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There are several teams that would go to 9M. All of them are average to bad clubs however. Maybe an average one would become a safe bet for the playoffs by adding him.
This arguement is flawed as well, your not taking into consideration the need of the team.
If I have Kovalchuk on my team I am not going to pay Hossa 9 mill to come play, I may pay chris drury 7 mill though,
Just as if I have chris drury and scott gomez, I'm not paying 7-8 mill for mats sundin, I will pay 7-8 mill for Hossa though.
The Pens are counting on other teams to see Hossa for what he is, a finishing piece. I'm sorry, but Hossa is not a guy to build a franchise around. I wouldn't be surprised if he only recieves offers from cup contenders??? what team wants to be atlanta and have 50+ goal scorers but go nowhere?
I'm just going to say I don't agree with this at all. There's not a team out there that wouldn't be better with Hossa at $9M, than Drury at $7.1.
rangers fan here, extending my condolences to pens fans for screwing them over on getting hossa to sign for ~7mill. Hos and his agent undoubtedly see gomer/drury getting 7 a year and say to themselves "psh, i can do better". as he should, he's a better player than either of them. And to the people saying "yea i'd take 7.5 instead of 9 mil to get my name on the cup" you're full of it. are you telling me your name on the cup is worth in excess of 10 million dollars over the course of the contract? forget my name on the cup, give me the 10 mil, I can get my name on it later anyways when im an assistant gm or scout or something.
I don't disagree about your overall premise, as Gomez, Drury, and Briere aren't worth overpaying for. However, I'd say that for players of Hossa's caliber, smart teams will be willing to overpay. Overpaying for a player isn't always the wrong move if you overpay for the right player. I think GMs will agree that Hossa's the right kind of player to overpay.
If you are 1 player away I would agree. Hossa is not a player that will carry a team or even a line by scoring 100 points. he had 66 points this year. Hossa needs talent around him for him to score 100 points, he isn't a franchise type player is all i am saying.
Most teams are not 1 player away. Boston is not. montreal could be. who else??? The Canucks?? Who else can afford him??? The jackets...please.
he had 100 points in 1 year!!! 92 in another then his next highest is 82.
He had 66 points this year...
I'm not saying i don't want him as a Pen. I would take him for 7 or 7.5 but I would decline his offer at 8 or 9.
He is a great 2 way player but i would put a value on him and stick to it in a cap world. If he doesn't sign with the Pens for 7-7.5, I hope he signs with an Eastern conference team for 9-10 million.
He had a bad year this year playing on one fo the worst teams in the league. Fact is , is that he can finish top 10 in scoring and still be a solid go to 2 way guy. Theres not very many guys in the league that have the combination of high end scoring and high end 2 way game. Hes one of handful of guys in the league who is pretty much worth what he gets.
He had a bad year this year playing on one fo the worst teams in the league. Fact is , is that he can finish top 10 in scoring and still be a solid go to 2 way guy. Theres not very many guys in the league that have the combination of high end scoring and high end 2 way game. Hes one of handful of guys in the league who is pretty much worth what he gets.
unless he has an 80, 82 or seventy something point year. I know people are looking to his 100 and 92 point years but if you look at his whole career those 2 seasons are not the norm.
All I am saying is if I am a GM I would assign a value to him and pay him what I think he is worth. I do not feel he is worth 8+ million of my cap space. 7 million, yes. 8 million is pushing it, 8.2 and above I would say no.
I'm just going to say I don't agree with this at all. There's not a team out there that wouldn't be better with Hossa at $9M, than Drury at $7.1.
Ok, we can agree to disagree. Understand I'm not saying Drury is as good a player as Hossa, I dont think that at all, I'm just saying if your not taking need into consideration when you offer contracts, your not doing due diligence.
Yeah Thomas really sucked last year say what you want about his style but with Boston playing the style they do Thomas is good enough to get the job done(I'm not even a Thomas fan)
And if Manny Fernandez can come back healthy I'll be very confident with the goaltending until Rask is ready in another year or two.
But I guess Flurey is poised for a string of 10 consectutive Vezina's now and no one comes close
1- How is the title fitting the information? I don't think Hossa's declined the offer, he is waiting for other offers.
2- How does it mean (like the general consensus seems to indicate) that Hossa is gone from Pittsburgh? I find it obvious that he was going to see what is out there before deciding, but that hardly means he doesn't consider Pittsburgh anymore.
If you are 1 player away I would agree. Hossa is not a player that will carry a team or even a line by scoring 100 points. he had 66 points this year. Hossa needs talent around him for him to score 100 points, he isn't a franchise type player is all i am saying.
Most teams are not 1 player away. Boston is not. montreal could be. who else??? The Canucks?? Who else can afford him??? The jackets...please.
Guess you didnt watch Hossa play before he got to Pittsburgh huh? Guess him carrying Atlanta to the playoffs last year doesnt count for anything. Or the fact he had very little talent around him while scoring 100 points. Or him leading the Senators in scoring as a 23 yr old.
No, but let me explain why this example is flawed...
100,000 a year instead of 70,000 could represent a change in lifestyle, nicer car, a pool, more vactions to better place...
but when your talking 7.5 million to stay instead of 8.5-9 somewhere else, there is no change in lifestyle based on salary... also, being a cup winner provides other opportunities as well if money is your motivation.
So if you ask me if I'd rather make 7.5 mill and win a cup, or 9 mill and never get my name on hockeys most prize piece of hardware, i take the 7.5 mill
Being a Jackets fan, Im in no position to question the success of the pens, but let me play devils advocate for a minute.
7.5 million vs 9 million or 9.5 million over 7 years is a sizeable chunk of change. 10.5 to 14 million.
And as good as Pittsburgh was this year, if Im Hossa, you cant guarantee me Im winning a cup if I stay. You can sell me on how I have a better chance than other teams I might be looking at signing with, but the question of is 10.5 million to 14 million worth your name on the cup. Maybe, if its guaranteed, but its not.
hey i hate Boston and even I can say their defensive system is VERY good. Least it was against the Habs. They were a much tougher competition than the Flyers.
Hossa and Savard would be scary if they can get a reliable winger to play with them.
1- How is the title fitting the information? I don't think Hossa's declined the offer, he is waiting for other offers.
2- How does it mean (like the general consensus seems to indicate) that Hossa is gone from Pittsburgh? I find it obvious that he was going to see what is out there before deciding, but that hardly means he doesn't consider Pittsburgh anymore.
He's definately considering pitt, but what has me wondering was Shero's comment about both Hossa and the Pens taking a risk going to July 1st. Does that mean Pitts offer can come down on july 1st if the money Hossa is looking for isnt there? If pitt's offer can comedown than it is safe to say the current offer was rejected in a sense..
Ok, we can agree to disagree. Understand I'm not saying Drury is as good a player as Hossa, I dont think that at all, I'm just saying if your not taking need into consideration when you offer contracts, your not doing due diligence.
When signing smaller money players I would agree. When talking about guys in the very top range, I'd much rather pay a bit more to get the bonafide elite player.
This is going to be a textbook reference for the future: it comes down to money. Who is going to pay the most? That's where the players are going to go. The city, fans, facilities, other players, coach, whatever don't matter as much as cash money.
1- How is the title fitting the information? I don't think Hossa's declined the offer, he is waiting for other offers.
2- How does it mean (like the general consensus seems to indicate) that Hossa is gone from Pittsburgh? I find it obvious that he was going to see what is out there before deciding, but that hardly means he doesn't consider Pittsburgh anymore.
Evilo
That is true, but for me its like my BlueJackets still thinking we can sign Malone.
If what was reported is true, we were willing to offer 25/5. He wants to "see what else he can get".
Maybe he still signs with us, but Im not holding my breath, we are his last choice.
Im not saying Pittsburgh is Hossa's last choice, but the fact he wants to look around just in case............. I dont like the odds if Im a Pitt fan
Being a Jackets fan, Im in no position to question the success of the pens, but let me play devils advocate for a minute.
7.5 million vs 9 million or 9.5 million over 7 years is a sizeable chunk of change. 10.5 to 14 million.
And as good as Pittsburgh was this year, if Im Hossa, you cant guarantee me Im winning a cup if I stay. You can sell me on how I have a better chance than other teams I might be looking at signing with, but the question of is 10.5 million to 14 million worth your name on the cup. Maybe, if its guaranteed, but its not.
Give me the 14 million.
completely a good point, but I just think the longer the contract the less the yearly difference... I'm not giving anyone 9.5 a yr for 7 yrs....maybe 5 at most...but i would consider 7 yrs at 7.5 as an offer, if ya catch what i mean
Being a Jackets fan, Im in no position to question the success of the pens, but let me play devils advocate for a minute.
7.5 million vs 9 million or 9.5 million over 7 years is a sizeable chunk of change. 10.5 to 14 million.
And as good as Pittsburgh was this year, if Im Hossa, you cant guarantee me Im winning a cup if I stay. You can sell me on how I have a better chance than other teams I might be looking at signing with, but the question of is 10.5 million to 14 million worth your name on the cup. Maybe, if its guaranteed, but its not.
Give me the 14 million.
Because Crosby is a winner and If Hossa wants to win he should take less and stay in Pittsburgh.
From what I've gathered the from past couple of years(listening to stupid Penguin fans) is this: any player in the NHL would love take a discount to play with Sidney Crosby.
unless he has an 80, 82 or seventy something point year. I know people are looking to his 100 and 92 point years but if you look at his whole career those 2 seasons are not the norm.
All I am saying is if I am a GM I would assign a value to him and pay him what I think he is worth. I do not feel he is worth 8+ million of my cap space. 7 million, yes. 8 million is pushing it, 8.2 and above I would say no.
How do we know those are the norm? Not all players come into the league scoring 100 pts a year from their rookie years on. Some guys develop their game into scoring 85, 90, 100 pts. Hossa has the talent to do has shown he can do it all while playing solid 2 way play. I thinkyour going to see most GMs feel he is worth 8+ million. Once again theres maybe a handful of guys in the league that combine the 2 way game with high end offensive talent.
People bash Boston's trap but I feel Julien was forced to play that style due to injuries and the personnel he had. Who's to say if they sign Hossa and with Bergeron back (improved younger players) that he doesn't come with a new look.
