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05-20-2008, 10:17 AM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
You might take that as it reads, but do you think that'd be the only offer? It's not like Minnesota is sitting back to deal exclusively with us. We offer Cherepanov + Sanguinetti + 1st and (for example) San Jose offers Carle + Michalek + 1st. Now, as Minnesota, who do you take?



He's still signed through the 08-09 season. Getting a player a full season before they hit the free market isn't the same as renting a player for 2 months at the end of the season.

If you want to rent Gaborik at the end of the year, sure, Anisimov + Callahan + 1st might work, but then again even Hossa cost a former 1st rounder, a depth player, a top prospect and a first.
I like Dubi as much as the next guy. I'm just here to play devils advocate.
Anisimov should have been a 1st roudner but b/c of the lack of the transfer agreement fell and he is a top prospect. Cally would be dept. and a 1st rder could be fine. Don't forget that Atlanta also sent Dupuis back the other way as well.

Also even though he is signed through the 08-09 season the 1st rder for this year could be crucial as it is a deep draft. So Anisimov, Prucha, Cally/Girardi and a 1st could be enough.

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05-20-2008, 10:19 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
Anisimov should have been a 1st roudner but b/c of the lack of the transfer agreement fell and he is a top prospect. Cally would be dept. and a 1st rder could be fine. Don't forget that Atlanta also sent Dupuis back the other way as well.

Also even though he is signed through the 08-09 season the 1st rder for this year could be crucial as it is a deep draft. So Anisimov, Prucha, Cally/Girardi and a 1st could be enough.
and i would definitely do that deal.

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05-20-2008, 10:20 AM
  #103
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IMO....i think Rolston would be a better fit for Gomez than Gaborik. He is a fast guy who is going to shoot. He isn't going to try all this fancy stuff. Gaborik is more of a Jagr type player and Gomez can't work with that. Rolston is a North South player who isn't going to mess around. He is going to get up in the offensive rush and make something happen. Yes Gaborik is enticing but as far as im concerned, Anisimov, Cherry, Sangs, Dubi, and Staal are all untouchable in the Rangers book. It isn't worth trading them because of how important they are to our future. We are still rebuilding here despite our success the last few years and Sather has to remember that.

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05-20-2008, 10:21 AM
  #104
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and i would definitely do that deal.
I think it could actually be enough and if not throw in another prospect or two like a bourret, or hillier. Again we have enough prospects to spare. it all depends on 2 things.

A) what other teams bid
B) Gabbys contract negotiations

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05-20-2008, 10:24 AM
  #105
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IMO....i think Rolston would be a better fit for Gomez than Gaborik. He is a fast guy who is going to shoot. He isn't going to try all this fancy stuff. Gaborik is more of a Jagr type player and Gomez can't work with that. Rolston is a North South player who isn't going to mess around. He is going to get up in the offensive rush and make something happen. Yes Gaborik is enticing but as far as im concerned, Anisimov, Cherry, Sangs, Dubi, and Staal are all untouchable in the Rangers book. It isn't worth trading them because of how important they are to our future. We are still rebuilding here despite our success the last few years and Sather has to remember that.
Rolston is 36. Can he keep playing at that level?

and I'm sorry but since when did prospects who haven't played a game in North America, or havent played 10 games in the AHL, or haven't played a game in the NHL become untouchable for a player who is almost a PPG in the NHL, is only 26, and is basically a perennial all-star. Am I missing something here? I understand we want some homegrown players but y do people insist on not wanting sure-fire allstars who are young? But want a 36yr old player who is going to be going into the downside of his career. Is 36 the new 26?


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05-20-2008, 10:24 AM
  #106
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Originally Posted by FutureGM97 View Post
IMO....i think Rolston would be a better fit for Gomez than Gaborik. He is a fast guy who is going to shoot. He isn't going to try all this fancy stuff. Gaborik is more of a Jagr type player and Gomez can't work with that. Rolston is a North South player who isn't going to mess around. He is going to get up in the offensive rush and make something happen. Yes Gaborik is enticing but as far as im concerned, Anisimov, Cherry, Sangs, Dubi, and Staal are all untouchable in the Rangers book. It isn't worth trading them because of how important they are to our future. We are still rebuilding here despite our success the last few years and Sather has to remember that.
did rolston play on the same line as Drury in Colorado and with Gomez in Jersey????

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05-20-2008, 10:24 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
Anisimov should have been a 1st roudner but b/c of the lack of the transfer agreement fell and he is a top prospect. Cally would be dept. and a 1st rder could be fine. Don't forget that Atlanta also sent Dupuis back the other way as well.

Also even though he is signed through the 08-09 season the 1st rder for this year could be crucial as it is a deep draft. So Anisimov, Prucha, Cally/Girardi and a 1st could be enough.
A guy that should have been a 1st rounder and is also a top prospect isn't the equivalent of a 1st rounder AND a top prospect. A Volkswagen has Audi and Lamborghini parts in it, that doesn't mean it's just as good as having an RS4 and a Gallardo in your garage.

But again, I'm not necessarily advocating trading for Gaborik. I think the safer play is waiting for him to hit the open market.

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05-20-2008, 10:25 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
I think it could actually be enough and if not throw in another prospect or two like a bourret, or hillier. Again we have enough prospects to spare. it all depends on 2 things.

A) what other teams bid
B) Gabbys contract negotiations
just because we got prospects to spare we should not give them away.

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05-20-2008, 10:27 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
Rolston is 36. Can he keep playing at that level?
Why shouldn't he be able to? Jeremy Roenick is still a hell of a player (maybe not scoring but in other areas)....Chelios is still a hell of a Dman...when Forsberg is healthy he is awesome. Rolston

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Originally Posted by RCallahan43 View Post
did rolston play on the same line as Drury in Colorado and with Gomez in Jersey????

Did Gomez play on a line with Jagr in Pittsburgh? no. But when yo get free agents, u have all camp to figure out who is compatible with who and just from watching Brian Rolston and the way he plays, he seems like he would be a good fit for Gomez.

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05-20-2008, 10:34 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by FutureGM97 View Post
Why shouldn't he be able to? Jeremy Roenick is still a hell of a player (maybe not scoring but in other areas)....Chelios is still a hell of a Dman...when Forsberg is healthy he is awesome. Rolston




Did Gomez play on a line with Jagr in Pittsburgh? no. But when yo get free agents, u have all camp to figure out who is compatible with who and just from watching Brian Rolston and the way he plays, he seems like he would be a good fit for Gomez.
umm gomez and rolston was teammates in jersey that is why i was asking, and same for Drury and Rolston colorado. i was not trying to be a smartass

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05-20-2008, 10:35 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
A guy that should have been a 1st rounder and is also a top prospect isn't the equivalent of a 1st rounder AND a top prospect. A Volkswagen has Audi and Lamborghini parts in it, that doesn't mean it's just as good as having an RS4 and a Gallardo in your garage.

But again, I'm not necessarily advocating trading for Gaborik. I think the safer play is waiting for him to hit the open market.
are you really considering Colby Armstrong a 1st rounder. I mean yeah he was drafted in the first round but he's a 3rd line player (tops). Hell than throw in Sjostrom or backman they were first rounders. And don't forget that Atlanta sent 2 players back to Pitt.


Anisimov (top prospect)
Jessiman (1st rd pick) happy
Cally
and a 1st rnd pick.

is that really a big difference from Anisimov, Cally and a 1st.

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05-20-2008, 10:37 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by RCallahan43 View Post
umm gomez and rolston was teammates in jersey that is why i was asking, and same for Drury and Rolston colorado. i was not trying to be a smartass
lol sry im wired right now. had a bit too much coffee


I have no idea if they did but i wouldnt be surprised. And they have played on Team USA teams so they probably did there too. Could anyone check this out?

EDIT: Rolston played on a line with Gomez and Guerin in 2004 for Team USA

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05-20-2008, 10:38 AM
  #113
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Why shouldn't he be able to? Jeremy Roenick is still a hell of a player (maybe not scoring but in other areas)....Chelios is still a hell of a Dman...when Forsberg is healthy he is awesome. Rolston
but we need scoring. Gaborik>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rolston. and he is a heck of alot younger. 10 yrs in fact. he hasn't hit his prime. I really have a hard time understanding some fans, we want youth want to get younger, but would rather have a 36yr old who has to start declining soon over a 26 yr old stud who is just coming into his own.

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05-20-2008, 10:41 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
but we need scoring. Gaborik>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rolston. and he is a heck of alot younger. 10 yrs in fact. he hasn't hit his prime. I really have a hard time understanding some fans, we want youth want to get younger, but would rather have a 36yr old who has to start declining soon over a 26 yr old stud who is just coming into his own.
i want to get younger but why trade for someone who is going to gut the youth that we already have? plus, Gaborik is an injury prone guy. I don't want that. I would rather replace Shanny and Straka (i dont think they are coming back) with some veteran leadership like Rolston who can still bomb them from the point and score coming down the wing.

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05-20-2008, 10:41 AM
  #115
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are you really considering Colby Armstrong a 1st rounder. I mean yeah he was drafted in the first round but he's a 3rd line player (tops). Hell than throw in Sjostrom or backman they were first rounders. And don't forget that Atlanta sent 2 players back to Pitt.


Anisimov (top prospect)
Jessiman (1st rd pick) happy
Cally
and a 1st rnd pick.

is that really a big difference from Anisimov, Cally and a 1st.
nah lets throw in backman just to get rid of him, he was a first rounder.

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05-20-2008, 10:44 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
but we need scoring. Gaborik>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rolston. and he is a heck of alot younger. 10 yrs in fact. he hasn't hit his prime. I really have a hard time understanding some fans, we want youth want to get younger, but would rather have a 36yr old who has to start declining soon over a 26 yr old stud who is just coming into his own.
I wouldn't say we need scoring in the sense of adding PlayerX to the line-up. I think our scoring would increase dramatically if we added the two key players we all know we need to the blueline, thereby taking some defensive pressure off of our forwards. I'd rather have our current line-up of forwards, minus one or two, and add an Orpik/Lilles/JBo/Pit/etc. to the d-corp, which is my hunch for the direction we go in.

So, drop Malik, Mara, and Rosie, waive/trade Backman, and add a PP QB and a heavy hitter, and I say with confidence, our scoring will more resemble '06-'07 than '07-'08. Btw, we don't necessarily need the BEST PP QB or hitter, just players that are a noticeable upgrade.

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05-20-2008, 10:47 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by FutureGM97 View Post
lol sry im wired right now. had a bit too much coffee


I have no idea if they did but i wouldnt be surprised. And they have played on Team USA teams so they probably did there too. Could anyone check this out?

EDIT: Rolston played on a line with Gomez and Guerin in 2004 for Team USA
hmm maybe we can get tkachuk from the blues and send back backman lol jk but we def need some size on the wings.

bell and 2ed in 08 for prucha and backman get it done slats........ bell has his problems and u know sather loves giving guys second chances, heck he did give the criminal tibbetts a second chance

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05-20-2008, 10:52 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
are you really considering Colby Armstrong a 1st rounder. I mean yeah he was drafted in the first round but he's a 3rd line player (tops). Hell than throw in Sjostrom or backman they were first rounders. And don't forget that Atlanta sent 2 players back to Pitt.


Anisimov (top prospect)
Jessiman (1st rd pick) happy
Cally
and a 1st rnd pick.

is that really a big difference from Anisimov, Cally and a 1st.
I am considering him a first rounder, because he is. The fact is that Armstrong is at least an NHL caliber player. Sure he might be a 3rd liner, but he averages 35 points, plays both ends of the ice, has grit, speed and he fights. Do you really think Hugh Jessiman is a viable comparison?

If you want to try and start matching players, the only player on our roster who is comparable to Armstrong in terms of skillset is Avery.

Avery + Callahan + Anisimov + 1st
Gaborik + Radivojevic

Armstrong + Christensen + Esposito + 1st
Hossa + Dupuis

Now at least you're somewhat even in terms of value. But like I said, you're also getting Gaborik for the entire year, which is going to cost you more.

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05-20-2008, 10:57 AM
  #119
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I wouldn't say we need scoring in the sense of adding PlayerX to the line-up. I think our scoring would increase dramatically if we added the two key players we all know we need to the blueline, thereby taking some defensive pressure off of our forwards. I'd rather have our current line-up of forwards, minus one or two, and add an Orpik/Lilles/JBo/Pit/etc. to the d-corp, which is my hunch for the direction we go in.

So, drop Malik, Mara, and Rosie, waive/trade Backman, and add a PP QB and a heavy hitter, and I say with confidence, our scoring will more resemble '06-'07 than '07-'08. Btw, we don't necessarily need the BEST PP QB or hitter, just players that are a noticeable upgrade.
But we are going to probably lose Shanny, and Straka, and maybe Avery and Jagr. That's alot of offense we need to replace. Even if its just Shanny and Straka, thats some serious holes to fill up. I don't think that Dawes and Cally will be able to replace it just yet.

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05-20-2008, 11:01 AM
  #120
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how about getting torres from edmonton. maybe torres and peckham for prucha, Dawes and backman. Peckham played on the same team as Sang but Im not sure if they played as defensive unit. Peckham is a physical dman that drops the gloves.

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05-20-2008, 11:02 AM
  #121
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But we are going to probably lose Shanny, and Straka, and maybe Avery and Jagr. That's alot of offense we need to replace. Even if its just Shanny and Straka, thats some serious holes to fill up. I don't think that Dawes and Cally will be able to replace it just yet.
I think Jagr & Avery will be back, and I think as Dubi, Cally, & Dawes mature, they will find the net. They all have a nose for the puck. Add maybe Korp to the thrid/fourth line and I think you can make up for the loss of Shanny & Straka's goals. Plus a half-decent PP QB will pot a few goals (as will Staal this season), and I think you more than compensate for the loss of their 37 goals. Basically, you need the core the top 6 + Staal + PP QB (so eight players total) to come up with 37 goals, or 4.6 goals apiece.

Upgrade our defense to let the scorers play their game a bit more, and I think we match that output+.

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05-20-2008, 11:03 AM
  #122
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I am considering him a first rounder, because he is. The fact is that Armstrong is at least an NHL caliber player. Sure he might be a 3rd liner, but he averages 35 points, plays both ends of the ice, has grit, speed and he fights. Do you really think Hugh Jessiman is a viable comparison?

If you want to try and start matching players, the only player on our roster who is comparable to Armstrong in terms of skillset is Avery.

Avery + Callahan + Anisimov + 1st
Gaborik + Radivojevic

Armstrong + Christensen + Esposito + 1st
Hossa + Dupuis

Now at least you're somewhat even in terms of value. But like I said, you're also getting Gaborik for the entire year, which is going to cost you more.
I think Avery is much better than Armstrong, but I see what your saying. I actually think Sjostrom or Dawes is Armstrongs equivalent.

But even if it was Avery I would pull that deal. Sorry but Gabo is that good.

But again we will have to shell out a big contract for Gabo. So I will assume that the contract for Gabo will be about the same as a contract for Hossa. Their skill levels are very comparable to. Hossa isn't as fragile, better defensively. Gabo better offensively. Why not go after Hossa which won't cost us any prospects? Please Sather just go after Hossa.

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05-20-2008, 11:04 AM
  #123
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I think Jagr & Avery will be back, and I think as Dubi, Cally, & Dawes mature, they will find the net. They all have a nose for the puck. Add maybe Korp to the thrid/fourth line and I think you can make up for the loss of Shanny & Straka's goals. Plus a half-decent PP QB will pot a few goals (as will Staal this season), and I think you more than compensate for the loss of their 37 goals. Basically, you need the core the top 6 + Staal + PP QB (so eight players total) to come up with 37 goals, or 4.6 goals apiece.

Upgrade our defense to let the scorers play their game a bit more, and I think we match that output+.
very good point. You could very well be right with this.

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05-20-2008, 11:14 AM
  #124
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how about getting torres from edmonton. maybe torres and peckham for prucha, Dawes and backman. Peckham played on the same team as Sang but Im not sure if they played as defensive unit. Peckham is a physical dman that drops the gloves.
I'd rather get an NHL ready d-man from the UFA pool. Plus, Edm is going to be looking to drop some players from their roster, not add more.

I do like Torres though.

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05-20-2008, 11:16 AM
  #125
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