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Dawes, Prucha, Tyutin, Sanguinetti and a First

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Old
05-05-2008, 11:23 AM
  #26
JTG
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It's not worth it for NY to go after Kovalchuk or Gaborik. The amount of peices you would have to give up would decimate your roster, your talent pool, and your draft class this year, and most likely next year.

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05-05-2008, 11:26 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by TheHotRock View Post
how can we not afford it? we have about 15 mil coming off the books this year, we theoretically could add them both.
We have roughly 22 Million to sign FOUR top two line wingers (yes thats all of them) and three defensemen, including at least one for the top pairing.

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05-05-2008, 11:48 AM
  #28
Jarkko Immonen
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Sang is not making the team out of camp.

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05-05-2008, 11:48 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Evil Sather View Post
We have roughly 22 Million to sign FOUR top two line wingers (yes thats all of them) and three defensemen, including at least one for the top pairing.
We have to sign Vally too, right?

Liles (3.0mil), Stuart (3.5 mil), Rolston (2.5mil), Huselius (4.0mil), Jagr (5.20 mil), Avery (3 mil), Vally (800k)

Fill the last defensive spot with Potter/Baranka.

I dunno. It's my first stab at trying to figure out salaries.

My only thing is that we'd have nothing left to sign Gaborik on the open market, unless we only signed JJ for 1 year.

Huselius - Dubi - Jagr
Dawes/Avery - Gomez - Rolston
Korpedo - Drury - Avery/Dawes
Callahan - Betts - Orr / Sjostrom

Staal - Liles
Stuart - Potter
Girardi - Tyutin
Backman (lets take up a collection to buy him out. )

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05-05-2008, 12:03 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Jarkko Immonen View Post
Sang is not making the team out of camp.
and since this is a known fact, he might as well just stay in hartford and not come to new york for training camp some people said the same thing about staal

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05-05-2008, 12:04 PM
  #31
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Why do you want Gaborik (1 pt in 6 playoff games this year) or Kovalchuk (what, 1 pt in 4 p.o. gm last year)?

This is just like everyone drooling over Hossa, who finally showed up for the playoffs yesterday only 8 games late. We are going to build a team in the mold of the Sabres, 4 strong lines, even scoring distribution, solid team game. We won't need that superstar, scoring winger. I'd be nice but I wouldn't pay the prices required or the ones suggested.

This team isn't ready to peak yet. Going for broke now is too premature. Staal will be a Norris candidate within 3 years. Lundqvist may be a multiple Vezina winner within 3 years. Dubinsky, Callahan, Dawes, Anisimov, Cheripanov and Sanguinetti will be entering their primes with some decent experience under their belt. Then let's talk about blockbuster trades. Then let's talk about emptying the bank.

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05-05-2008, 12:07 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by JTG32005 View Post
It's not worth it for NY to go after Kovalchuk or Gaborik. The amount of peices you would have to give up would decimate your roster, your talent pool, and your draft class this year, and most likely next year.
At least someone is smart enough to realize this.

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05-05-2008, 12:20 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Mugerya View Post
Why do you want Gaborik (1 pt in 6 playoff games this year) or Kovalchuk (what, 1 pt in 4 p.o. gm last year)?

This is just like everyone drooling over Hossa, who finally showed up for the playoffs yesterday only 8 games late. We are going to build a team in the mold of the Sabres, 4 strong lines, even scoring distribution, solid team game. We won't need that superstar, scoring winger. I'd be nice but I wouldn't pay the prices required or the ones suggested.

This team isn't ready to peak yet. Going for broke now is too premature. Staal will be a Norris candidate within 3 years. Lundqvist may be a multiple Vezina winner within 3 years. Dubinsky, Callahan, Dawes, Anisimov, Cheripanov and Sanguinetti will be entering their primes with some decent experience under their belt. Then let's talk about blockbuster trades. Then let's talk about emptying the bank.
Great post, I agree 100%. Hopefully Slats does too.

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05-05-2008, 12:20 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by MTLHabsAK46 View Post
The only way these guys move is if the teams are willing to trade them. I'm not saying the players in the package are horrible, but you're talking about a one-man wrecking crew in Gaborik (when he's on...5 goals in one game) and arguably the best sniper (in terms of shot deadliness) in Kovalchuk. Atlanta and Minnesota do NOT become better teams after the deal. In fact, Atlanta loses the only thing that actually let's them compete.
That being said, if both do not want to sign with the team (I don't know the whereabouts of Gaborik's contract), they WILL move, but be assured that a better offer will be on the table. Could it get one of them? Possibly under the right circumstances, but another team will overpay grossely for Kovy or Gaborik.
what you just said is obvious. you didn't respond to any of what i said.

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05-05-2008, 12:23 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Mugerya View Post
Why do you want Gaborik (1 pt in 6 playoff games this year) or Kovalchuk (what, 1 pt in 4 p.o. gm last year)?

This is just like everyone drooling over Hossa, who finally showed up for the playoffs yesterday only 8 games late. We are going to build a team in the mold of the Sabres, 4 strong lines, even scoring distribution, solid team game. We won't need that superstar, scoring winger. I'd be nice but I wouldn't pay the prices required or the ones suggested.

This team isn't ready to peak yet. Going for broke now is too premature. Staal will be a Norris candidate within 3 years. Lundqvist may be a multiple Vezina winner within 3 years. Dubinsky, Callahan, Dawes, Anisimov, Cheripanov and Sanguinetti will be entering their primes with some decent experience under their belt. Then let's talk about blockbuster trades. Then let's talk about emptying the bank.
Did the Sabres win a stanley cup that i do not know of?

I'd rather build a team in the mold of SJ or Anaheim or Detroit.. etc

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05-05-2008, 12:26 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mugerya View Post
Why do you want Gaborik (1 pt in 6 playoff games this year) or Kovalchuk (what, 1 pt in 4 p.o. gm last year)?

This is just like everyone drooling over Hossa, who finally showed up for the playoffs yesterday only 8 games late. We are going to build a team in the mold of the Sabres, 4 strong lines, even scoring distribution, solid team game. We won't need that superstar, scoring winger. I'd be nice but I wouldn't pay the prices required or the ones suggested.

This team isn't ready to peak yet. Going for broke now is too premature. Staal will be a Norris candidate within 3 years. Lundqvist may be a multiple Vezina winner within 3 years. Dubinsky, Callahan, Dawes, Anisimov, Cheripanov and Sanguinetti will be entering their primes with some decent experience under their belt. Then let's talk about blockbuster trades. Then let's talk about emptying the bank.
Agreed.

Bear in mind that the advantage of having such a stocked system is that at some point SOME of our plethora of young players will have to progress to the level where they will have real value to other teams. The problem with dealing them now is that you still don't know which ones will develop to what level and which ones will not, which is the reason they don't fetch as much value as their projections might seem to warrant. Once they've confirmed their ability at the NHL level, they become much more valuable.

For example, it's a very real possibility that next year Dubi takes that next step and becomes a 25-40-65 young power center. Dawes could score 30+ goals on Gomez's wing. All of a sudden, either could be the centerpiece of a multi-asset package for a legit star. (Not saying that I'd advocate dealing either player, just throwing them out as an example of my point.)

I know that this seems like an obvious point, but I think people lose sight of it when proposing trades on this forum.

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05-05-2008, 12:35 PM
  #37
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Did the Sabres win a stanley cup that i do not know of?

I'd rather build a team in the mold of SJ or Anaheim or Detroit.. etc
Who was their superstar scorer when they won the cup? Their 4th line was phenomonal. Selanne is the closest thing but at his age and output he is hardly a superstar still. They won on balanced scoring and amazing team defense. Pronger and Niedermeyer help. They beat 3 superstar forwards in 5 games with MacDonald, Getzlaf, Perry and Selanne sharing the load along with the 4th line. I think Anaheim is a good comparision for out future. Especially since we're going more NA in our style.

Do you really want to mimick SJ? Lets see what Detriot does before we pull Datsyuk and Zetterburg out of our hat.

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05-05-2008, 12:49 PM
  #38
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how can we not afford it? we have about 15 mil coming off the books this year, we theoretically could add them both.
Or we could just sign Hossa and not give up players and picks.

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05-05-2008, 12:59 PM
  #39
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That'd fetch maybe Rick Nash.
Cherry, Toots, Dawes and 1st for Rick Nash ?

Sather would make that deal I bet

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05-05-2008, 01:01 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by The Chariot View Post
Cherry, Toots, Dawes and 1st for Rick Nash ?

Sather would make that deal I bet
jackets would not



they would want dubinsky staal to start and as a rangers gm id hang up. nash is a great player i wish we had him but id rather wait till he is ufa.

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05-05-2008, 01:02 PM
  #41
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Best guess is if Sather pulls a MAJOR deal like that its for an Elite D man not a forward.

The forward can more easily be found in the UFA market and or the kids. That Elite D man is becoming so hard to land.

Dont you think so?

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05-05-2008, 01:20 PM
  #42
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Best guess is if Sather pulls a MAJOR deal like that its for an Elite D man not a forward.

The forward can more easily be found in the UFA market and or the kids. That Elite D man is becoming so hard to land.

Dont you think so?

agreed. but usually when a team has a d man like that, they hold onto him.

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05-05-2008, 01:25 PM
  #43
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Do they have one to develop?
Yeah, Dawes, right? And Prucha. Or we could just get 5 more years out of Shanahan

And, no, that package is a big NO by just looking at it. There is no centerpiece. Staal isn't one, and to be honest, there are probably about only 10 d-man in the NHL you could use as a centerpiece for a star forward.

Dawes will get a young 3rd liner or an average top-six roster player... maybe a 2nd round pick. Tyutin wouldn't return what he's worth to us. Sanguinetti will not have much value for 2-3 years, except maybe for trading up in the drafts. And throwing Prucha in to a package takes away from the integrity of the deal; he's worth less than half of what he's being paid and he might get us a 3rd round pick. Prucha has become about as valuable as Marcel Hossa was.

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05-05-2008, 02:45 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Mugerya View Post
Who was their superstar scorer when they won the cup? Their 4th line was phenomonal. Selanne is the closest thing but at his age and output he is hardly a superstar still. They won on balanced scoring and amazing team defense. Pronger and Niedermeyer help. They beat 3 superstar forwards in 5 games with MacDonald, Getzlaf, Perry and Selanne sharing the load along with the 4th line. I think Anaheim is a good comparision for out future. Especially since we're going more NA in our style.

Do you really want to mimick SJ? Lets see what Detriot does before we pull Datsyuk and Zetterburg out of our hat.
Do we have anyone in our system who is comparable to any of them? Gomez for MacDonald, maybe. But other than that, nope.

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05-05-2008, 02:50 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Mugerya View Post
Who was their superstar scorer when they won the cup?* Their 4th line was phenomonal.* Selanne is the closest thing but at his age and output he is hardly a superstar still.* They won on balanced scoring and amazing team defense.* Pronger and Niedermeyer help.* They beat 3 superstar forwards in 5 games with MacDonald, Getzlaf, Perry and Selanne sharing the load along with the 4th line.* I think Anaheim is a good comparision for out future.* Especially since we're going more NA in our style.Do you really want to mimick SJ?* Lets see what Detriot does before we pull Datsyuk and Zetterburg out of our hat.
Selanne had 48 goals that year. Seems like a superstar to me.

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05-05-2008, 03:00 PM
  #46
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that package is definitely more than enough to get cammalerri. something to think about.

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05-05-2008, 03:05 PM
  #47
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No, No, No, That kind of Attitude kept us out of the POs for 7 seasons. Build from the ground up

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05-05-2008, 03:06 PM
  #48
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After that you don't have much room under the cap. Whom are going to fill the holes? Farm system depleted and cap space out of whack. In the precap days, small market team might be ok to that. Pro cap, not happening.

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05-05-2008, 04:02 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyrfan444 View Post
Gaborik has played a full season all of once in his NHL career..
Gaborik's seasons by games played..

71
78
81
65
65
48
77

I'd say that's more than one full season. the 78 and 77 are quite close enough.

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Old
05-05-2008, 04:06 PM
  #50
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Gaborik's seasons by games played..

71
78
81
65
65
48
77

I'd say that's more than one full season. the 78 and 77 are quite close enough.
Perhaps, but that's still not exactly a great track record.

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