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Brunnstrom Thread: Updated signed by Dallas (merged)

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Old
05-09-2008, 01:21 AM
  #551
Slick Nick
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Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
Frankly, I call BS

That's easy to say as a fan on a message board.

NHL careers last only so many years and he will never make this kind of money again in his life. Those studies you're talking about are people who make that predictably over their entire career. Pro sports is a 5-10 year sprint, after which your earnings go down significantly and never adjust for inflation over your life.

Anyone here can say what they want, but there are only three reasons any real person faced with this situations will consider: family concerns (geography), income and effect on career.

Montreal will always lose income.

Thus, our only hope is effect on career and occasionally geography.



I was talking in a generality, I admit, but seriously, what have you seen? If you're a frequent watcher of the SEL, I apologize and retract everything I said. If not, you're only proving my point.

Your post admits a couple YouTubes, thus my comment. You cannot judge a player based on a YouTube clip or even a single game.
I believe a couple of youtubes (among with every other peice of info available) are enough to tell a Malkin from a Brunnstrom... don't you think?

.. he's an average prospect with decent upside...

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05-09-2008, 08:10 AM
  #552
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Originally Posted by Arctic_Hab_Fan View Post
Hey, atleast they've played on an NHL team, Fabian?

Fabian is said to have tailed off quite a bit in the second half of the season...in a league where they hardly hit.
Here is probably the #1 reason for him signing in Dallas............Brunnstrom also did not want the pressure that comes with playing in Toronto.

So the pressure in MTL would be the same.

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Old
05-09-2008, 08:14 AM
  #553
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Originally Posted by Nitehowl View Post
Here is probably the #1 reason for him signing in Dallas............Brunnstrom also did not want the pressure that comes with playing in Toronto.

So the pressure in MTL would be the same.

Good, then im glad he didn't sign here.

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Old
05-09-2008, 09:04 AM
  #554
Lucius
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Originally Posted by Slick Nick View Post
I believe a couple of youtubes (among with every other peice of info available) are enough to tell a Malkin from a Brunnstrom... don't you think?

.. he's an average prospect with decent upside...
A couple YouTubes are enough to tell me from a Malkin. They're not enough to get any adequate handle on the upside or potential of an NHL prospect.

If it was that easy, scouts and such really wouldn't be all that necessary.

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Old
05-09-2008, 10:03 AM
  #555
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I heard on Team990, Brunnstrom said in a Swedish paper he signed with Dallas because they made the best presentation and they have Swedish players around his age.

We can't compete with 3 Swedes around 23 years old. We have none. (Niklas Grossman (23), Loui Eriksson (22), Joel Lundqvist (25)

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Old
05-09-2008, 10:42 AM
  #556
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
I heard on Team990, Brunnstrom said in a Swedish paper he signed with Dallas because they made the best presentation and they have Swedish players around his age.

We can't compete with 3 Swedes around 23 years old. We have none. (Niklas Grossman (23), Loui Eriksson (22), Joel Lundqvist (25)
You also can't compete with the taxes, weather and atmosphere* there.

*If you're 23 and never played outside Sweden and have a chance to come to the NHL and have the privilege of picking a city in which to play, are you going to go someplace where the fans already expect you to be the savior, or are you going to go play somewhere you can adjust to the NA game without fear of being stocked outside your house ?

Going to a place like Montreal or Toronto would have been suicidal for a player in his position.

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05-09-2008, 10:47 AM
  #557
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Originally Posted by Brisk-Illusion View Post
You also can't compete with the taxes, weather and atmosphere* there.

*If you're 23 and never played outside Sweden and have a chance to come to the NHL and have the privilege of picking a city in which to play, are you going to go someplace where the fans already expect you to be the savior, or are you going to go play somewhere you can adjust to the NA game without fear of being stocked outside your house ?

Going to a place like Montreal or Toronto would have been suicidal for a player in his position.
Damn it.... I agree with you.

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Old
05-09-2008, 11:10 AM
  #558
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I don't like this argument about taxes.
Sure, money IS a factor, and I certainly understand that a player will take taxes into consideration. But this is a broader issue than just hockey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoHabsGo247 View Post
You'd think the Quebec government would give the Canadiens the same tax breaks considering the history the franchise has here. It's actually pretty pathetic when you think of how much money the franchise brings in for the province, never mind the tax from player's salaries.
Come on, if you think about it honestly, if you try to put aside the fact that we're fans discussing sport, would you push for this kind of solution? Why would a government have to grant a special arrangment to a private company, so that some of the better paid citizens in the country can earn a little more money? That's insane.

I know it's sports, and the Canadiens are not just a random private company, I know they are an important part of Montreal's image, and I know the province benefits from their existence, but the fact remains that this is a business.

We have the exact same debate in france about soccer players. Some club owners and managers are lobbying the government, because they argue that there is a competitive disadvantage, as high taxes in France prevent them to sign the the best players, who prefer to go to Spain, Italy, England or Germany. That's ********.
Sure,we have high taxes, but that's the result of broader political choices. You can disagree with those choices, but you can't just ask for a certain category of people (which happen to be those who already earn the highest salaries) to be exempted from paying taxes, just because they would pay lower taxes elsewhere.

As for the argument about their short careers, I think it's misleading too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucius View Post

NHL careers last only so many years and he will never make this kind of money again in his life. Those studies you're talking about are people who make that predictably over their entire career. Pro sports is a 5-10 year sprint, after which your earnings go down significantly and never adjust for inflation over your life.
It's true, they won't make as much money for the rest of their lives. But it doesn't mean they won't have revenues after they stop playing. These guys can find regular jobs after their hockey careers. (I'm not even speaking about hockey related jobs, a lot of them start their own business aterwards) Sure, their earnings will go down significantly, but they can still get normal earnings, like you and me.

I've always found it baffling to see regular people, with normal salaries, arguing that athletes should earn even more money, and complaining that it's unfair that they're paying such high taxes.

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Old
05-09-2008, 11:17 AM
  #559
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Originally Posted by grrrreg View Post
It's true, they won't make as much money for the rest of their lives. But it doesn't mean they won't have revenues after they stop playing. These guys can find regular jobs after their hockey careers. (I'm not even speaking about hockey related jobs, a lot of them start their own business aterwards) Sure, their earnings will go down significantly, but they can still get normal earnings, like you and me.

I've always found it baffling to see regular people, with normal salaries, arguing that athletes should earn even more money, and complaining that it's unfair that they're paying such high taxes.
I'm not arguing they should make more money or even saying the taxes are unfair. All I'm saying is that if I were faced with the option of taking in 6 or 4 million a year, I'd choose 6 and I will never blame anyone who makes that same decision.

I just think people are being naive when they claim people should go play for their favorite or childhood team regardless of the fact that such a decision might cost someone like Briere $15 million over the life of his contract.

Whether or not hockey players should make that kind of money is a different question, but I cannot blame them for maximizing their revenues. I am willing to bet that most everyone on this forum if offered two comparable jobs with a salary difference of $10,000 would likely take the one that paid more. Yet, somehow, we judge hockey players for doing this when the numbers are not even in the same stratosphere.

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Old
05-09-2008, 11:58 AM
  #560
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You're right Lucius, actually I agree with most of your points. I know you were not saying they should make more money.
And once again, I find it perfectly logical, from the player's point of vew, to consider the txes factor. I do think it has an impact, and as you said, Montreal has to emphasize on its other advantages (quality of the team, fan support, quality of life, etc...)

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Old
05-09-2008, 12:41 PM
  #561
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
Frankly, I call BS

That's easy to say as a fan on a message board.

NHL careers last only so many years and he will never make this kind of money again in his life. Those studies you're talking about are people who make that predictably over their entire career. Pro sports is a 5-10 year sprint, after which your earnings go down significantly and never adjust for inflation over your life.

Anyone here can say what they want, but there are only three reasons any real person faced with this situations will consider: family concerns (geography), income and effect on career.

Montreal will always lose income.

Thus, our only hope is effect on career and occasionally geography.



I was talking in a generality, I admit, but seriously, what have you seen? If you're a frequent watcher of the SEL, I apologize and retract everything I said. If not, you're only proving my point.

Your post admits a couple YouTubes, thus my comment. You cannot judge a player based on a YouTube clip or even a single game.
Yes but if you're making 4 million a year for 5-10 years, you'll make more than someone who makes 50,000 a year over the course of their lifetimes. So I think the studies are still relevant.

But just use common sense man. I mean, what is the extra 2 million a year going to give you? How exactly is that extra 2 million a year going to improve the quality of your life? Being able to buy a home with a few more acres or another porsche will markedly improve my happiness? Come on, you can't be serious. I'm pretty sure I could make myself and my family materially comfortable with the 4 million a year I'll earn over the course of my career. After a certain amount of materialism, the gains in the quality of your life will be negligable. After that you're going to have to derive meaning and fulfillment from some other source.

So knowing that materially I'm set for the rest of my life, why the hell would I give up on my dream to play for my childhood hockey team? Am I missing something here? Yeah, I'll take an extra 2 million a year (which will likely end up sitting in the bank until the day I die after which my kids will inherit it) and play for a team I couldn't care less about.

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Old
05-09-2008, 02:27 PM
  #562
Lucius
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Originally Posted by Habs_Apostle View Post
Yes but if you're making 4 million a year for 5-10 years, you'll make more than someone who makes 50,000 a year over the course of their lifetimes. So I think the studies are still relevant.

But just use common sense man. I mean, what is the extra 2 million a year going to give you? How exactly is that extra 2 million a year going to improve the quality of your life? Being able to buy a home with a few more acres or another porsche will markedly improve my happiness? Come on, you can't be serious. I'm pretty sure I could make myself and my family materially comfortable with the 4 million a year I'll earn over the course of my career. After a certain amount of materialism, the gains in the quality of your life will be negligable. After that you're going to have to derive meaning and fulfillment from some other source.

So knowing that materially I'm set for the rest of my life, why the hell would I give up on my dream to play for my childhood hockey team? Am I missing something here? Yeah, I'll take an extra 2 million a year (which will likely end up sitting in the bank until the day I die after which my kids will inherit it) and play for a team I couldn't care less about.
Millions of dollars is big, but when you only make them for a few years, it's not going to "set them for life", really. They will not only work, they will need to work and the bigger the nest egg they make young the less they have to worry as they age.

And when you take someone like Bunnestrom, he has no personal reason to play in Montreal. It makes much more sense for him to go somewhere warm and with peers (Swedes his age).

Briere, on the other hand, has probably seen the ringer we put French players through and wanted to play with friends in Philly.

I see your point about quality of life, but honestly, Montreal isn't 2 million dollars a year better than any other NHL city. If the team was in Eastern Europe or something, I might see your point.

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Old
05-09-2008, 04:44 PM
  #563
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Bahhh good riddance, this guy sounded like a future bust anyways...

Seems like Montreal Frontrunners = Hopeless

Ohh well....

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Old
05-09-2008, 08:04 PM
  #564
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Originally Posted by Brisk-Illusion View Post
You also can't compete with the taxes, weather and atmosphere* there.

*If you're 23 and never played outside Sweden and have a chance to come to the NHL and have the privilege of picking a city in which to play, are you going to go someplace where the fans already expect you to be the savior, or are you going to go play somewhere you can adjust to the NA game without fear of being stocked outside your house ?

Going to a place like Montreal or Toronto would have been suicidal for a player in his position.
The weather in Dallas can be dreadful in the summer. It's so hot and sunny that you could burn your hand before you ever got into your car.

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Old
05-09-2008, 08:08 PM
  #565
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I think Brunnstrom made a very sound choice in Dallas. No hard feelings.

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Old
05-09-2008, 08:09 PM
  #566
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
Millions of dollars is big, but when you only make them for a few years, it's not going to "set them for life", really. They will not only work, they will need to work and the bigger the nest egg they make young the less they have to worry as they age.

And when you take someone like Bunnestrom, he has no personal reason to play in Montreal. It makes much more sense for him to go somewhere warm and with peers (Swedes his age).

Briere, on the other hand, has probably seen the ringer we put French players through and wanted to play with friends in Philly.

I see your point about quality of life, but honestly, Montreal isn't 2 million dollars a year better than any other NHL city. If the team was in Eastern Europe or something, I might see your point.
Man, are you naive. Being successful in a professional sport can bring all sorts of business opportunities after retirement. That is, if you plan ahead and don't spend your post-retirement years with your elbows proped on a bar.

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Old
05-09-2008, 11:22 PM
  #567
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Man, are you naive. Being successful in a professional sport can bring all sorts of business opportunities after retirement. That is, if you plan ahead and don't spend your post-retirement years with your elbows proped on a bar.
Agreed, but what does that have to do with signing with your hometown favorite?

Again, you're only reinforcing my point. You're best bet financially is to sign with the team that has the "best chance of winning" and despite the mocking of Briere, last summer, they definitely looked like the most improved team and hey, look at the playoffs, he's among its leading scorers and his team is in the Eastern Finals, so how bad of a choice did he truly make?

He's having more success, he's gone further in the playoffs and he likely pocketed about 2 million more this year.

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