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Panthers wanted Phaneuf for Jokinen

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Old
06-21-2008, 07:02 PM
  #26
CaptainCrunch67
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Originally Posted by nbducksfan19 View Post
i cant take sutter seriously because he talks like he has down syndrome.
We don't take this post seriously because it makes you sound like you have down's syndrome.

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06-21-2008, 07:06 PM
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I guess you are unaware that his son has down syndrome what a rude thing to say.

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06-21-2008, 07:11 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by HankTheTank View Post
lol what a bunch of bs.

So they wanted Phaneuf but settled for Ballard + Boynton from another team?

Sounds like typical GM speak "if the other GM wasn't an idiot we'd have made the trade"

When is Kevin Lowe going to come out and say they made a "much better offer"? Isn't that his standard answer after every trade that goes down where a player was linked to the Oilers?


I read on the Panthers board that the Oiler's assistant GM did in fact say they made a better offer!

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06-21-2008, 07:12 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
If you're Martin would you seriously be in any kind of hurry to help out the Flames (Keenan) or Vancouver (Luongo)?

I'm thinking no.
Why wouldn't Martin deal with Vancouver? He didn't have anything to do with that trade. As for Calgary, aren't Martin and Keenan "old friends" going way back? Anyhow, Keenan is NOT the GM in Calgary and wouldn't have any dealings with Martin.

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I would not be surprised at all if Martin wanted no part of dealing him there if he could get a similar package elsewhere.
I'm pretty sure either the Flames or Canucks could've put up a better package starting with including a 1st round pick instead of the 2nd round pick they got.


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06-21-2008, 07:19 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Barney Gumble View Post
Why wouldn't Martin deal with Vancouver? He didn't have anything to do with that trade. As for Calgary, aren't Martin and Keenan "old friends" going way back? Anyhow, Keenan is NOT the GM in Calgary and wouldn't have any dealings with Martin.


I'm pretty sure either the Flames or Canucks could've put up a better package starting with including a 1st round pick instead of the 2nd round pick they got.
I think there is still some bitter blood within the Florida front office/ownership about how the Luongo situation went down and how much heat they have taken over it.

I suspect if Jokinen was dealt to either Calgary or Vancouver and those teams went on to do well in the playoffs there likely would be a full on fan revolt in Florida.

I just don't think it would sit well in Florida if the Panthers were seen dealing Jokinen to pair up again with Keenan or Luongo for spare parts.

Dealing him to Phoenix was a much better PR play. It's not like Calgary or Vancouver realistically were going to offer a much better package than the Coyotes did.

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06-21-2008, 07:25 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
It's not like Calgary or Vancouver realistically were going to offer a much better package than the Coyotes did.
I do know that the Canucks wouldn't have required the Panthers take a salary dump in the trade (ie., Boynton). Panthers could've instead used that cap space money elsewhere.

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06-21-2008, 07:26 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Lone Rogue View Post
What people are forgetting is that there could have been other players involved. Florida might have been offering Jokinen/Boumeester for Phaneuf and Sutter whined that Martin had his eyes on Phaneuf.
While I don't think Sutter was "whining" I do agree that this the Jokinen package is a plausible scenario.

Maybe it wasn't Bouwmeester, but I could definitely see Florida pushing a Jokinen + picks or prospects package for Phaneuf and being stubborn on that.

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06-21-2008, 08:21 PM
  #33
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Perhaps all these "Florida called and wanted so-and-so" rumours are because they did. They searched around to try and get what they could for Olli and how high his price tag was. Isn't that how these kinds of things work? You start high and gauge where to go from there?

With Olli asking for a trade and his play since he ripped Zed's neck open, perhaps what he got was all he could get?

I'm not overly thrilled with it and would rather that he stayed, but I'm not overly disappointed at the return, either. Ballard's solid, and who cares if Boynton was on the waiver wire. So was Huselius, heck, he cleared re-entry waivers, too. As was Recchi who did well in Atlanta, and Sasonov who did well in Carolina.

Again, not a great trade by any means, but the fact that Boynton was on waivers shouldn't mean too much....yet.

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06-21-2008, 08:54 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Perhaps all these "Florida called and wanted so-and-so" rumours are because they did. They searched around to try and get what they could for Olli and how high his price tag was. Isn't that how these kinds of things work? You start high and gauge where to go from there?

With Olli asking for a trade and his play since he ripped Zed's neck open, perhaps what he got was all he could get?

I'm not overly thrilled with it and would rather that he stayed, but I'm not overly disappointed at the return, either. Ballard's solid, and who cares if Boynton was on the waiver wire. So was Huselius, heck, he cleared re-entry waivers, too. As was Recchi who did well in Atlanta, and Sasonov who did well in Carolina.

Again, not a great trade by any means, but the fact that Boynton was on waivers shouldn't mean too much....yet.
Yeah the difference is that before those players hit waivers they had success in the nhl and were all goalscorers....Boynton has never been good.

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06-21-2008, 09:09 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
I think it's more likely Florida has zero intention of dealing with Calgary or Vancouver unless it's a ridiculous overpayment given their history with Keenan and Luongo.
Agreed, fans wouldn't like it, and it'd be bad PR for them to deal with either Calgary or Vancouver unless they managed to totally steal something in a meaure of revenge against Keenan or Luongo in the symbolic sense.

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06-21-2008, 09:10 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeafsAlive View Post
I heard the Leafs were interested and Martin was asking for this:

To Toronto:

Olli Jokinen
Wade Belak

To Florida:
Tomas Kaberle
Anton Stralman
Alexander Steen
1st in 08
2nd in 08
1st in 09

Without Belak that would be totally in Florida's favor

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06-21-2008, 09:15 PM
  #37
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I think it's pretty unprofessional to talk about another GM's offer so openly and take a swipe at the player himself.
I'm already anticipating the Calgary-Phoenix first round showdown of the ages.

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06-21-2008, 10:03 PM
  #38
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What's so hard to believe? If you were talking with Calgary about Jokinen, wouldn't you ask for Phaneuf? Of course you would. When you're trading one of your best players, you're going to ask for one of the other team's best players, whether you think that it'll work or not. That means Phaneuf, the Sedins, Kane, etc.. It should also include Turris, Mueller or Hanzal. If Florida didn't ask for any of those and get rejected, I'd be surprised. What I am surprised by, though, is that Florida didn't stand their ground. Surely, Phoenix would've conceded Hanzal (if not Mueller) eventually; we are talking about Jokinen here. It ends up looking as though no one wanted to pay the price for Jokinen, so Florida accepted a "B" offer for him, even though there was really no rush... dumb...


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06-21-2008, 10:09 PM
  #39
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Wow, why would they even bother?

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06-21-2008, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
What's so hard to believe? If you were talking with Calgary about Jokinen, wouldn't you ask for Phaneuf? Of course you would. When you're trading one of your best players, you're going to ask for one of the other team's best players, whether you think that it'll work or not. That means Phaneuf, the Sedins, Kane, etc.. It should also include Turris, Mueller or Hanzal. If Florida didn't ask for any of those and get rejected, I'd be surprised. What I am surprised by, though, is that Florida didn't stand their ground. Surely, Phoenix would've conceded Hanzal (if not Mueller) eventually; we are talking about Jokinen here. It ends up looking as though no one wanted to pay the price for Jokinen, so Florida accepted a "B" offer for him, even though there was really no rush... stoooopid...
I would definitely ASK for Phaneuf, but I would have to realize there there is no way it would happen. The thing that makes me question this rumour is that the result they actually got back for Jokinen was FAR different from Dion Phaneuf. That said, a Phaneuf-Bouwmeester pairing would be out of this world!

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06-21-2008, 10:24 PM
  #41
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“Jokinen’s price tag was way too high. We’re not putting not Dion Phaneuf in a Jokinen trade, so it’s very simple. A little bit too high for a guy who hasn’t played a playoff game. Not interested in that.”

How childish is that quote--Sutter wanted him bad--but when another team lands Jokinen he sticks the knife in his back with the "never played in the playoffs" comment. If Jokinen was a bad player why did you try to acquire him?

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06-21-2008, 10:45 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by The Falconer View Post
“Jokinen’s price tag was way too high. We’re not putting not Dion Phaneuf in a Jokinen trade, so it’s very simple. A little bit too high for a guy who hasn’t played a playoff game. Not interested in that.”

How childish is that quote--Sutter wanted him bad--but when another team lands Jokinen he sticks the knife in his back with the "never played in the playoffs" comment. If Jokinen was a bad player why did you try to acquire him?
yeah, i'm sure sutter's telling the truth but unneccesary to diss a player you inquired about. comes off as nothing but sour grapes.

and if the panthers made a trade with calgary or vancouver of any significance right now they might as well up & relocate.

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06-21-2008, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GloveSave View Post
Boynton has never been good.
He didn't get a nice fat contract for inventing super glue.

I don't know, the more I look at it the more I think the great "damn, Florida just got fleeced" is totally overblown. I'm not sure what Martin was saying on those phone calls (btw, the GM fraternity has really gone downhill) but it is what it is. The teams involved have to play this out on the ice, and on paper the 'Yotes have no defense. I'm sure the counter will be: "we are planning to be active in free agency" Oh? Well I guess the Panthers have the same excuse.

It's only been a day, all the arm chair GMs sit it out for 12 months then come back to it. Jokinen is a good player, but maybe now Horton can finally take the bull by the horns. The only person holding Nathan Horton back is Nathan Horton because on some nights he looks totally dominating, and then most nights he looks like a young NHL forward playing on a team with a superstar who takes way too much heat when things go wrong and way too little credit when things go well. With the superstar out of the way (and a new coach), I have a feeling Horton turns it up some.

With Frolov, Mathias, a free agent or two coming, the Panthers don't look so bad. Tone down the rhetoric.

As to Sutter and talk about Martin being overboard with his demands: some sort of weirdness between the GMs must be real, because if you can trade a 1st round pick for Steve Eminger in a deep draft then someone is smoking smoking something and the 28 others not involved wants some of that. The one GM who got the pick doesn't hit from his own pipe.

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06-21-2008, 11:19 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Storminator16 View Post
He didn't get a nice fat contract for inventing super glue.

I don't know, the more I look at it the more I think the great "damn, Florida just got fleeced" is totally overblown. I'm not sure what Martin was saying on those phone calls (btw, the GM fraternity has really gone downhill) but it is what it is. The teams involved have to play this out on the ice, and on paper the 'Yotes have no defense. I'm sure the counter will be: "we are planning to be active in free agency" Oh? Well I guess the Panthers have the same excuse.

It's only been a day, all the arm chair GMs sit it out for 12 months then come back to it. Jokinen is a good player, but maybe now Horton can finally take the bull by the horns. The only person holding Nathan Horton back is Nathan Horton because on some nights he looks totally dominating, and then most nights he looks like a young NHL forward playing on a team with a superstar who takes way too much heat when things go wrong and way too little credit when things go well. With the superstar out of the way (and a new coach), I have a feeling Horton turns it up some.

With Frolov, Mathias, a free agent or two coming, the Panthers don't look so bad. Tone down the rhetoric.

As to Sutter and talk about Martin being overboard with his demands: some sort of weirdness between the GMs must be real, because if you can trade a 1st round pick for Steve Eminger in a deep draft then someone is smoking smoking something and the 28 others not involved wants some of that. The one GM who got the pick doesn't hit from his own pipe.
Heh, I wish, I think you mean Frolik? If they add Frolov, then maybe we got something.

It seems very true that GMs today love to stab each other in the back. I don't mind that really, it takes away from some integrity for sure, but it also increases rivalries which isn't really a bad thing.

That said, maybe he asked for these things and maybe he didn't, does it matter? Why not ask for the moon? You never know when someone might give it to you...

Dave Nonis: Hey Mike, how's about Bertuzzi, Auld, and Allen for Luongo, Krajicek, and a pick?

Mike Keenan: Bertuzzi? You can stop there, I'm sold, I don't even care if your replacement goalie will be an embarrassment to puck stoppers.

***

Bryan Murray: So Mike, we've got these AMAZING guys, names of Kvasha and Parrish. I think maybe we could help you with your logjam in goal and take that awful Jokinen off your hands.

Mike Milbury: Please get rid of this Luongo fella. Done deal. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to see if we can't get Yashin and Dipietro signed for life. Mr. Snow keeps saying if I pull off a few more dumb moves that even he could wind up with my job. Ah Garth, always the joker.

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06-21-2008, 11:39 PM
  #45
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Oops, I meant "Frolik". Those *** f's....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panthers Rock View Post
That said, maybe he asked for these things and maybe he didn't, does it matter? Why not ask for the moon? You never know when someone might give it to you...

Dave Nonis: Hey Mike, how's about Bertuzzi, Auld, and Allen for Luongo, Krajicek, and a pick?

Mike Keenan: Bertuzzi? You can stop there, I'm sold, I don't even care if your replacement goalie will be an embarrassment to puck stoppers.

***

Bryan Murray: So Mike, we've got these AMAZING guys, names of Kvasha and Parrish. I think maybe we could help you with your logjam in goal and take that awful Jokinen off your hands.

Mike Milbury: Please get rid of this Luongo fella. Done deal. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to see if we can't get Yashin and Dipietro signed for life. Mr. Snow keeps saying if I pull off a few more dumb moves that even he could wind up with my job. Ah Garth, always the joker.


The said thing is, those conversations did happen. Word for word.

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06-21-2008, 11:45 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Blades 0f Steel View Post
I read on the Panthers board that the Oiler's assistant GM did in fact say they made a better offer!
Did he say what the offer was? I could find the post you reference.

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06-21-2008, 11:50 PM
  #47
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Martin is a toolbox, first both Sedins, now Phaneuf. After all that he ends up with 2 middle pairing D-men, and an average pick.

I feel terrible for Florida fans.

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06-22-2008, 12:34 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by The Falconer View Post
“Jokinen’s price tag was way too high. We’re not putting not Dion Phaneuf in a Jokinen trade, so it’s very simple. A little bit too high for a guy who hasn’t played a playoff game. Not interested in that.”

How childish is that quote--Sutter wanted him bad--but when another team lands Jokinen he sticks the knife in his back with the "never played in the playoffs" comment. If Jokinen was a bad player why did you try to acquire him?
You can interpret that as, if he was to trade Phaneuf he would need something much better than that.

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06-22-2008, 12:49 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by LeafsAlive View Post
Phaneuf is overrated but he is worth more than Jokinen.
not half as overrated as kaberle..

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06-22-2008, 12:59 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Storminator16 View Post
He didn't get a nice fat contract for inventing super glue.

I don't know, the more I look at it the more I think the great "damn, Florida just got fleeced" is totally overblown. I'm not sure what Martin was saying on those phone calls (btw, the GM fraternity has really gone downhill) but it is what it is. The teams involved have to play this out on the ice, and on paper the 'Yotes have no defense. I'm sure the counter will be: "we are planning to be active in free agency" Oh? Well I guess the Panthers have the same excuse.

It's only been a day, all the arm chair GMs sit it out for 12 months then come back to it. Jokinen is a good player, but maybe now Horton can finally take the bull by the horns. The only person holding Nathan Horton back is Nathan Horton because on some nights he looks totally dominating, and then most nights he looks like a young NHL forward playing on a team with a superstar who takes way too much heat when things go wrong and way too little credit when things go well. With the superstar out of the way (and a new coach), I have a feeling Horton turns it up some.

With Frolov, Mathias, a free agent or two coming, the Panthers don't look so bad. Tone down the rhetoric.

As to Sutter and talk about Martin being overboard with his demands: some sort of weirdness between the GMs must be real, because if you can trade a 1st round pick for Steve Eminger in a deep draft then someone is smoking smoking something and the 28 others not involved wants some of that. The one GM who got the pick doesn't hit from his own pipe.

Good post. We'll have to sit back and see what the next few months bring. We now have 8 or 9 defensemen locked up, so I'm wondering if there's something else going on. Still have 3 months to find out.

Even still, Matthias and Frolik could come in and do terrifically. Then again, they could stink up the joint. Guess we'll have to wait and see.


Ah, to be a die hard fan. When I was a kid and the Phins were doing well, I wondered what it was like to be a fan of the Cardinals or at the time the Bucs. Never knew I'd find out one day.

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