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Tor - Stl

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Old
05-30-2008, 01:31 PM
  #1
TribalPhoenix
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Tor - Stl

This was discussed on the Leafs board, and is similar to a proposal that has already been thrown out there but adds on a bit more - credit to Mess for coming up with it. I accidentally posted a very similar one for Columbus that kind of works as well.

TO STL:

Pavel Kubina
TOR 1st Rounder (7th Overall)

TO TOR :

STL 1st Rounder (4th Overall)
STL 2nd Rounder (34th Overall)


WHY FOR ST LOUIS:

You get a defenceman who started to find his groove, and given the market is decently priced at 5M$ per season who can play top 2 minutes. He's less than you wanted for him when he was a free agent, and can have him at 500K$ less. You only drop 3 spots in the draft, allowing you to still grab a blue chip prospect, though lose your 2nd - this functionally assesses Kubina's value as a 3 spot draft jump and a 2nd Round pick, which most would consider affordable. You're a team who is on the cusp of making the playoffs, and Kubina could push you over the edge, especially when you're looking to give guys like Erik Johnson the time to grow, and Jay McKee is showing his style is starting to catch up with him.

WHY FOR TORONTO :

You dump 5M$ in salary per season to pursue other lower-tier free agents during the rebuild, and move into a position to draft one of the top-end prospects in a draft that has some serious top 7 talent (with the exception of Stamkos, in a league of his own) at either defence or forward. This guarantees that Stralman and Colaiacovo (if healthy) get top 4 minutes to continue developing. You also gain an additional 2nd round pick, which functionally serves as a low 1st rounder, which will expedite the rebuild by having a good selection in a fairly deep draft. Overall, you're a team that needs to start from scratch, and this trade only helps accomplish that sooner.


Thoughts?


Last edited by TribalPhoenix: 05-30-2008 at 01:38 PM.
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Old
05-30-2008, 01:37 PM
  #2
milieu bluez
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For one its Atl's 2nd round pick at #34.

Stl wouldn't trade that pick (#34) for Kubina. Let alone drop our 1st round pick to 7 as well.

However I think trading 1st round picks in this draft is a real possibility, but the trade would not include Kubina. Stl would hold the power in this trade and a salary dump player isn't going to cut it.

Stl isn't looking to add salary at this point (per JD). Managment keeps stressing stay the course rebuild the right way. This would be the wrong way

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Old
05-30-2008, 01:42 PM
  #3
T_Cage
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drop the 2nd, and i think this might work....Kubina is a tad overpriced, but still a good D-man, STL will still get a grat prospect at 7 so they are giving up very little in effect for him

whereas for T.O it gives them cap room that's more of a team need right now than Kubina, and a slightly better prospect (hopefully Schenn ).

I would offer just Kubina + 7th for the 4th and be satisfied if we got that

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Old
05-30-2008, 01:45 PM
  #4
It Kills Me
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Quote:
Originally Posted by milieu bluez View Post
For one its Atl's 2nd round pick at #34.

Stl wouldn't trade that pick (#34) for Kubina. Let alone drop our 1st round pick to 7 as well.

However I think trading 1st round picks in this draft is a real possibility, but the trade would not include Kubina. Stl would hold the power in this trade and a salary dump player isn't going to cut it.

Stl isn't looking to add salary at this point (per JD). Managment keeps stressing stay the course rebuild the right way. This would be the wrong way
That's based on your assessment that Kubina is a salary dump. He's not.

The only reason the Leaf fans are keen on trading Kubina is because he's the only defender with an NTC we can move.

Personally, I'd rather trade Kubina to Columbus for Colorado's first.

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Old
05-30-2008, 01:46 PM
  #5
fcpremix88
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The Blues don't have the cap-space for this trade.

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Old
05-31-2008, 02:54 AM
  #6
dao256
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no way id do it , from a Blues prespective. We have enough NHL defensemen, dont need a guy like Kubina, we will be wanting to work in our young guys more.

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Old
05-31-2008, 08:14 AM
  #7
milieu bluez
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chocolate Skittles View Post
That's based on your assessment that Kubina is a salary dump. He's not.

The only reason the Leaf fans are keen on trading Kubina is because he's the only defender with an NTC we can move.

Personally, I'd rather trade Kubina to Columbus for Colorado's first.
Well its not only based on the fact that Kubina is a "bit" of a salary dump. The guy doesn't address the need for such a high payment. Realy at this point the two teams being positioned at the draft, and history at the draft make for good trading partners. However with Stl still in rebuild mode and Toronto still in......ah....Toronto mode its going to be difficult.

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Old
05-31-2008, 08:29 AM
  #8
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Toronto Accepts

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Old
05-31-2008, 11:09 AM
  #9
jmwc95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffYear92 View Post
Toronto Accepts
I bet you do.

This is a bad deal for the Blues. The Blues are rebuilding. Why would they trade their #4 pick (who will probably be a MUCH better defenseman than Kubina) AND #34 who may be a better player than Kubina to move down and miss out on the "sure fire" prospects.

Also, the Blues have WAY too many dollars already committed to defensemen:
Brewer $4.250MM
McKee $4.000MM
Jackman $3.625MM
Erik Johnson's contract could be up to $3.700MM with incentives.

We're already looking to dump McKee. There would be no way we could take on that salary without getting rid of McKee first.

Again, we are rebuilding. We don't want to give up our picks in the first two rounds unless it is for top tier talent that is in their early 20's.

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Old
05-31-2008, 12:02 PM
  #10
Nizdizzle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmwc95 View Post
I bet you do.

This is a bad deal for the Blues. The Blues are rebuilding. Why would they trade their #4 pick (who will probably be a MUCH better defenseman than Kubina) AND #34 who may be a better player than Kubina to move down and miss out on the "sure fire" prospects.

Also, the Blues have WAY too many dollars already committed to defensemen:
Brewer $4.250MM
McKee $4.000MM
Jackman $3.625MM
Erik Johnson's contract could be up to $3.700MM with incentives.

We're already looking to dump McKee. There would be no way we could take on that salary without getting rid of McKee first.

Again, we are rebuilding. We don't want to give up our picks in the first two rounds unless it is for top tier talent that is in their early 20's.
I agree that St. Louis doesn't do this, but the part I bolded is just a plain silly comment. Any pick MIGHT be better than Kubina, chances that the #34 in this draft will be? Pretty slim.

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Old
05-31-2008, 01:13 PM
  #11
dubey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiodos View Post
The Blues don't have the cap-space for this trade.
what?

I would do the first trade but none of the modified ones.

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Old
05-31-2008, 01:20 PM
  #12
Abyss
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The Blues would have to be insane to do this trade. 4th overall lands them a potential franchise D (or a guy like Filatov/Wilson/Boedker?) for the next 10 years, why trade it for Kubina?

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Old
05-31-2008, 11:54 PM
  #13
CCBC
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No thanks.

I want nothing to do with Kubina's bloated contract, much less trade down.

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