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Do you guys have any interest in acquiring Pitkanen?

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06-30-2008, 03:03 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
If you would carefully pay attention to the course this thread has taken you would see that I had not said anything controversial before being personally attacked. I merely made a statement that O'Byrne should be in the line-up over Bouillon. That garnered personal attacks from these nameless few and that's what prompted the spiteful retorts from me.
What did O'b prove in the off season to show he was ahead of Gorges and Bouillon? He was #6 and at times #7 at the end of last year.

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06-30-2008, 03:05 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
I don't think he's capable.

Honestly, after Pitkanen's breakout season with Philadelphia, I would've looked heavily into acquiring him. He has had a couple poor seasons since and I'm not sure I'm willing to pay what is necessary to acquire him and then keep him under contract. I'd much rather continue to go forward with the development of O'Byrne, Tank and Emelin or find a suitable fixture on the free agent market such as Rozsival.
Probably is as much as we'd like to think subban/weber/carle will fill in the void and be top 4 offensive d-men on our team we don't know if they'll end up as 5th defencemen or powerplay specialists. Pitkanen was once regarded as a future elite d-man, I don't believe he has lost his potential but rather just needs to go back to the basics, so to speak. Besides, edmonton wasn't exactly a powerhouse. Only thing i can conclude is he probably won't lead a team like other top d-man, but I think if he plays with a guy like hamrlik he'd be an excellent top 4 d. Just, the price may be too steep and yes, if it is, i'd certainly rather continue the development of our young players instead. For now, as much as you may or may not like it, i won't complain with what we have, including boullion on a 3rd pairing.

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06-30-2008, 03:05 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
What dod O'b prove in the off season to show he was ahead of Gorges and Bouillon? He was #6 and at times #7 at the end of last year.
I never said he was ahead of Gorges. Right now, Gorges is a superior defenceman. Won't be the case in the future.

O'Byrne has proven he's got great upside, he's got size, he can be physical and block shots. He actually played very well in Komisarek's role when Komisarek was injured for the last portion of the season. He's ahead of Bouillon because you want to nuture his upside, his contract is more cap friendly and his age and contributions to the outlook of the team is more salivating than Bouillon.

Do you really want to waste O'Byrne's development to keep Bouillon's inflated salary in the line up for the last year of his contract and most likely last season as a Montreal Canadien? You gotta look short term and long term. Bouillon and O'Byrne short term is a bit of a wash, where I'd give the edge to O'Byrne but long term, O'Byrne wins every single time.

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06-30-2008, 03:08 PM
  #54
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Whoever truly believes O'byrne has potential to be a top 3 D has lost their minds, no offence. Mcdonagh has top 3 potential, not O'byrne. O'byrne is a 4-5. If komisarek is considered a 2-3(3 if he goes after hamrlik, which some say he should) then how is O'byrne a top 3 potential? Not even close, i like o'byrne but be realistic.

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06-30-2008, 03:08 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Probably is as much as we'd like to think subban/weber/carle will fill in the void and be top 4 offensive d-men on our team we don't know if they'll end up as 5th defencemen or powerplay specialists. Pitkanen was once regarded as a future elite d-man, I don't believe he has lost his potential but rather just needs to go back to the basics, so to speak. Besides, edmonton wasn't exactly a powerhouse. Only thing i can conclude is he probably won't lead a team like other top d-man, but I think if he plays with a guy like hamrlik he'd be an excellent top 4 d. Just, the price may be too steep and yes, if it is, i'd certainly rather continue the development of our young players instead. For now, as much as you may or may not like it, i won't complain with what we have, including boullion on a 3rd pairing.
Pitkanen has issues with his defensive play and hockey sense...that's why his development has stalled in the last 3-4 years. That was a knock some teams had on him including TB who traded the pick to Phillie that got them Joni(for Fedotenko and another player).

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06-30-2008, 03:08 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Not sure why they are being spoken in the same semtence. Bouillon is a steady productive, established guy...O'byrne is a guy with solid upside who is just getting his feet wet in the NHL.

The Habs could do better than Bouillon at #4...and they could do worse also. That's not Franki's fault...but to me he does his job well and he is a guy I don't worry about.

O'byrne will be #6 full time next year and he has the upside to develop into #3-4, he was pretty steady for a rookie last year and had a few big hits. He actually had 2 fights(it's unfortunate he broke a finger but it happens), he brings an element of toughness. I think this year his puck moving should improve with confidence as should the hits.

If you can't remember an O'byrne hit you need to stop drinking so much during games.
I totally agree with you Obyrne definitely has a bigger upside and is only getting his feet wet in the NHL but Im talking has of right now its not even a contest. Bouillon is better at every thing in my opinion, if he had OByrnes hight im pretty sure he would get much more respect around here, we have a tendance to think small defenseman cant cut it in the NHL wich isint true at all but thats what we automatically think. Bottom line I think Obyrne and Bouillon are both #5 or #6 Dmen in the NHL.

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06-30-2008, 03:13 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
I never said he was ahead of Gorges. Right now, Gorges is a superior defenceman. Won't be the case in the future.

O'Byrne has proven he's got great upside, he's got size, he can be physical and block shots. He actually played very well in Komisarek's role when Komisarek was injured for the last portion of the season. He's ahead of Bouillon because you want to nuture his upside, his contract is more cap friendly and his age and contributions to the outlook of the team is more salivating than Bouillon.

Do you really want to waste O'Byrne's development to keep Bouillon's inflated salary in the line up for the last year of his contract and most likely last season as a Montreal Canadien? You gotta look short term and long term. Bouillon and O'Byrne short term is a bit of a wash, where I'd give the edge to O'Byrne but long term, O'Byrne wins every single time.
I agree O'b has good upside(I wouldn't use the word great). That being said I think he'll be limited to a #3-4 guy, I don't see him as a #1-2.

Why would he need to be ahead of Bouillon to be nurtured? He'll develop fine as the #6 guy playing with Hamrlik and should start getting PK time next year. I don't see Bouillon being linked to his development.

Bouillon's salary is fine if you consider that he is the #4 guy on this team and plays a very steady game(same salary as Dandenault for 5 X the production), plays 17-18 minutes a night.

I agree O'b will pass Gorges in 2-3 years but he'll have to develop and earn that distinction, right now he's still in the learning phase.

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06-30-2008, 03:16 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I agree O'b has good upside(I wouldn't use the word great). That being said I think he'll be limited to a #3-4 guy, I don't see him as a #1-2.

Why would he need to be ahead of Bouillon to be nurtured? He'll develop fine as the #6 guy playing with Hamrlik and should start getting PK time next year. I don't see Bouillon being linked to his development.

Bouillon's salary is fine if you consider that he is the #4 guy on this team and plays a very steady game(same salary as Dandenault for 5 X the production), plays 17-18 minutes a night.

I agree O'b will pass Gorges in 2-3 years but he'll have to develop and earn that distinction, right now he's still in the learning phase.
The original posting had
Markov-Komi
Hamr-Pitka
Gorges-Bouillon
O'Byrne

So, yes, if that was the case, Bouillon would be directly related to O'Byrne's development. If we acquire another D without one of our D going the other way, O'Byrne should and will win out over Bouillon.

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06-30-2008, 03:25 PM
  #59
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This makes me think about the whole hype there was surrounding Perezhogin a couple of years back. People wanted to retrograde everybody to make place for him. Look where he is now, playing with Polar Bears in Siberia.

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06-30-2008, 03:27 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Kovalev View Post
This makes me think about the whole hype there was surrounding Perezhogin a couple of years back. People wanted to retrograde everybody to make place for him. Look where he is now, playing with Polar Bears in Siberia.
Perezhogin performed very well at the AHL level. He followed it up with a great stint on the first line. Once he was taken off of it his play trailed off. But I think when he ended Keith Primeau's career with an innocent check, it all went downhill for him. He was trying to recover from the incident in the AHL, to put another player out of commission, no doubt the mental affects weighed heavily on him.

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06-30-2008, 03:29 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by King Kovalev View Post
This makes me think about the whole hype there was surrounding Perezhogin a couple of years back. People wanted to retrograde everybody to make place for him. Look where he is now, playing with Polar Bears in Siberia.

Siberia as in...edmonton?

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06-30-2008, 03:37 PM
  #62
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If we're going after Pitkanen, why not keep Streit?

Pitkanen isn't the good defensively, one game you'll be thinking "We got a steal, this guy is amazing", the next game you'll have to check on the net about 10 times to see if he's hurt, or not, or for some odd reason he was scratched.

That's how he was in Edmonton last year.

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06-30-2008, 03:37 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Perezhogin performed very well at the AHL level. He followed it up with a great stint on the first line. Once he was taken off of it his play trailed off. But I think when he ended Keith Primeau's career with an innocent check, it all went downhill for him. He was trying to recover from the incident in the AHL, to put another player out of commission, no doubt the mental affects weighed heavily on him.
Agreed, all Im trying to say is that we shouldnt try to push every body down the ladder because we think someone has more *Potential* then another player because at the end of it all potential is nothing more than potential until you actually show what you can do. And Ive seen nothing from OByrne YET that suggest that we should throw Bouillon out of the equation for right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Siberia as in...edmonton?
Im not quite sure what youre trying to say there buddy lol.


Last edited by Beakermania*: 06-30-2008 at 04:53 PM.
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06-30-2008, 03:43 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by King Kovalev View Post
Im not quite sure what youre trying to say there buddy lol.
Apparently Nylander's wife didn't wanna go to edmonton after he agreed to sign last year because she thought it was like siberia over there so he changed his mind and went to the caps.

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06-30-2008, 04:00 PM
  #65
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i'd like to acquire pitkanen but the cost to do so and to sign him would be greater than it'd be worth in the long IMO

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06-30-2008, 04:05 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Apparently Nylander's wife didn't wanna go to edmonton after he agreed to sign last year because she thought it was like siberia over there so he changed his mind and went to the caps.
Really? I remember that whole Nylander incident but I didnt know that was the reason why he didnt sign in Edmonton LMAO.

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06-30-2008, 04:53 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Whoever truly believes O'byrne has potential to be a top 3 D has lost their minds, no offence. Mcdonagh has top 3 potential, not O'byrne. O'byrne is a 4-5. If komisarek is considered a 2-3(3 if he goes after hamrlik, which some say he should) then how is O'byrne a top 3 potential? Not even close, i like o'byrne but be realistic.
I just love capping a guys potential at 23

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06-30-2008, 05:34 PM
  #68
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I just love capping a guys potential at 23
I don't see how he's a possible potential #3 when Komi is argueably #3 after hammer and markov and O'byrne isn't nearly as physical or blocks as many shots as Komi. Sure, he's younger and all, but I can't imagine him being as good as Komi, which isn't a insult to O'byrne but a compliment to Komi. Hell, if you say Komi is a #2 and Hammer is the #3, really now, do you honestly believe O'byrne will end up as good as Hamrlik? Like i said, i like O'byrne but everyone wants to believe we have 15 top 4 defensive prospects. Even brisebois looked good some times with hamrlik, that doesn't mean O'byrne's bad but Mcdonagh is a #2, O'byrne is a #3, Gorges is a #4, Fisher is a 3-4, Subban is a top 4, Carle is a top 4, does it ever end? Then on the next forum people say our d-man aren't good enough and we need another guy or we'll be exposed. IMO, he doesn't have enough offensive upside nor toughness to be considered a #3. I apologize if i said people have lost their minds for having an opinion of O'byrne being a #3 but people are a little too optimistic. I do not see anything in particular from his play or his stats that would suggest he'll be a top 3. Then again, I hope I'm wrong, and would be happy to be flamed or whatever if he does indeed reach a #3 status and you can personally come to me door and punch me in the face if becomes a #2, if you wish, start making a list for if he becomes #1, but that...i assume anyway, we can agree I shouldn't be concerned about.

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06-30-2008, 05:34 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
I just love capping a guys potential at 23
Yeah, I remember the days, not so long ago, where Plecanek was projected to be a 3rd line C at best, Higgins a 35/40 goals scorer, A.K. a bust...

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06-30-2008, 06:00 PM
  #70
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Yeah, I remember the days, not so long ago, where Plecanek was projected to be a 3rd line C at best, Higgins a 35/40 goals scorer, A.K. a bust...
Luckily I never thought Ak was a bust(he's actually been my desktop background even before the season started). I think Higgins said he can score 40-40 but i think he likely make 35-35 in his career and plek came out of nowhere, few anticipated that, not complaining though.

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