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06-23-2008, 02:21 PM
  #226
Trxjw
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
I think I'd be willing to bring back Rozsival over Campbell if he's $2MM+ cheaper. I thought Rozy had two very good seasons here and an off year last season. He can bounce back and play a solid two-way game again, I believe. He may not be ideal for the PP, but I often feel more comfortable with the guy I've seen in a Rangers uniform as opposed to the guy who comes here with the bigger price tag. Unfortunately 1997-2004 left me pretty bitter.
I can't say I'm in the same boat as you, Fletch. I think the Rangers need d-men who are capable of making a clean breakout pass from their own end to start the offense. Can we really leave it to Gomez to skate the puck out of our own end every shift?

If there is one thing that really stands out with Rozy, it's his inability to make a good breakout pass. How many times did we watch him cough the puck up behind our net trying to avoid a hit and hang his d-partner out to dry? How many times did he pass the puck into Jagr's skates along our own half-boards leading to a turnover? He is completely bewildered by a team with a serious forecheck.

In that regard, I'd almost be willing to pay the extra salary for Campbell.

However, Campbell isn't a shooter. I think we're going to find ourselves in a similar situation to last year with our PP if we sign Campbell. He is another guy on the back-end who won't shoot the puck.

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06-23-2008, 02:24 PM
  #227
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I thought people were...

generally pleased with Rozy in his first season. He did have that 'Jagr Groupie' tag to him, which was unfortunate, but all I remember is watching a guy grit it out each night. Played hurt, played tough and played well. At times I thought he benefitted by playing with Jagr, but the more I look back at it the more I believe that he'd actually be better without Jagr, if that makes any sense.

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06-23-2008, 02:30 PM
  #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
I see your point about the puck possession but the Rangers can have two units with two different philosophies...One with Campbell as the QB and one with Jagr as the QB.....
I would not be in favor of that for several reasons, but mainly because that was last year's failed strategy.

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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
I think I'd be willing to bring back Rozsival over Campbell if he's $2MM+ cheaper.
In a vacuum, one player vs. the other, it's a tough call. It probably depends on what you're going to do with the money you saved. If it goes to a forward that can put in the 20 extra points you were counting on from Campbell, is it a wash?

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06-23-2008, 02:37 PM
  #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
generally pleased with Rozy in his first season. He did have that 'Jagr Groupie' tag to him, which was unfortunate, but all I remember is watching a guy grit it out each night. Played hurt, played tough and played well. At times I thought he benefitted by playing with Jagr, but the more I look back at it the more I believe that he'd actually be better without Jagr, if that makes any sense.
We had people here calling him "Rozzyballs" and worse for a whole summer. Trust me when i tell you i had debates a day about how well Rozsival played that first year here..

I don't know if he would be better without Jagr...I'm not sure many players would be better without Jagr playing with them...

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06-23-2008, 02:39 PM
  #230
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
living in buffalo i have heard my fair share of these arguments...especially leading up to the trade deadline when the city was buzzing.....i heard on the radio, from people who seemed to have been correct that the sabres offerred him 6 million over 4 years....now, if the rangers offerred that to him would he take it?....i dont know, however his agent told the sabres that he wanted to reach UFA and he wanted his big payday because he is a later bloomer and this is his one and only payday most likely....from what i heard in buffalo around the trade deadline he was asking for 7.5 from buffalo as a discount to stay and the sabres said 6 and neither would budge off of their figure.....

think about it....using your opinion of him as a legit #1, pp qb at the ripe old age of 28 do you really think, being the only high-end defenseman on the market he would take a low amount of money to grab?....any team signing him will most likely have to give up 7.5 or more over 5-8 years....the length is too long and the amount isnt worth what he is....

i am not pulling these numbers out of my butt....these are the numbers that he was asking for as a discount from the sabres...i wouldnt imagine those would go down now that he was traded to SJ and made it to the second round of the playoffs again....now he has more experience and improved their pp quite a bit....he will be asking for more most likely
These numbers aren't coming from a legitimate source or even his agent - so where are they coming from?

7.5 m/yr discount? That's LAUGHABLE.... only reason to ask for that amount is if you have ZERO intention of ever coming back to begin with. I don't want to get into monetary discussion of he said/she said....

Bottom line is that he is a legitimate answer to our PP/blue line scoring issues and if the terms are agreeable to the Rangers cap situation they will press for him. I would draw the line at 6.5/5 years and if he wasn't interested I would drop the issue and tell him thanks for his time - the offer is still on the table.

and if not I'm happy with Rosie signing back here.

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06-23-2008, 02:40 PM
  #231
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Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
I would not be in favor of that for several reasons, but mainly because that was last year's failed strategy.


I doubt that it would fail this year simply because the point men with the Gomez this upcoming year would be much better....

just because it didn't work last year (with less talent) doesn't mean it wouldn't work next year..

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06-23-2008, 02:50 PM
  #232
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I'm not sure either...

but Rozy, when Jagr is out there, did try to force the pass to him too often and didn't always keep it simple.

MJ - $2MM in today's NHL is a lot of money. That's the difference between a second and third liner, or a elite top liner and Brendan Shanahan. Heck, it may be the difference in keeping Jagr or replacing him with Ryan Malone. That's my issue - the costs need to be considered.

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06-23-2008, 03:00 PM
  #233
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damnit, if Slats hadn't hardballed Dale Puriton we wouldn't be in this position.

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06-23-2008, 03:14 PM
  #234
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damnit, if Slats hadn't hardballed Dale Puriton we wouldn't be in this position.
My Pt. Exactly , just sign Campbell for 6.5 already and be happy we have a great Offensive D man again

Plus Korpikoski and Moore are going to make the team and get 3rd and 4th line ice time.....Sjostrom is better than a 4th liner too

Backman and Prucha can be moved to shed some salary

I am fine with this move

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06-23-2008, 03:18 PM
  #235
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Who's going to take Backman?

what about the rest of the roster? You talk about better third and fourth lines (in theory, it's debateable), but there are still holes in the top two lines.

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06-23-2008, 03:23 PM
  #236
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Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
My Pt. Exactly , just sign Campbell for 6.5 already and be happy we have a great Offensive D man again

Plus Korpikoski and Moore are going to make the team and get 3rd and 4th line ice time.....Sjostrom is better than a 4th liner too

Backman and Prucha can be moved to shed some salary

I am fine with this move
According to Brooks (which is like quoting Eklund) Sjostrom isn't getting a qualifiying offer and the Rangers are hoping to sign him for less money next season...No guarantee that he's back..I also don't think Sjostrom has shown that he's anything more then a borderline 3rd line player..

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06-23-2008, 03:25 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
what about the rest of the roster? You talk about better third and fourth lines (in theory, it's debateable), but there are still holes in the top two lines.
I think the Rangers could waive Backman if need be.

If you think about it the rangers have $3.9M tied up in Backman and Prucha next season. Now I'm not saying we should sign Avery for $3.9M but would anybody here NOT trade both of these players for Avery if given the chance?

That $3.9M is huge for two guys that can easily be replaced next season..

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06-23-2008, 03:29 PM
  #238
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The least of the Rangers' worries...

should be the third and fourth line - except they need to manage the payroll at that level since there are a few kids who can likely play in those roles.

I saw the same regarding Sjostrom and actually believe it. Interesting move by Sather if true - get him for cheaper by guaranteeing him another season. He'd be crazy to take it though. Typically you like to make more money than the prior season - especially after scoring 12 goals in a season (his best ever). So Sather wants to drop his salary for next season and guarantee him another season at the lower number? Where do I sign up for that? My boss is clever at that - he once offered a guy to make more money by coming to my firm by taking less salary. The guy did the math and didn't think it would work out well for him and didn't take the offer.

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06-23-2008, 03:33 PM
  #239
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
should be the third and fourth line - except they need to manage the payroll at that level since there are a few kids who can likely play in those roles.

I saw the same regarding Sjostrom and actually believe it. Interesting move by Sather if true - get him for cheaper by guaranteeing him another season. He'd be crazy to take it though. Typically you like to make more money than the prior season - especially after scoring 12 goals in a season (his best ever). So Sather wants to drop his salary for next season and guarantee him another season at the lower number? Where do I sign up for that? My boss is clever at that - he once offered a guy to make more money by coming to my firm by taking less salary. The guy did the math and didn't think it would work out well for him and didn't take the offer.
Unless the KHL comes calling I'm not sure who would give Sjostrom more then $600k..

If I were Sjostrom i'd take the two year contract...lets face it he might end up playing in europe if the rangers don't qualify him..

I would let Sjostrom walk if it were me...i'd rather see someone like Byers take that 4th line spot and i don't think it's a given Ryan Hollweg is gone..

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06-23-2008, 03:44 PM
  #240
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I don't care much about Sjostrom...

but am thinking there's a team out there willing to take a chance for more than $600k-650k for a good skating forward who can kill penalties and who scored 12 goals.

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06-23-2008, 04:01 PM
  #241
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2 things about Backman:

- If Malik, Rozsival, Mara and Strudwick are definitely not coming back, Sather needs to consider whether he needs Backman more than he needs to find someone to fill yet another hole back there.

- As SOS brings up, Rozsival's first season with NYR wasn't memorbable. In 2 short years, Renney's been able to turn him a damn serviceable d-man and the team's top TOI player. Backman seems to get the same treatment as 1st year Rozsvial, occasional deserved, but at the same time, you also see glimmers a quality player in his game. I think he's someone who could come back and earn that paycheck next season.

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06-23-2008, 04:15 PM
  #242
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Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
2 things about Backman:

- If Malik, Rozsival, Mara and Strudwick are definitely not coming back, Sather needs to consider whether he needs Backman more than he needs to find someone to fill yet another hole back there.

- As SOS brings up, Rozsival's first season with NYR wasn't memorbable. In 2 short years, Renney's been able to turn him a damn serviceable d-man and the team's top TOI player. Backman seems to get the same treatment as 1st year Rozsvial, occasional deserved, but at the same time, you also see glimmers a quality player in his game. I think he's someone who could come back and earn that paycheck next season.
Raise the Bar Sundin and McCabe just what you need to get you over the Hump. With all the Young Talent in Washington, Philly, and Pittsburgh your window of opportunity is fading Fast. Have your heard any rumors that Brian Burke will be the new President and GM after next season with Slats riding off into the Sunset.

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06-23-2008, 04:20 PM
  #243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
2 things about Backman:

- If Malik, Rozsival, Mara and Strudwick are definitely not coming back, Sather needs to consider whether he needs Backman more than he needs to find someone to fill yet another hole back there.

- As SOS brings up, Rozsival's first season with NYR wasn't memorbable. In 2 short years, Renney's been able to turn him a damn serviceable d-man and the team's top TOI player. Backman seems to get the same treatment as 1st year Rozsvial, occasional deserved, but at the same time, you also see glimmers a quality player in his game. I think he's someone who could come back and earn that paycheck next season.
I think Rozsival played better in his first year here then last year....His partner that season (Malik) also played above what was expected of him..


I don't see anythink in Backman and I'd be surprised if he was in the teams plans next season. I think he showed at times that he was a decent defenseman but he also showed at times that he well sucked..

Again if we factor in the 2.3M for Backman and 1.6M for Prucha that's dead salary cap space that can be used to fit real needs on the roster. I'd rather have a journeyman hold the fort next year until either Potter or perhaps maybe (if everything breaks right with his development) Sanguinetti is ready to play...maybe we can throw sauers name in there too at some point next season..

Also if we sign Campbell and both him and Staal end up playing 25 minutes a night that's going to make the last pairing more of a non issue..

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06-23-2008, 04:34 PM
  #244
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People give Backman too much crap on here. He got traded for the first time in his career and to another conference at the deadline. I thought he looked good till the playoffs started. How many playoff games did he get in playing in STL? Don't think many. I am more than willing to give him a shot and see what he can do on the team for a whole season before I decide he's horrible like most of you have.


Malik is gone so I guess Mr. Backman is next up to be abused by the fans and scapecoated.

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06-23-2008, 04:54 PM
  #245
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if campbell will take 6 million i would jump all over it, however i have a feeling a team like columbus is going to sign him for 7.5.......

i still think redden for 4 years makes more sense than campbell for 6-7 years.....i would just rather get someone at a shorter term even if it is the same amount of money(6-6.5) so that sanguinetti and del zotto can get some time when they are ready and keep the steady flow of players coming through

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06-23-2008, 04:58 PM
  #246
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MJ...

I see more Ulanov than first year NYR Rozsival in Backman. I give Rozy a ton of credit - he came into that season having missed the last NHL season due to a leg injury (broken leg was it?). He ended up being pretty solid in that season too and I'm not too convinced it was because Renney did anything special. He was a decent defenseman before. Not great, but serviceable, and he just needed time, as did a lot of players in that season, to get back into the flow of things - so I'm not sure there's much Renney can do to make Backman any better. Backman's another story.

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06-23-2008, 06:25 PM
  #247
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Fletch

It was a serious knee injury (ACL I think), that happened in Sept 2003 during training camp. Rozsival only played one game the rest of that season and then played in the Czech Rep during the lockout.

I agree about Backman--he's very inconsistant and at this point in his career I'm not sure there's a whole lot any coaching can do.

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06-24-2008, 12:37 AM
  #248
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I'm all for giving Backman another shot this year. We need to sign a top pairing d-man and at least 3 wingers and possibly 4. Backman's 2.3 cap hit isn't terrible and the talent and size is definitely there. For whatever reason, he always looked nervous. But, as Radek27 said, it was his first few games with a tough crowd. If he gets another season to fit into the system, I think we might have a bargain on our hands. If nothing changes after October, then by all means show him the door. In fact, his giveaway to Crosby in game 1 still haunts me and passive plays like that one make it very possible that there won't be an improvement. But I'm willing to give him a shot at redemption, especially considering the fallback option is probably Corey Potter. If Backman doesn't work out, then waive him and call up Potter: that option isn't going away. But there is no sense, to me, in taking away what could well be the better option before the season starts.

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