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Rangers to offer Sundin 7 Million?

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Old
05-24-2008, 12:47 AM
  #51
EvilCorporateLawyer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h0rac3 View Post
It would be absolutely terrible and I would flip out. No thanks.
And tell me. Who's better this offseason?

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Old
05-24-2008, 01:41 AM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
And tell me. Who's better this offseason?
I think we should sign Sundin and Jagr for two years. They can still play.

Look at these forward lines.

Avery Sundin Jagr
Dawes Gomez Drury
Korpikoski Dubinski Callahan

These three lines are solid.
We can have them for two years.
Go for it.


We finally get a center for Jagr.
We get the scoring we need.

The only other forward to get besides Sundin is Rolston and lets face it Sundin is the best player available and exactly what we need.

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Old
05-24-2008, 01:44 AM
  #53
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Until one of Drury or Gomez is traded, which I don't see happening, especially with Drury, this is not happening.

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05-24-2008, 01:45 AM
  #54
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Wow, 7 million dollars for Sundin? No thanks.

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05-24-2008, 01:47 AM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranger35 View Post
Until one of Drury or Gomez is traded, which I don't see happening, especially with Drury, this is not happening.
I think it's a big mistake if they don't. Drury can be moved to right wing and with Gomez and Dawes make a great line. Look at the chemistry of the team and the lines with Sundin.

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05-24-2008, 01:50 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KotsyJr View Post
Wow, 7 million dollars for Sundin? No thanks.
Let me ask you this. If Shanahan was like Sundin right now how much would you pay him. Shanahan worked out great. For two years.

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05-24-2008, 02:04 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ebn View Post
I think it's a big mistake if they don't. Drury can be moved to right wing and with Gomez and Dawes make a great line. Look at the chemistry of the team and the lines with Sundin.
How do you know the chemistry with Sundin will be all that great? And how do you know Drury will work well for us on the wing?

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05-24-2008, 02:11 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geisenNYR View Post
I can't see the rangers paying sundin 7 million dollars. He is getting older and he is an injury risk. The last thing this team needs is another old man who will play 40-50 games. He is a great player but I would much rather spend that money on Hossa or Campbell.
Well, true, but I don't really see Sundin as an injury risk. He's played at least 70 games every season except the lock-outs (even when he broke his orbital bone).
Still not worth that much money, though.

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Old
05-24-2008, 02:36 AM
  #59
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Perhaps a silly question, but is anyone considering signing some defensemen?

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Old
05-24-2008, 02:38 AM
  #60
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i sense bull crap? lol
overpaying an overaged player

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Old
05-24-2008, 02:52 AM
  #61
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Regardless of whether you want him or not:

Sundin claimed to refuse a deadline move because he didn't want to be a "rental" player.
If he signs with us for 1 year, then that's essentially what he becomes.
He'd come off looking a complete arse.

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Old
05-24-2008, 08:37 AM
  #62
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idealism as summer sets in,,,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sockosensei View Post
Regardless of whether you want him or not:

Sundin claimed to refuse a deadline move because he didn't want to be a "rental" player.
If he signs with us for 1 year, then that's essentially what he becomes.
He'd come off looking a complete arse.
True

But I am bored so I give it a theoretical shot for fun here below
Flame away my equally unexcited colleagues:

MY new IDEAL LINEUP

Cherepenov - Sundin -Jagr ( 1.200 + 6.500 + 6,500 = 14,200) WOW
Dawes -Gomez - Drury (1,000 + 7,357 + 7,050 = 15,407) The best 2nd line in hockey
Korpedo -Dubi - Callahan (1,017 + 633 + 575 = 2,225)
Sjostrom - Betts - Byers/Orr (775 + 615 + 608 + 538 = 2,536)
Close - AA, Moore, Jessiman, Bourret...
Total cost of forwards = 34,368

Staal - K Jönsson (827 + 4,500 = 5,327)
Tyutin - Girardi (2,844 + 1,500 = 4,344)
Murray - Orpik/Commodore (550 + 2,500 = 3,050)

Hutchinsson (600) - basically because he is from Evanston, Illinois
Close - Baranka, Potter, Sangs, Sauer
Total Defense = 13,321
20996+34368
Lundqvist (6,875)
Vally/J Hedberg (0,8) - whoever signs but I go with The Moose
Total cost for goalies - 7,675

TOTAL COST of this roster - 55,364
The overage from 2007/2008 is around 780 + some unclarity about Jagrs contract however that might need to be added on (if Jagr resigns - are the Rangers still penalized by 760 by his old clause??)
The total capspace 2008/2009 is projected at 55.500 - 56.000. This would in effect then somehow barely squeeze in - just like this year.
I like this lineup better though. a lot grittier with a real PP D and 2 real top lines to through at them frozen birds in the Mellon Dome. Tell Chere that he has to come and play with Jagr/Sundin. That would be a mentor opportunity nobody would refuse...Like when the 3 musketeers told D´Artignan he must get on board


Costs Resigning

Jagr - 2 years 13 M + bonuses (its gonna cost this)
Dawes (RFA) 1 year at 1,0 M
Hutchinsson - 1 year at 0,6 M

UFA:s
Sundin - 1 year/years at 6,5 M (6,5 M cap hit 2008/2009 + some bonuses)
Orpik/Commodore (one of both of these options) sign at 5,5 for 2 years
Throw 4,5 M at Kenny Jönsson for a 1 year UFA deal. I do not know the situation with his rights or if he wants to follow his hometown Rögle into the SEL - but he still definitely has got what it takes (injury prone though) - but is a "darkhorse" short term solution until Bobby Sangs (hopefully) shows up. I know it is a huge gamble - but with a potentially very high payoff dividend. The 3rd pairing on D would be nasty.
Vally/Hedberg for 0,8

Other Transactions
P Prucha traded to San Jose for D Murray + minor leaguer/pick
Backman + Hollweg - used to try to trade up somewhat at the draft deadline (fat chance we get Stamkos for giving Hollweg) or sent to Hartford/released


Not resigned
Straka
Shanny
Mara
Malik
Avery

The Red Wings have 7 Swedes as starters. We would not be icing "chicken swedes" either.
Just a thought
But it will never happen - but hence the name of the thread.


Last edited by BBKers: 05-24-2008 at 08:56 AM.
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Old
05-24-2008, 09:33 AM
  #63
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Seriously though, I'm all for Sundin at the right price and to me 7 million is overpayment (as you also agreed) and will cause cap issues. Even at a one year deal we'll probably be handcuffed at the trade deadline again. I think we're better off getting a longer term solution for now. Our team is still a contender and could do damage but I'd rather secure the future while still having success than stock up for one year and then be screwed for the next few when we truly will have to rebuild.

I don't think signing these random names thrown around is a good idea just on a whim, yet even if we did we would still be a playoff team in my opinion. It's still important to secure our long term future then try to pick up old veterans (Sundin) that may not prosper in a new environment (Lindros, Holik, Kovalev, Messier the second time) but maybe will give us a shot now. I'm done with that theory; we tried it for a while and everyone was miserable.


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Old
05-24-2008, 09:36 AM
  #64
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People are really delusional right now.....is it october yet?

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Old
05-24-2008, 10:15 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Sundin is better than both of those hacks combined.

Get real.
Thats not the issue. Of course Sundin was/is a better player.

The issue is spending 7 mil on ONE guy, when 7 mil could be spent on possibly 3.

Two guys who can score at least 20 goals means a 20 goal scorer on two separate lines.

One 30 goal scorer, who happens to be a center, which is not a position of need, still leaves the wings void of a legit scorer.

Gomez needs one. So does Drury.

If Sundin wanted to sign here for, lets say... 3.5 mil or maybe 4. OK. Because then we could AT LEAST sign a winger as well.

No matter how mediocre you feel some of these wingers are, the simple fact is we need a couple of wingers. OR, we face the possibility of having a very rough season.

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Old
05-24-2008, 10:34 AM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vesatoskala View Post
I was reading Andy Strickland's blog from May 9th. The bottom has an interesting blurb:



What do you think?
Unless Sundin magically loses 7 years off his age and becomes the scoring winger to play with Scott Gomez, I don't see it.

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05-24-2008, 10:55 AM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
And tell me. Who's better this offseason?
That's a pretty simplistic way of looking at it. Possibly there is no one better. But why is that a reason for throwing big money at a guy who plays a position that this team is deepest in? We can all drool at the prospect of Sundin playing with Jagr but 10 months ago we were all going crazy trying to decide which one of Gomez or Drury was going to play with him.

Speaking of Drury, what do you do with him? Is he know the fourth line center? Second line wing? And what of Brandon Dubinsky? Third line center?

Personally, if we are going to sign a center (presumably with the thought that Drury is the wing that Gomez is going to play with) I would rather go with Bobby Holik:

1) He'll come cheaper.

2) Can match up against the Crosbys, Malkins, Spezzas, Richards, Carters, Backstroms, Savards, Lecavalies and Staals in the East.

3) Adds much needed grit up front.

4) Is yet another top face-off guy for this team.

This keeps Jagr and Dubinsky together (assume JJ comes back) as Jagr seemingly can only play with a handful of centers in this league. And it allows the Rangers to add more players. Maybe Jarkko Ruutu:

Avery-Dubinsky-Jagr
Drury-Gomez-Dawes
Ruutu-Holik-Callahan
Sjostrom-Betts-Korpikoski

Sure those Holik and Ruutu more than likely won't match what Sundin would production-wise, but they do fill a need better. And you would also hope/expect that they will get more out of Callahan, Dubinksy and Dawes next season.

Of course this is all predicated on Jagr coming back. Which I'm not sure I''m for. And if he doesn't return, I see less reason for Sundin.

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Old
05-24-2008, 11:25 AM
  #68
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This is nothing but off season board fodder.

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Old
05-24-2008, 11:49 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ebn View Post
I think we should sign Sundin and Jagr for two years. They can still play.

Look at these forward lines.

Avery Sundin Jagr
Dawes Gomez Drury
Korpikoski Dubinski Callahan

These three lines are solid.
We can have them for two years.
Go for it.


We finally get a center for Jagr.
We get the scoring we need.


The only other forward to get besides Sundin is Rolston and lets face it Sundin is the best player available and exactly what we need.
I'm not trying to be contradicting.

But,

Those lines are not solid.

Gomez still doesn't have a legit scoring winger.

And Callahan, as much as we all love him, is not going to magically turn into the offensive force we hope.

The second thing is
Quote:
We finally get a center for Jagr.
We get the scoring we need.
We are NOT catering to Jagr's needs anymore. This is NOT the New York Jagrs. This is the New York RANGERS. And we do not need to sign ANOTHER center, when we already spent 14 mil on TWO last summer. And apparently NEITHER of them satisfied his playing needs.

We CAN NOT afford to keep catering to this guy.

14 mil wrapped up into Gomez and Drury. THEY are the ones you go out and get complimenting players for.

Gomez needs a LEGIT scoring winger.

Drury needs a LEGIT scoring winger.

The defense needs a LEGIT shut down, mean defenseman.

The Power Play needs a LEGIT quarterback.

THESE are the issues that need to be addressed. NOT Jagr having yet ANOTHER 7+ million center that may or may not satisfy him.

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05-24-2008, 11:51 AM
  #70
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I would rather ice a team that looks like this:

Huselius (2.5) - Dubinsky (.635) - Jagr (4) ------------------- 7.135
Dawes (.550) - Gomez (7.358) - Rolston (3) ----------------- 10.908
Korpikoski (1.018) - Drury (7.050) - Afinogenov (3.5) --------- 11.568
Orr (.538) - Betts (.615) - Sjostrom (.800) ------------------- 1.953

Staal (.827) - Orpik (3) -------------------------------------- 3.827
Liles (3) - Girardi (1.550) ------------------------------------ 4.550
Tyutin (2.850) - Mara (2) ------------------------------------ 4.850

Lundqvist (6.875)
Valiquette (.618) --------------------------------------------- 7.493

TOTAL = 52.284

Callahan, Backman, Prucha, 5th to BUF for Afinogenov


...something like that.

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Old
05-24-2008, 12:29 PM
  #71
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Great post Coldshot!

Like, anything shortterm really isn't much of a gamble -- while a bad longterm signing could be extremely costly. Imagine if you sign someone to a 6 year contract -- and finds out after 1 year that it was a bad idea. Wed have to wait to 2014 before we could move past a misstake like that.

Id gamble on Sundin. Mats can play RW too, I think he would be a great fit on Gomez right side. Sundin played mostly RW untill he was like 22 years old or something. Lets say we brought in Sundin we would look really good upfront and still have plenty of room to bring in some kids. Like;
Avery-Dubinsky-Jagr
Dawes-Gomez-Sundin
Korpi-Drury-Callahan
Sjö-Betts-Orr

Sundin can also play the point on the PP.

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Old
05-24-2008, 01:08 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PukkuMikku View Post
I would rather ice a team that looks like this:

Huselius (2.5) - Dubinsky (.635) - Jagr (4) ------------------- 7.135
Dawes (.550) - Gomez (7.358) - Rolston (3) ----------------- 10.908
Korpikoski (1.018) - Drury (7.050) - Afinogenov (3.5) --------- 11.568
Orr (.538) - Betts (.615) - Sjostrom (.800) ------------------- 1.953

Staal (.827) - Orpik (3) -------------------------------------- 3.827
Liles (3) - Girardi (1.550) ------------------------------------ 4.550
Tyutin (2.850) - Mara (2) ------------------------------------ 4.850

Lundqvist (6.875)
Valiquette (.618) --------------------------------------------- 7.493

TOTAL = 52.284

Callahan, Backman, Prucha, 5th to BUF for Afinogenov


...something like that.



That trade is your typical "our crap for your stud" banter thrown around on these boards all the time. That trade will never happen. Second, your salaries are way off. Huselius at 2.5? Rolston at 3? Orpik at 3? Giving those FA's their realistic salaries will put us over the cap.

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05-24-2008, 02:10 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaqup View Post


That trade is your typical "our crap for your stud" banter thrown around on these boards all the time. That trade will never happen. Second, your salaries are way off. Huselius at 2.5? Rolston at 3? Orpik at 3? Giving those FA's their realistic salaries will put us over the cap.
Afinogenov is no where near "stud".

He is making 3.5 and is a UFA at the end of the season... you think he WON'T be traded between now and trade deadline?

Also, there was talk of him being moved BEFORE the draft.

But, no one is going to overpay for him.


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Old
05-24-2008, 11:24 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
WHY though?

If it's 1 year deals for both, why not?

****, I mean, why NOT go for the Cup as long as we aren't going to go over the cap or anything?

We might as well sign 'em both for a year and see what happens. If we fall on our faces, who the **** cares? We get a solid draft pick and can move 'em both at the deadline for a plethora of youth and picks.

I'm drunk now, but excuse me if I come off as a dick here. Some of you guys are just ridiculous about signing vets sometimes.

We might as well get them both if we can for a decent price. Do you want Hossa for 15 years at 9M? OR would you rather sign rejects like Huselius and Ryder to try and get some scoring? Those guys won't do jack (outside of Hossa).

Why not sign these guys and go for it? No reason not to, if you ask me.

Sundin would be a welcome addition to the club. Leadership, consistency, etc etc. And he wants to ****ing win a Cup. THAT'S the drive we need. The guy wants to win. He's never won one.

If we can get them for a decent price, do it. Go for the damn Cup.

I'd rather do that then settle for being out of the playoffs or with a bunch of ****** reject signings for a "decent price".

I like you as a poster a lot Shadow. But seriously. Rangers fans are way, way too passive at times about signings.

I mean, I've seen some really ridiculous names tossed around here. I, myself, have done it as well.

But this is really a great idea if he could come at a cost of less than 7M. And with Jagr back or another scorer. ****, sign Sundin and Hossa if you want. I don't care. We need a vet like Sundin to go for the Cup. I was ADAMANT about trading for him last season and I am still now about signing him this offseason. He'd be an incredible addition to our team.
I'm tired of the Rangers M.O. While there have been positive steps youth-wise, the name on the back of the jersey has been and always will be this organization's chief concern. A concern that has, to date, brought them 4 Cups and whole lot of missed playoffs. Signing Sundin would be just one more chapter in a very long and badly penned book, and I just don't know if I can take another page of it.

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05-25-2008, 12:14 AM
  #75
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If Sather signs Mats Sundin he only proves this organization is going back to 1997-2004.

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