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Habs loooking to move up in Draft

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Old
06-18-2008, 06:32 AM
  #76
Ishmael
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Trading Plekanec to move up the in the draft with the thought of replacing him with Sundin doesn't make any sense.

To me, the whole idea of getting Sundin would be to have 3 excellent offensive lines, and take a bit of the load off Koivu/provide good depth in case of injuries. That, combined with some other more minor moves and the continued development of our great young players, should make the Canadiens a top-tier team with a really good chance of taking a run this year.

Montreal could use a couple of blue-chip top-tier prospects (who couldn't?), but that's not the right way of going about it.

Plekanec (although I'm disappointed in his playoff showing this year) is someone I'd like to see in Montreal for a long time.

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06-18-2008, 06:35 AM
  #77
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The Habs have several defensive prospects who are very promising. I wonder if dealing one of them, say Weber, along with the #25 pick, moves the team up enough to make things interesting. Depending on if, and how much, a guy like Filatov drops.

I would be weary of dealing a guy like Pleks or Higgins though. Not just a question of talent, but one of team chemistry. If you deal a guy like that, you want someone coming back who can contribute right away.

Edit: there must be a team or two out there who are desperate for defensive prospects, even if this is a strong draft for D. Atlanta maybe?


Last edited by VirginiaMtlExpat: 06-18-2008 at 06:40 AM.
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06-18-2008, 07:20 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by GermanyMontrealExpat View Post
The Habs have several defensive prospects who are very promising. I wonder if dealing one of them, say Weber, along with the #25 pick, moves the team up enough to make things interesting. Depending on if, and how much, a guy like Filatov drops.

I would be weary of dealing a guy like Pleks or Higgins though. Not just a question of talent, but one of team chemistry. If you deal a guy like that, you want someone coming back who can contribute right away.

Edit: there must be a team or two out there who are desperate for defensive prospects, even if this is a strong draft for D. Atlanta maybe?
although i would love for a team to take a prospect most teams are expecting NHL ready players and columbus is making plenty of moves this summer from the looks of things so they will have lots of offers to shop that pick

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06-18-2008, 07:24 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
The whole Sundin option in your message is a red herring. If the Habs spend millions to acquire a 70 point guy, it's not to give another 70 point guy away for a draft pick.

Think about the philosophy each move implies.

Getting Sundin = going for the cup NOW.

Trading Plekanec for a pick = tanking and rebuilding.

The two philosophies are incompatible.
But those two philosophies are canceling themselves.

You lose a really good player i Plekanec and replace him right away by an even better center in Sundin. On the top of that, you get a young player who'll be better than Plekanec ever will and who's going to be ready for the big show within no time.

My idea isn't for the sake of getting younger players like it's often the case on HF. It's all about getting a star forward that we want and need since so many years. We are having trouble getting one via free agency and via trades, so maybe we should try to get one on draft day.

Anyways, if we still have Plekanec for the next 5-6 years, I'll be happy!

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06-18-2008, 08:47 AM
  #80
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For Columbus's 6th overall, it would cost you your first pick with a 3rd rounder, with Gorges and Grabovski or two prospects (Subban + White). Let's remember, we're not trading for a top 3 pick here. Then they should pick Filatov, in second round, that kid Danick Paquette from Lewiston.

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06-18-2008, 09:38 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Blades 0f Steel View Post
Way to miss my point. I'd gladly trade our future 3rd line 'character' center for the chance of drafting someone that could emerge as a true superstar.
Everyone just about **** their pants at the thought of getting Kovalchuk, another 18 year old that had never played any games on North American ice. Sure, Filatov won't ever be as prolific a scorer as Kovalchuk, but he's up there in terms of potential.

And he's not some hit-or-miss Brendl, or a player like Zherdev that doesn't utilize his potential, he's a determined and charismatic guy like everyone's favourite Canadian boy Stamkos. And Timmins loves him.

His English is also as good as Russians that have been in the league 5 years.
You know Chipchura is a player who shuts down players like Filatov. Don't diminish his role on the team. And we know Chipchura will be that great 3rd line centre, you can see it. Filatov has not played one game and to proclaim he won't bust is ludicrous. You're entitled to your opinion but you make him seem like he's the real #1 choice in this draft.

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06-18-2008, 09:48 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
You know Chipchura is a player who shuts down players like Filatov. Don't diminish his role on the team. And we know Chipchura will be that great 3rd line centre, you can see it. Filatov has not played one game and to proclaim he won't bust is ludicrous. You're entitled to your opinion but you make him seem like he's the real #1 choice in this draft.
Of course Chipchura will be a great 3rd liner, that's what would make him a valuable asset.

I do feel Filatov is the best forward.

Don't be difficult, Sean.

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06-18-2008, 10:09 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Blades 0f Steel View Post
Of course Chipchura will be a great 3rd liner, that's what would make him a valuable asset.

I do feel Filatov is the best forward.

Don't be difficult, Sean.
It's my job to be difficult

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06-18-2008, 10:11 AM
  #84
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Montreal management will in no means be involved in moving up in the draft.

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06-18-2008, 10:26 AM
  #85
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Chipchura ain't going anywhere mark my words. He's a good character player with good size, he's a good glue guy they just won't get rid of.

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06-18-2008, 10:28 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by ed ible View Post
Montreal management will in no means be involved in moving up in the draft.
why wouldn't they? It would be irresponsable of them not to try and do it.

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06-18-2008, 10:40 AM
  #87
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Time for the Habs to make an impact at the draft...we've been reality quiet for too long

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06-18-2008, 10:58 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by GNick42 View Post
Time for the Habs to make an impact at the draft...we've been reality quiet for too long

Quietly building a strong team.

I'd rather be quieter and smart than loud and dumb...the draft is not about the media it's about making smart picks and adding valuable assets...drafting to fill needs can be a problem also.

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06-18-2008, 11:30 AM
  #89
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i may have missed someone else posting this but the whole idea of Trading Plekanec for this Filatov Idea to "POSSIBLY" replace him with Sundin not only is foolish based on the fact we have no real way of Knowing we'll get Sundin but Statistically it's insane.

last year (granted it was on the leafs who besides him have not very much in the way op support for him) Sundin had 32 goals 46 assists for 78 points which is consistently around the same spot for the last 10 years including the pre lockout teams that were going to the conference finals. Plekanec on the other hand had 69 points only 9 shy of sundins total (3 goals and 6 assists less technically)

IS it outside of the realm of possibilities that given the fact Plekanec has increased his point totals over the past 2 seasons signifigantly along with the fact alot of the wingers on this club are on what we would think the upward trends of their careers(kostiy bros, lats, higgins,) Plekanec could actually outproduce Sundin Next Season ??

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06-18-2008, 11:44 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by vipergtsr404 View Post
i may have missed someone else posting this but the whole idea of Trading Plekanec for this Filatov Idea to "POSSIBLY" replace him with Sundin not only is foolish based on the fact we have no real way of Knowing we'll get Sundin but Statistically it's insane.

last year (granted it was on the leafs who besides him have not very much in the way op support for him) Sundin had 32 goals 46 assists for 78 points which is consistently around the same spot for the last 10 years including the pre lockout teams that were going to the conference finals. Plekanec on the other hand had 69 points only 9 shy of sundins total (3 goals and 6 assists less technically)

IS it outside of the realm of possibilities that given the fact Plekanec has increased his point totals over the past 2 seasons signifigantly along with the fact alot of the wingers on this club are on what we would think the upward trends of their careers(kostiy bros, lats, higgins,) Plekanec could actually outproduce Sundin Next Season ??
Don't suggest that, according to the many hab 'fans' on here we have crappy forwards, so crappy that they should be traded for the 'possible' replacements.

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06-18-2008, 11:53 AM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vipergtsr404 View Post
i may have missed someone else posting this but the whole idea of Trading Plekanec for this Filatov Idea to "POSSIBLY" replace him with Sundin not only is foolish based on the fact we have no real way of Knowing we'll get Sundin but Statistically it's insane.

last year (granted it was on the leafs who besides him have not very much in the way op support for him) Sundin had 32 goals 46 assists for 78 points which is consistently around the same spot for the last 10 years including the pre lockout teams that were going to the conference finals. Plekanec on the other hand had 69 points only 9 shy of sundins total (3 goals and 6 assists less technically)

IS it outside of the realm of possibilities that given the fact Plekanec has increased his point totals over the past 2 seasons signifigantly along with the fact alot of the wingers on this club are on what we would think the upward trends of their careers(kostiy bros, lats, higgins,) Plekanec could actually outproduce Sundin Next Season ??
All i did is scoff at the idea that trading Pleks for the 6th was a dumb idea.

Although adding Sundin adds intangibles that Pleks does not posess.

Size down the middle.

Did you not notice how he was utterly shut down in the PO?

Sundin will drive to the net, he's big and strong and makes other players around him better.

To think that Sundin wouldnt offer more then Pleks (in the immediate future) is dumb.

The idea is to be competitive for a long time, not just one year. An signing Sunding for 2 years along with drafting say, Filatov (as surefire an NHLer as there is) who will be awesome within the next 3 years....well you know...

anyways, it's pointless banter because it wont happen

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06-18-2008, 11:54 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Dominant Hegemony View Post
wait....you wouldnt trade Pleks to get the 6th pick???

i love Pleky, but the 6th pick in a very strong top 10 draft is nothing to scoff at...
If you knew for sure the guy would be a number 1 centreman who could average a PPG thats a top 6 pick...... Why trade Pleks for a guy you hope can be as good as Pleks in 3-4 years down the road.... Thats just dumb when you have a team that is a Cup Contender


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Originally Posted by Uwey View Post
Rolston is believed to a deal in place with the Wild already!!!
To Play Devil's Advocate on this one:
If he did, why is it not signed.... The wild don't need to wait till July 1st to sign their own guys.

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Originally Posted by bwoar View Post
What's this? Surely poeple don't seriously think Gainey would trade a roster player to move up in the draft?? Unless it was for Stamkos?

Otherwise you guys are smokin' better stuff than I am; pass it over.

And while you're at it, Filatov WHO? The guy hasn't played a game in the NHL and with these Russkies you dunno what you're gonna get. Maybe a big fat nothing, if a RSL club ponies up.

No way, NONE, no way does BG throw away a guy like Higgins or Plekanec to move up in a frickin DRAFT. Just incredible what I read here sometimes.
Exactly

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06-18-2008, 12:00 PM
  #93
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I like already said, we have a ton of quality prospect but we don't have a future impact player (besides Price). I think we need to find a way to get an elite prospect to give our young core of players that extra notch to become a cup contenter for years.

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06-18-2008, 12:02 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by ed ible View Post
Montreal management will in no means be involved in moving up in the draft.
They tried to move up to 16th to pick Esposito last year and failed to make a deal with the Wild so i don't see why it's so inconceivable that they would try it again this year to get ???. In restrospective i am glad that it failed though since i'm now more high on Pacioretty than i am on Esposito.

Expect the unexpected !!

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06-18-2008, 12:13 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Black Label View Post
They tried to move up to 16th to pick Esposito last year and failed to make a deal with the Wild so i don't see why it's so inconceivable that they would try it again this year to get ???. In restrospective i am glad that it failed though since i'm now more high on Pacioretty than i am on Esposito.

Expect the unexpected !!
Where is your info from....

I remember them trying to move up with Columbus for McDonagh last year, but couldn't get the deal done.... I also remember Timmins saying they had Max Pac ranked higher than Espo..... I really don't think they ever liked Espo... I think Perron was higher ranked on Montreal's board.

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06-18-2008, 12:16 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by pam19 View Post
.

BTW, what is your ratio for 2008 and 2009 compared to 2002?
If you prefer, what choice in 2008 could be as good as a 10th choice (not the actual player) of 2008.
If you prefer you can use 2003 as a base.
Great analysis, NHL Gm must be thinking along these lines when considering trades.

So far no one answered. Which is not surprising because this is too hard a question for anyone on this forum. You need a lot of knowledge about a player to assess his real value. Unfortunately watching highlights on the net or reading about said prospect is not considered ''knowledge'' to me.

Anyways, this type of analysis is really what good GM do when they do trades

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06-18-2008, 12:20 PM
  #97
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maybe habs can work out something with canucks and part with a couple d prospects...i think the canucks are lacking d prospects??? that way they can still draft a promising center say...cody hodgson, colin wilson or KYLE BEACH

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06-18-2008, 12:30 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Where is your info from....

I remember them trying to move up with Columbus for McDonagh last year, but couldn't get the deal done.... I also remember Timmins saying they had Max Pac ranked higher than Espo..... I really don't think they ever liked Espo... I think Perron was higher ranked on Montreal's board.
Didn't Bob said that they tried to move up to get Esposito with the 2nd pick when a journalist asked him why they didn't pick him up at 12 ?

I am almost certain that i have heard him say that unless i misunderstood him. Then Pedneault (or i think it was him) said that they tried to make a deal with the Wild to get the 16th overall but it failed.

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06-18-2008, 12:34 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Black Label View Post
Didn't Bob said that they tried to move up to get Esposito with the 2nd pick when a journalist asked him why they didn't pick him up at 12 ?

I am almost certain that i have heard him say that unless i misunderstood him. Then Pedneault (or i think it was him) said that they tried to make a deal with the Wild but it failed.
they said they tried to deal to grab a player from the Q. They never talked about Espo. It was most likely for Perron with another first round pick after our 22nd overall.

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06-18-2008, 12:43 PM
  #100
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they said they tried to deal to grab a player from the Q. They never talked about Espo. It was most likely for Perron with another first round pick after our 22nd overall.
That's possible but i swear that Bob said that after a journalist asked him a question about Esposito.

That said i'm not getting any younger so my memory may not function like it used to and i'm only 28

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