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learning from Ottawa's mistakes -almost 10 years of futility

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Old
05-10-2008, 09:31 PM
  #26
Guillemin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by znk View Post
If they had 10 years of futility...what do we call the Habs last 10 years?
Extended hangover.

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05-10-2008, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
If they had 10 years of futility...what do we call the Habs last 10 years?
It's not about how good they were. We understand that they were miles ahead of us. The point is that if our goal is to win a Cup while being dominant, we don't want to end up like Ottawa and not win a Cup during that time frame.

Futility is a bit harsh though. Dissappointment is a better one.

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05-10-2008, 09:42 PM
  #28
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They had too many Europeans not willing to pay the price in the playoffs. Top line with Bonk and Hossa doesn't help, then you have Havlat and what was then an immature Alfie (he's a much more mature and better player now obviously). Plus going into the playoffs with Lalime as your starter doesn't help either.

Habs have Price, which is a big difference in itself. I would like them to get a little tougher up front, some North American boys. They have been drafting them, but we're going to have to wait a few years for that group to make an impact.

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05-10-2008, 09:47 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
If they had 10 years of futility...what do we call the Habs last 10 years?
2 years of denial, 3 years of attempting a rebuild, 5 years of a successful rebuild. Or do you think the past 5 rebuilding years were futile??

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05-10-2008, 09:52 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
They had too many Europeans not willing to pay the price in the playoffs. Top line with Bonk and Hossa doesn't help, then you have Havlat and what was then an immature Alfie (he's a much more mature and better player now obviously). Plus going into the playoffs with Lalime as your starter doesn't help either.

Habs have Price, which is a big difference in itself. I would like them to get a little tougher up front, some North American boys. They have been drafting them, but we're going to have to wait a few years for that group to make an impact.
You also forgot Yashin,who was the captain in Ottawa if I recall correctly.

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05-10-2008, 11:18 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Prickly Pete View Post
Get a goalie that doesn't choke in the playoffs and lose the soft euros.
Like lose the soft Euro Hossa who is lighting up the playoffs and trade him for Canadian boy Heatley who is lighting up the World Championships?

Or how about losing that Euro trash Chara in order to keep Canadian boy Redden


Hockey fan from the valley = Dumbest sports fan in North America. Why? Because they buy this type of garbage more than fans of any other team. Why? Because they keep choking to against their biggets rivals ... and so on...

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05-11-2008, 12:49 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by KostitsyntheBagBaby View Post
come on, I'm serious here. I think it's important to look at the failures of other franchises so we don't end up as the team that never had what it takes to go all the way.

Who better to use as an example than one of the top teams from the past decade?
I look at Gainey's time in Dallas, almost as training for his true calling here. He got to build a contender and win a cup and then afterwards made mistakes that lead to a dismal 2002 season and his resignation. So Gainey got to learn what it takes to lose and how quickly it can fall apart. He knows how quickly things can fall apart like they have in Ottawa, he was a part of it in Dallas.

You see what a great job he did and what a high standard he set in Dallas, because that 2002 season is the only blip on the radar. They missed the playoffs with 90 points. Only three times have they not hit the 100 point mark since 1997. He built such a strong foundation there.

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Old
05-11-2008, 01:42 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Brieremania View Post
Ottawa has never had good enough goaltending..... Lalime was just not good enough to bet the starting goalie of a Stanley Cup Champ.... Domenik Hasek was a nice try but an injury and old age ruined that attempt.... Emery was solid one year and it got them close, but he still isn't an elite goalie and this year he blew up.... Gerber is not gonna get it done either.

I like that we have two young goalies right now... one of them should be able to step up and be the kind of goalie every cup champ needs.

The sens of the 2000s and late 90s have a lot in common with the Flyers that overlapped the same time period.... Never got the help in net to get them over the hump.
It's way beyond that I think, I just hate the way they do things. Calling out players in the media, making a different excuse with every failure (that usually is calling out a certain player), The Hossa sitiuation in particular was low class, the way they exposed Redden not lifting his no trade was no class, the way they run capital tickets is no class.

Then these geniuses look at the Tampa model and do the exact same thing overpaying Spezza and Heatley. The best goalie this team has ever had was Lalime and he was made the scrapegoat when players like Alfreddson and Havlat were just trash when they played the Leafs inn the playoffs and they are doing the exact same thing now with Emery . Now there is a division in the dressing room sponsered by the "captain"

They fire a GM who made it to the SCF's and replaced him with Bryan fricking Murray winner of nothing and what happens....thats right they barely make the playoffs and get swept. This team will be a lottery team next year, didn't even sell out either of thier playoff games and will have a hit on season tickets of about 2-3 thousand because of the way they forced fans to buy season tickets this year to get a ticket to the Stanley Cup finals.

I feel for Sens fans because this city will not support a losing team as the playoffs showed and it's not going to be easy to improve when you have huge expensive contracts hindering you.

They need to get rid of the cancers on the team (Redden, Alfredson and Emery) and start getting good character players...something they have lacked the whole time.

Montreal has a good young team with a great General Manager, I can't see them falling in the same trap as the Senators because the fans will not allow it

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05-11-2008, 01:44 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AH View Post
Like lose the soft Euro Hossa who is lighting up the playoffs and trade him for Canadian boy Heatley who is lighting up the World Championships?

Or how about losing that Euro trash Chara in order to keep Canadian boy Redden


Hockey fan from the valley = Dumbest sports fan in North America. Why? Because they buy this type of garbage more than fans of any other team. Why? Because they keep choking to against their biggets rivals ... and so on...

Heatley is great at scoring in meaningless games as soon as the WC games mean something I expect him to dry up like a desert

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Old
05-11-2008, 02:00 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by KostitsyntheBagBaby View Post
2 years of denial, 3 years of attempting a rebuild, 5 years of a successful rebuild. Or do you think the past 5 rebuilding years were futile??
I'd trade Montreal's last 10 years for Ottawa's.

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Old
05-11-2008, 02:35 AM
  #36
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Anyway we have a goalie and Ottawa never had a good one. Thats it thats all, you cant win a cup without a good goalie.

-2007: Giguere
2006: Ward
2004: Khabi
2003 :Brodeur
2002: Hasek
2001: Roy
2000: Brodeur
1999 : Belfour
....
4 Vezina winners, 3 Conn Smythe winners.

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Old
05-11-2008, 02:38 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by henri2014 View Post
Anyway we have a goalie and Ottawa never had a good one. Thats it thats all, you cant win a cup without a good goalie.

-2007: Giguere
2006: Ward
2004: Khabi
2003 :Brodeur
2002: Hasek
2001: Roy
2000: Brodeur
1999 : Belfour
....
4 Vezina winners, 3 Conn Smythe winners.
I disagree with the good goaltender part, you need a hot goaltender. Obviously you have a better chance with a better goaltender, but if you have an average one that suddenly becomes hot, you have a good chance at winning the cup.

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05-11-2008, 02:42 AM
  #38
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simplest solution? get a goalie.

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Old
05-11-2008, 03:06 AM
  #39
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Oh For **** Sake GUYS. We JUST got the Eulogy thread closed, and someone had to start a thread like this??!

The **** is wrong with this board!

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05-11-2008, 03:08 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Chomsky View Post
Oh For **** Sake GUYS. We JUST got the Eulogy thread closed, and someone had to start a thread like this??!

The **** is wrong with this board!
This is the "Oh, yeah, well TAKE THIS!" thread.

This is a pictorial representation of HFBoards.


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Old
05-11-2008, 10:04 AM
  #41
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Sens should bring in Rejean Houle. He would get them all the "Joueurs de characteres" that they need.

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05-11-2008, 10:06 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by SilverLine View Post
I disagree with the good goaltender part, you need a hot goaltender. Obviously you have a better chance with a better goaltender, but if you have an average one that suddenly becomes hot, you have a good chance at winning the cup.
Every Sens fan that I meet says this. What kind of crap is Emery feeding you guys lol

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Old
05-11-2008, 10:09 AM
  #43
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I can only pray for a Sundin this summer.

Imagine if he wins a cup in Montreal? All hell would break loose in Toronto

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Originally Posted by lou4gehrig View Post
Yeah, that shows he's CLUTCH. Not like Lidstrom, Forsberg, Zetterberg, Lundqvist, Alfredsson, Sedins, Ohlund, Holmstrom had nothing to do with that? It was all about Mats showing how clutch he was.

Mats can take his gold medal and retire back to Sweden. He's not a the warrior we need in the middle and he's not welcome here. A proven playoff performer like Forsberg. That's a different story.

It's amazing how Sundin gets put in the same category as the greats like Yzerman, Sakic, Francis, Trottier. He hasn't earned that. He's a level below that caliber of player. He gets elevated by playing in Toronto where he is treated like a god for some reason.

He's essentially Pierre Turgeon all over again. Similar stats, similar non-impact player in the playoffs. So you're asking me do I want a 37-year old Pierre Turgeon clone next season? No thanks.

Just the fact that you're comparing him to Pierre Turgeon shows that you've probably seen him play maybe a handful of time. At the very least, not enough to be able to judge him.


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05-11-2008, 10:14 AM
  #44
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All i know is that the best thing that ever happened on the ice last year in Ottawa was this guy who in my humble opinion represents quite nicely the Sens players and top brass: he looks tough and he shouts a lot but at the end nothing happens... except a lot of hot air.

From "We are Lions" (yeah, right) to a half naked
Spartan wanna be on the ice and a first round
elimination: waaay to go Sens...woohooo..



Last edited by Ice Poutine: 05-11-2008 at 10:27 AM.
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Old
05-11-2008, 10:23 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Go Habs Go View Post
Every Sens fan that I meet says this. What kind of crap is Emery feeding you guys lol
Emery was never a hot in the playoffs, the team in front of him was.

Cam Ward would be my example, he's a good goaltender, but nothing special. He got hot in the playoffs and took his team to the Cup. Roloson would be another example, nothing special in the regular season, but he stole the show and took his team to game 7 of the SCF

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05-11-2008, 10:27 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by SilverLine View Post
Emery was never a hot in the playoffs, the team in front of him was.

Cam Ward would be my example, he's a good goaltender, but nothing special. He got hot in the playoffs and took his team to the Cup. Roloson would be another example, nothing special in the regular season, but he stole the show and took his team to game 7 of the SCF
You've provided 2 examples, and one of them isn't about a team that won the cup. You're example just proves that its a longshot. Why would the sens want to go for a longshot when it comes to the cup instead of getting a solid goalie that might give them a better chance? If you think that an average goalie is good enough then you have to accept the fact that the chances of you winning the cup is slim to none unless by "chance" your goalie gets hot (which still doesn't garantee anything like your Roloson example).

to me, the odds aren't that great

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05-11-2008, 10:28 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Ice Poutine View Post
All i know is that the best thing that ever happened on the ice last year in Ottawa was this guy who in my humble opinion represents quite nicely the Sens players and top brass: he looks tough and he shouts a lot but at the end nothing happens... except a lot of hot air.

From "We are Lions" (yeah, right) to a half naked
Spartan wanna be on the ice and a first round
elimination: waaay to go Sens...woohooo..


Is that Randy Cunneyworth? lol

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Old
05-11-2008, 10:31 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Go Habs Go View Post
You've provided 2 examples, and one of them isn't about a team that won the cup. You're example just proves that its a longshot. Why would the sens want to go for a longshot when it comes to the cup instead of getting a solid goalie that might give them a better chance? If you think that an average goalie is good enough then you have to accept the fact that the chances of you winning the cup is slim to none unless by "chance" your goalie gets hot (which still doesn't garantee anything like your Roloson example).
Because not every team can get a Luongo, Brodeur, Nabokov or Price on their team. You go for the best goaltender available in FA or trade, this year if you look, there isn't much and almost every goaltender would be a gamble.

You could also add Khabibulin to that earlier list.

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05-11-2008, 10:36 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by SilverLine View Post
Because not every team can get a Luongo, Brodeur, Nabokov or Price on their team. You go for the best goaltender available in FA or trade, this year if you look, there isn't much and almost every goaltender would be a gamble.

You could also add Khabibulin to that earlier list.
Khabibulin was a very good goalie and doesn't really belong in that list. But anyways..

Ottawa has a stable of fine talent, young, old whatever.. How about trading one for a goalie? Hell..they're sitting tight with a goalie that doesn't even have enough respect for the team to come to practice on time.

All I'm trying to say is, I'm shocked Sens fans aren't freaking out on the team's management to fix the most obvious hole on their team. All the Heatleys, Spezzas, Reddens, Charas...all wasted if you don't have an adequate goalie. These guys won't be around for long, this is the time to make things happen, but unless you get a goalie, no matter your ranking, you won't be a contender for the cup.

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05-11-2008, 10:49 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Go Habs Go View Post
All I'm trying to say is, I'm shocked Sens fans aren't freaking out on the team's management to fix the most obvious hole on their team. All the Heatleys, Spezzas, Reddens, Charas...all wasted if you don't have an adequate goalie. These guys won't be around for long, this is the time to make things happen, but unless you get a goalie, no matter your ranking, you won't be a contender for the cup.
It's been exhausted on our board, lets not get into Redden/Chara that causes the biggest debates on our forum (besides Gerber, Emery)

What am I looking for in management? Draft a goalie, develop Elliott (Starting goaltender for our AHL team). Lastly, find a freaking goaltender that doesn't divide the dressing room or crack faster then an egg under pressure.

Every trade I see always involves Meszaros and a whole bunch of prospects/picks for one goaltender. If you look at most of the Ottawa prospects, they will be making serious challenges for roster spots. Considering we have Kelly, Stillman, Lapointe, Donovan, Robitaille as UFA, Vermette as RFA and Commodore, Richardson, Redden as UFA and Mezaros as RFA, I think that a lot of our prospects - Brian Lee (D), Nick Foligno (F), Alexander Nikulin (F), Winchester (F), Cody Bass (F) and others will be making a jump next year.

Murray and management seem to be ok with Gerber, I disagree, hopefully they will change their minds.

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