HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Notices

Does the floor make Roli attractive?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-28-2008, 01:44 PM
  #26
Lowetide
Registered User
 
Lowetide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,281
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Bundy View Post
Are you guys turning on Roloson?

After what he did in '06?

I know Markkanen performed admirably in that series, but I don't know if Jussi is capable of being a series-stealer Roli was in 2006...
No one is turning on Roloson. However, this team has other issues and Roloson has been passed on the depth chart. That happens to most goalies long before their 38th birthday, so he's had a nice ride.

Lowetide is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 01:59 PM
  #27
Replacement
Now with 9% more zen
 
Replacement's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Hockey Hell
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,663
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Bundy View Post
Are you guys turning on Roloson?

After what he did in '06?

I know Markkanen performed admirably in that series, but I don't know if Jussi is capable of being a series-stealer Roli was in 2006...
I'm very comfortable having Roli as a backup and a goalie tht can still as he demonstrated recently play long stretches if Garon comes out.
We're paying him too much but this signing was predicated on a decision before we obtained Garon and even with Roli's contract we are not paying too much for the nature of goaltending we are recieving.
I'm so much better with this than Conkanen

Replacement is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 02:03 PM
  #28
Psycho Dad
Oil Kings
 
Psycho Dad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sherwood Park
Posts: 9,896
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by saskyoil View Post


Its gonna take a lot of this to make Roli attractive my friend, a whole lot...
If given a choice, I'd bet most women would still choose to pass out on the floor.

Psycho Dad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 02:05 PM
  #29
Bryanbryoil
Moderator
I Know A Thing Or 6
 
Bryanbryoil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: About Winning
Posts: 50,367
vCash: 500
Quote:
Does the floor make Roli attractive?
Probably not, but I'm sure that his $ would be seen as attractive by most chicks.

__________________
Treat Others As You Would Like To Be Treated
Bryanbryoil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 02:11 PM
  #30
Oilerdiehard
Registered User
 
Oilerdiehard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pennsylvania
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,458
vCash: 500
Unless JDD is looking lights out at camp or early in the season. I would keep Roli around probably for the whole year (even if he does not play much) and at least until the trade deadline.

It would be different if Roli still had more than 1 year left on his contract. But he is just about finished up on this current deal.








.


Last edited by Oilerdiehard: 06-28-2008 at 02:18 PM.
Oilerdiehard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 02:30 PM
  #31
Bryanbryoil
Moderator
I Know A Thing Or 6
 
Bryanbryoil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: About Winning
Posts: 50,367
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilerdiehard View Post
Unless JDD is looking lights out at camp or early in the season. I would keep Roli around probably for the whole year (even if he does not play much) and at least until the trade deadline.

It would be different if Roli still had more than 1 year left on his contract. But he is just about finished up on this current deal.
.

It could mean losing a guy like Pouliot. IMO JDD is ready, he just needs NHL experience. Roli is an expensive back-up who didn't play all that great at ANY point last year, and JDD is ready to be a back-up. Unless Garon goes down with injury in camp, Roli should be toast.

Bryanbryoil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 04:16 PM
  #32
misfit
Moderator
 
misfit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: just north of...everything
Posts: 15,342
vCash: 50
Front loading contracts makes all kinds of sense for cap teams like the Oilers (still feels funny saying that).

1. As the OP points out, with a rising cap, there will be teams who will have trouble making the cap floor. Bringing in a player who has a higher cap hit than his actual salary allows these teams to get to the floor without having to increase their budget and to spend money they can't afford to give up.

2. Buying out a player's contract results in a much lower cap hit later in the term, and you also get the benefit of a lower overall cap hit during the earlier years of the deal.

3. If the contract doesn't take the player to UFA status at the end of the deal, then you only have to qualify him based on the last year of the deal.

4. Hockey careers are short, so if a player can get most of his money in the first few seasons of his deal, then he's in better shape if he gets hurt, or regresses to the point where he's eventually bought out.

__________________
If you are offended by this post, it's probably because you're ugly.
misfit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 04:21 PM
  #33
nick39
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 154
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
I'm very comfortable having Roli as a backup and a goalie tht can still as he demonstrated recently play long stretches if Garon comes out.
We're paying him too much but this signing was predicated on a decision before we obtained Garon and even with Roli's contract we are not paying too much for the nature of goaltending we are recieving.
I'm so much better with this than Conkanen
100% agreed.

nick39 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-28-2008, 05:53 PM
  #34
grego
Registered User
 
grego's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Saskatchewan
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,292
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilerdiehard View Post
Unless JDD is looking lights out at camp or early in the season. I would keep Roli around probably for the whole year (even if he does not play much) and at least until the trade deadline.

It would be different if Roli still had more than 1 year left on his contract. But he is just about finished up on this current deal.








.
It is true it is only one year, so only if JDD is amazing out of camp do you move Roli

Other then that look at it as a bargain deal for starter backup. $4 mill for the 2 plus whatever we have for JDD if he stays up or counts on a one way. Either way it is still much less than many teams have on a starter.

Right now I want to see what Garon can do to start the year, since he played good for much of last year, better then we have seen for a while in Edmonton so I don't want to write him off without a good look either

grego is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 07:35 AM
  #35
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,609
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by oilerfan17 View Post
A little nit pick here, but the proposed contract is illegal under the CBA. A contract can't drop in real salary each year by more than 50% of the previous year. For example, a 5-5-2.5-2-2 contract would work, but not a 5-5-2-2-2.

Hemsky4PM has it right on the cap hit too.
You are right that this contract is illegal, but the rule is that is violated is that the contract cannot drop by more than 50% of the minimum of the first two years. So something like 5-5-4-1.5 is actually legal.

Fourier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 08:06 AM
  #36
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,609
vCash: 500
The issue of Rolis cap hit vs salary has been discussed from time to time. A deal with Tampa involving Denis seemed to make sense at one point, but it looks like Denis will be bought out. I could still see Tampa having some interest in Roli as they don't really have a veteran presence. The new ownership does not seem to be that shy about spending money.

The only two teams that might have issue with the cap floor are Pheonix and Columbus. The Oilers have very good connections with both these teams. Pheonix does not seem to have any need of a goalie however, so my focus would be on Columbus. Leclaire remains unsigned and is somewhat injury prone. While Mason may become very good he certainly is young. Lacosta has played one game, so a vet might help.

In the end, I would see the Oilers trading Roli if

1) They need the cap space.

2) They sign a free agent goalie.

3) They get an offer that returns a decent return.

or

4) Roli indicates that he is not comfortable in a three-man system where the number one guy will get most of the time.

Situation 4) is a real possibility because of JDD's waiver status. The Oilers cannot risk losing the most seasoned prospect in their system to make room for Roli, given that Garon is a UFA next spring. So this pretty much means that JDD is on the roster. I don't see Roli as being a happy camper if he spends most of the year in the PB. This is particularly true if he wants to keep playing after this year is over. A guy his age need to be playing well and often to earn a decent contract. Sitting JDD the whole year does nothing for his development so if he is up, he needs to play.


Last edited by Fourier: 06-29-2008 at 08:24 AM.
Fourier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 08:22 AM
  #37
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,609
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by grego View Post
It is true it is only one year, so only if JDD is amazing out of camp do you move Roli

Other then that look at it as a bargain deal for starter backup. $4 mill for the 2 plus whatever we have for JDD if he stays up or counts on a one way. Either way it is still much less than many teams have on a starter.

Right now I want to see what Garon can do to start the year, since he played good for much of last year, better then we have seen for a while in Edmonton so I don't want to write him off without a good look either
Capwise, it is not a bargain deal for a starter/backup. The total is actually $4.866M and add in JDD and you are closer to $6 M for your goaltenders. The top 60 goalies in the league average about $2.5M per so the Oilers are spending more in goal than the average. Moreover, if you throw out the top 7 salaries the average drops to about $2.1 M. So for a team without an elite goalie the Oilers have very expensive goaltending.

Fourier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 08:46 AM
  #38
oh_canuck
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 868
vCash: 500
clearly the summer is the time to be reviewing this hockey boards ,
the quality of the threads on a thread by thread basis goes up about 200% once the majority of the couch potato GMs and coaches are gone like the wind.

oh_canuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 09:14 AM
  #39
Dooman
Registered User
 
Dooman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 472
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourier View Post
You are right that this contract is illegal, but the rule is that is violated is that the contract cannot drop by more than 50% of the minimum of the first two years. So something like 5-5-4-1.5 is actually legal.
If what you said is true, then 5-5-4-2.5 is the only thing that would be 'legal', as 1.5 is under 50% of 5 million (The amount received in the first two years)

Unless I misunderstood you.

Dooman is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 09:14 AM
  #40
Asiaoil
Registered User
 
Asiaoil's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Country: Thailand
Posts: 5,259
vCash: 500
There is nothing to worry about in sending JDD down aside from him taking DD's development time. At the end of training camp all teams will be pretty much set in goal - no one can afford to wait that long - so all the seats will be pretty much filled. On top of that - who in their right mind would claim a guy like JDD and keep him on your NHL roster for the entire year when he has not played a single NHL game and is nothing more than an average AHL goalie. Nothing to worry about at all in exposing him to waivers. Labarbarra was exposed by LA after TC 2 years ago after a season in the AHL where he made JDD look like Conklin on a bad day - and he sailed right through.

Asiaoil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 10:16 AM
  #41
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,609
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dooman View Post
If what you said is true, then 5-5-4-2.5 is the only thing that would be 'legal', as 1.5 is under 50% of 5 million (The amount received in the first two years)

Unless I misunderstood you.
Just to clarify what I meant, the year to year drop cannot exceed 50% of the minimum of the first two years.


Last edited by Fourier: 06-29-2008 at 03:08 PM.
Fourier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 10:45 AM
  #42
Dooman
Registered User
 
Dooman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 472
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourier View Post
Just to clarify what I meant, the year to year drop cannot exceed 50% of the minimum.
Then wouldn't it have to be 5-5-4-2, or 5-5-3-1.5 ?

5-5-4-1.5 would still be illegal (Or I'm completely out to lunch)

Dooman is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 03:06 PM
  #43
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,609
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dooman View Post
Then wouldn't it have to be 5-5-4-2, or 5-5-3-1.5 ?

5-5-4-1.5 would still be illegal (Or I'm completely out to lunch)
The drop from $4M to $1.5M is $2.5M which is half of the minimum of the first two years.

I will edit my post above to make this clearer.

Fourier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-29-2008, 03:13 PM
  #44
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,609
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asiaoil View Post
There is nothing to worry about in sending JDD down aside from him taking DD's development time. At the end of training camp all teams will be pretty much set in goal - no one can afford to wait that long - so all the seats will be pretty much filled. On top of that - who in their right mind would claim a guy like JDD and keep him on your NHL roster for the entire year when he has not played a single NHL game and is nothing more than an average AHL goalie. Nothing to worry about at all in exposing him to waivers. Labarbarra was exposed by LA after TC 2 years ago after a season in the AHL where he made JDD look like Conklin on a bad day - and he sailed right through.
You might well be right about JDD, especially if they move him down right after training camp and leave him there. But if he plays and has any success waiving him is a risk. There are a lot of teams right now who are toying with their goaltending. You never know who might bite. With no one else near ready in the system and no vet signed for 2009-2010, the Oilers situation in net is about as up in the air as it can get.

Fourier is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:52 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.