HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Update: RDS - Avery and Straka will not be Re-signed (Post #190)

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-20-2008, 01:19 PM
  #101
Son of Steinbrenner
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 9,722
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Absolutely.



Now that I'm not ready to say.
Then what's the plan?

To me letting all these guys go AND replacing the needs we had last year...I just don't see us making the playoffs...with chemistry and the guys not working out like we think..i just don't see it..i hope i'm wrong...

Son of Steinbrenner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:19 PM
  #102
DontStepanMe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Queens, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 5,383
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
I don't think his age really matters if he is signed to a one year incentive laden contract....

I'm not sitting here saying lets sign Jagr to a two or three year contract but one more season buys us time to aquire or develop his replacement...It also gives the team another shot at building a contender for next year (with a cap everything is year to year anyway)

I just think it makes no sense not to resign The Captain....Without Jagr the Rangers don't make the playoffs the past three years and probably don't next season...
agree on all counts.

DontStepanMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:23 PM
  #103
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 30,399
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
Then what's the plan?

To me letting all these guys go AND replacing the needs we had last year...I just don't see us making the playoffs...with chemistry and the guys not working out like we think..i just don't see it..i hope i'm wrong...
I honestly don't have an answer to that.

I guess I would say that the last two seasons the Rangers have not made it past the second round of the playoffs next season. Does bringing back Jagr mean that they will next season?

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:29 PM
  #104
Son of Steinbrenner
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 9,722
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I honestly don't have an answer to that.

I guess I would say that the last two seasons the Rangers have not made it past the second round of the playoffs next season. Does bringing back Jagr mean that they will next season?
I don't think i'd be going out on a limb by saying they would IF they improved the power play and defense as a whole..

To me and maybe it's just me the Rangers are creating more holes then they can fill...

Son of Steinbrenner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:34 PM
  #105
bathgate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 881
vCash: 500
Jagr can't play at an elite level for a full schedule. He is now a complementary player on a good team, no longer the man. It's time to move on. Last year proved this team must still grow to become a serious threat. Jagr will not be part of the equation.Right or wrong, the team needs to build around Drury and Gomez on offense, Staal, Tyutin and Girardi on defense . We do have the franchise goalie

bathgate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:42 PM
  #106
KreiMeARiver*
Have Confidence
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UES
Posts: 6,621
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DruMez View Post
I hope to god he has a plan, that doesn't include just saving as much cap space as possible to sign the two biggest free agents.. again.

by the way, link: http://www.nypost.com/seven/06202008...co__116325.htm
Pens dealing Malkin??

I say good for Sather, if he can somehow acquire both Malkin and Campbell.....I'd be a happy guy!!

Sather is no dummie...with the exception of Jagr (who is expensive as hell) and Avery...the other guys SHOULD NEVER be signed...ie: Rozy, Straka, or Shanny. They would cost to much, and if Malkin and/or Cambell can be acquired....why not save the money for the big guns?

I could be wrong...but I think in the end...we are all going to be VERY VERY happy with the off season.

KreiMeARiver* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:46 PM
  #107
Melrose_Jr.
Registered User
 
Melrose_Jr.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Providence, RI
Country: United States
Posts: 10,692
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
I don't think i'd be going out on a limb by saying they would IF they improved the power play and defense as a whole..

To me and maybe it's just me the Rangers are creating more holes then they can fill...
The drop off in Jagr's performance this year IS a hole that needs to be filled. For someone that commands that much ice time, particularly on the PP, the offense just has to be there. If it was, he would have the renewal triggers and there wouldn't even be a discussion on the topic.

The saddest part is that he was STILL arguably the best Ranger winger. If that doesn't say that these forward lines need to be absolutely re-invented, I don't know what does. No status quo for me.

Melrose_Jr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:46 PM
  #108
94now
Registered User
 
94now's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Snow Belt, USA
Country: United Nations
Posts: 6,445
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
Then what's the plan?

To me letting all these guys go AND replacing the needs we had last year...I just don't see us making the playoffs...with chemistry and the guys not working out like we think..i just don't see it..i hope i'm wrong...
You're not wrong. Slats is bluffing, that's all. He has to. Brooks is his instrument in it.

94now is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 01:55 PM
  #109
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 21,469
vCash: 500
MJ...

not sure you need to say arguably...you may be able to say easily...

And it's not just his minutes and points (which may not have been that great but still led the team), he still made others around him better. And while he wasn't a machine, those around him weren't putting away many of their opportunities he afforded them either. If his linemates had finishing ability, perhaps he would've had 80+ points, which still is below Jagr par, but looks a bit better. Heck, the guy played about 15 games with Dubi as his centerman (really making his NHL debut) and Hossa on his left. Getting 70 points doesn't seem bad when you consider that.

Fletch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:08 PM
  #110
cjdv16
Registered User
 
cjdv16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: The Swamp
Country: United States
Posts: 6,185
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RinkOnEStreet View Post
I think letting Avery hit the market could go down at Sather's biggest mistake as GM yet. The guy is the sparkplug on this team, and without his energy I think this team regresses.
callahan is the next avery. (minus the mental issues)

cjdv16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:17 PM
  #111
KreiMeARiver*
Have Confidence
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UES
Posts: 6,621
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjdv16 View Post
callahan is the next avery. (minus the mental issues)
not even close

KreiMeARiver* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:17 PM
  #112
Melrose_Jr.
Registered User
 
Melrose_Jr.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Providence, RI
Country: United States
Posts: 10,692
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
...he still made others around him better.
Did he? The team was an offensive failure.

Meanwhile, the staggering investments made at center are buried down the roster because he can't play with them at all, which lines them up with your 2nd and 3rd tier offensive talent and reduces their effectiveness. Is this really the game strategy the team wants to continue with?

Melrose_Jr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:22 PM
  #113
Trxjw
Retired.
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Land of no calls..
Country: United States
Posts: 17,083
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
The drop off in Jagr's performance this year IS a hole that needs to be filled. For someone that commands that much ice time, particularly on the PP, the offense just has to be there. If it was, he would have the renewal triggers and there wouldn't even be a discussion on the topic.

The saddest part is that he was STILL arguably the best Ranger winger. If that doesn't say that these forward lines need to be absolutely re-invented, I don't know what does. No status quo for me.
Definitely agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
not sure you need to say arguably...you may be able to say easily...

And it's not just his minutes and points (which may not have been that great but still led the team), he still made others around him better. And while he wasn't a machine, those around him weren't putting away many of their opportunities he afforded them either. If his linemates had finishing ability, perhaps he would've had 80+ points, which still is below Jagr par, but looks a bit better. Heck, the guy played about 15 games with Dubi as his centerman (really making his NHL debut) and Hossa on his left. Getting 70 points doesn't seem bad when you consider that.
I agree with you here Fletch, however, this is one of the reasons I'm against bringing back Jagr. If we go out to find a winger who is compatible with Jagr, we have less options for Gomez's winger by default. Not to mention it's very clear that Jagr is picky about who he plays with. Our only real options internally are Straka and Prucha. Straka can't finish, and Prucha will never see top line minutes under Renney again. That leaves trade or the FA market. Via FA, we have Huselius, Demitra and Naslund. Two of which are old and on the decline, not to mention oft-injured. The other is "too-soft" by most people's standards and is looking for a big payday.

So say we sign Huselius. Now we've eaten into our cap and we haven't even dealt with the problems that will still be here after Jagr is gone. Thats why I'm against bringing back Jagr.

Trxjw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:38 PM
  #114
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 21,469
vCash: 500
Under the cap...

it's tough to bring back Jagr and a UFA winger to play with him and someone who can play with Gomez. Although there is Dawes among the top six currently, who plays right wing with Gomez if Jagr is on the top line? Top six depth at wing is not the Rangers' strong suit. Again, with the cap, it's difficult to even keep Jagr, Avery and add a winger and a defenseman. Reality is Jagr will not be cheap. I'm guessing there's someone out there willing to pay him $7MM per season, and perhaps sign him past this season.

Fletch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:41 PM
  #115
cityhockeyfever
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: New York City area
Country: United States
Posts: 612
vCash: 500
I'm really nervous about this approach Glen Sather is taking, but I have to commend him for being really bold in taking this risk. I agree with the statements that HockeyBasedNYC and Jeds2StepOpus made late on page 3 and early on page 4.

I just don't see Brendan Shanahan coming back as a player as injuries and a decline in production during the second half of last season may have determined his fate here. His leadership qualities and the intangibles that Shanny brought to New York is quite appreciated, especially by the fans.

With Jaromir Jagr's drop off in production, there's no way Slats should consider throwing not only a multiyear deal at him, but anything more than $5 million per season. If Jagr still wants more at age 36, let him go to Russia or the Czech Republic to finish his playing career. Do I want him back for another year or two? Absolutely. But at the right price.

(continued...)

cityhockeyfever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:42 PM
  #116
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 21,469
vCash: 500
MJ...

I do think he did - he also took pressure off the other lines by still attracting the attention of other teams. I don't know what others would've done had Jagr not been there. Dubi's a good player, but does he put those kind of numbers up while going against top competition if he doesn't have Jagr? I dunno. Avery seemed to play his best hockey with Jagr. So did Straka, who seemed even more pathetic without Jagr. Rozsival doesn't get those opportunities he had if Jagr's not opening up the ice either. I still think he gave the guys on the ice with him better chances by giving them more space out there. If they don't capitalize on is like they should've, not sure I fully blame Jagr. In the end, he did still lead the team in scoring and goals, while playing what the consensus feel was like crap, however pathetic that may sound which is why I worry about the rest of the team without him.

Fletch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 02:45 PM
  #117
cityhockeyfever
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: New York City area
Country: United States
Posts: 612
vCash: 500
If Slats has a big and important secret plan up his sleeve and he knows it will improve the team, so be it and I'll support it. But not bringing back Sean Avery and looking at a lesser player in Darcy Tucker is a bad move.

As far as free agents go, no high priced, long-term deals anymore. I don't care if the salary cap went up, the Rangers need to have wiggle room in case there's a better deal at next February's trade deadline and they have the means to trade for an upgrade.

Improve the defensive corps, see if Steve Valiquette is your best option as the backup goalie or get another that will just as much get the job done or more and plug in the promising kids as they began doing last season.

I don't trust Slats based on his crazy track record, but with his hockey people, they better not screw up tonight or during the free agent season.

And by the way, Freddy Idol (Sjostrom) better be in the Rangers' plans. I love what he brought to the team after the trade from Phoenix.

cityhockeyfever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 03:02 PM
  #118
Burlington Bomb 26
Louie Louie Oh oh
 
Burlington Bomb 26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Green Mountain State
Country: United States
Posts: 16,615
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjdv16 View Post
callahan is the next avery. (minus the mental issues)
he doesnt bring to the table what avery does, Avery tries to torture the Opponent while Callahan is still learning the Game. Callahan goes balls out to win the game. Avery goes balls out to annoy the opposition(marty)

Burlington Bomb 26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 03:03 PM
  #119
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 30,399
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by BubblegumGang184434 View Post
Callahan goes balls out to win the game. Avery goes balls out to annoy the opposition(marty)
I guess that sort of begs the question which is more important?

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 03:06 PM
  #120
Burlington Bomb 26
Louie Louie Oh oh
 
Burlington Bomb 26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Green Mountain State
Country: United States
Posts: 16,615
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I guess that sort of begs the question which is more important?
That is true, but what Avery brings to the game is different and it helps other players get energized, and having a will to win.

Burlington Bomb 26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 03:22 PM
  #121
Forechecker
Registered User
 
Forechecker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Country: Netherlands
Posts: 4,322
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Forechecker
We may all be over reacting a bit to a classic Uncle Larry article that provides no quotes, no solid facts, and is based on "unnamed sources" and other illusions. Many GMs rarely negotiate with UFAs until after the draft, which is what I think Slats' plan is all along.

IF this turns out to be true, I think I have to give Slats credit for not being held hostage by these players. This strategy may have some of them returned to us for less than what it may have cost us now. If not, I trust Schoenfeld, Clarke, Renney, and Slats to make decisions that are in the best interest of this team's short, medium, and long term future. The latter two of which I know wouldn't include any of these players with the exception of Rosie.

Forechecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 03:27 PM
  #122
TheSchwab
Registered User
 
TheSchwab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 2,080
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to TheSchwab
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forechecker View Post
We may all be over reacting a bit to a classic Uncle Larry article that provides no quotes, no solid facts, and is based on "unnamed sources" and other illusions. Many GMs rarely negotiate with UFAs until after the draft, which is what I think Slats' plan is all along.

IF this turns out to be true, I think I have to give Slats credit for not being held hostage by these players. This strategy may have some of them returned to us for less than what it may have cost us now. If not, I trust Schoenfeld, Clarke, Renney, and Slats to make decisions that are in the best interest of this team's short, medium, and long term future. The latter two of which I know wouldn't include any of these players with the exception of Rosie.
Exactly.

TheSchwab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 03:39 PM
  #123
Trxjw
Retired.
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Land of no calls..
Country: United States
Posts: 17,083
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
it's tough to bring back Jagr and a UFA winger to play with him and someone who can play with Gomez. Although there is Dawes among the top six currently, who plays right wing with Gomez if Jagr is on the top line? Top six depth at wing is not the Rangers' strong suit. Again, with the cap, it's difficult to even keep Jagr, Avery and add a winger and a defenseman. Reality is Jagr will not be cheap. I'm guessing there's someone out there willing to pay him $7MM per season, and perhaps sign him past this season.
Precisely. I think the wiser move is to bring in a guy for Gomez and let Jagr go. With Jagr signing for at the most (hopefully) 2 years, that leaves very few options available to sign to play on his line unless you want to sign an aging veteran or an unproven rookie. Or, you go with a player in the middle, deal with a longer contract and face the same situation 2 years from now when Jagr leaves/retires, whatever.

I do like a deal for Cheechoo to be honest. I was against it at first glance, but I think he could do very well with Gomez. His contract is really the sort of thing this team needs to fill some other holes in the lineup. However, I don't particularly like a first line of Dawes - Gomez - Cheechoo. I think we need some grit and/or size up front.

Trxjw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 04:13 PM
  #124
KreiMeARiver*
Have Confidence
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UES
Posts: 6,621
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I guess that sort of begs the question which is more important?
Callahan is a better person

Avery is a better, and more effective hockey player....period

KreiMeARiver* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-20-2008, 04:23 PM
  #125
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 30,399
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by hightide85 View Post
Avery is a better, and more effective hockey player....period
For the moment. Period.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:08 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.