slack, he's probably been eating and drinking all day since his wedding celebrations started. I'm sure he'll pick it up in time. For now, he should just enjoy his time with his wife.

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07-17-2017, 07:49 PM
  #425
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20 or so minutes of running/jogging and probably about 500 or so calories burned depending on weight and intensity. If your average joe did this 3-4 times a week it would be a good aerobic maintenance component but nothing special. Certainly not elite. Eating the same diet as before, Ovie would probably lose about a pound a week if he did it just about every day.

Of course, we don't know what else he's doing on top of that.
It's also the offseason and he needed to put his leg back together but w/e.

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