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Old
07-02-2008, 10:37 AM
  #26
FutureGM97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DruMez View Post
I'd add Philly maybe, but the rest of those are all teams in a rebuild, with a few good young kids to build around, but not yet a core as they're still missing key components.

PHX - defense?
LA/CHI - goaltending?
CBJ - center?
Phoenix has Ed Jovanovski and Derek Morris, both of whom are 31 and going to turn 30 this year, respectively. Not to mention they have Zbynek Michalek, Kurt Sauer from yesterday, and Keith Yandle, all of whom are going to keep on getting better. Their defense may not be as deep as others but considering their forward corps is one of the deepest in terms of prospects, it makes up.

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Old
07-02-2008, 10:39 AM
  #27
donpaulo
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IMO the LA Kings are the team to watch... but kudos go out to Donny Maloney and Waynes club in PHX

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Old
07-02-2008, 10:44 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DruMez View Post
I'd add Philly maybe, but the rest of those are all teams in a rebuild, with a few good young kids to build around, but not yet a core as they're still missing key components.

PHX - defense?
LA/CHI - goaltending?
CBJ - center?
LA - Bernier is their future goalie... then they have Brown, Kopitar, O'Sullivan, Johnson, Doughty, hickey, Teubert. much much brighter than ours offensively and defensively.

CHi - Huet is their goalie... than they have Kane, Toews, Sharp, Seabrook, Barker, Byfuglin

PHX - does lack defense. but they have great offensive players and a real solid goalie. We have good defense but nobody on offense.

both teams have extreme talent offensively and defensively. Both will be better than us in 2 yrs.

CBJ- center is where they are lacking. but they do have a good goalie, and have a good core of Voracek, and Filatov w/ nash and Zherdov. that's not a bad start at all.

Remember we are lacking on the wings. and really don't have any superstars. Each of these teams have potential if not already superstars, and forwards who can singlehandedly take over a game or a series. We do not have this at all. they are all in better positions than us. And all of their stars are under 26. Our 3 best players are all over 30. our youth in the forward groups does not compare to any of these teams.

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Old
07-02-2008, 10:48 AM
  #29
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if the core offensive players and the younger guys can find their scoring touch im fine with this core. i think we need to get one more offensive player before the season starts though

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Old
07-02-2008, 10:49 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
LA - Bernier is their future goalie... then they have Brown, Kopitar, O'Sullivan, Johnson, Doughty, hickey, Teubert. much much brighter than ours offensively and defensively.

CHi - Huet is their goalie... than they have Kane, Toews, Sharp, Seabrook, Barker, Byfuglin

PHX - does lack defense. but they have great offensive players and a real solid goalie. We have good defense but nobody on offense.

both teams have extreme talent offensively and defensively. Both will be better than us in 2 yrs.

CBJ- center is where they are lacking. but they do have a good goalie, and have a good core of Voracek, and Filatov w/ nash and Zherdov. that's not a bad start at all.

Remember we are lacking on the wings. and really don't have any superstars. Each of these teams have potential if not already superstars, and forwards who can singlehandedly take over a game or a series. We do not have this at all. they are all in better positions than us. And all of their stars are under 26. Our 3 best players are all over 30. our youth in the forward groups does not compare to any of these teams.
Sigh. Henke, how quickly they forget you...

Not disputing your take on these teams (although other than the offense in Chicago, you're counting on all those players to develop as projected - as a fan for the team that drafted Brendl, you should know better ), but you give us awful short shrift for having the best goalie in the group (not to mention the fact that he's well under 30).

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Old
07-02-2008, 10:51 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
LA - Bernier is their future goalie... then they have Brown, Kopitar, O'Sullivan, Johnson, Doughty, hickey, Teubert. much much brighter than ours offensively and defensively.

CHi - Huet is their goalie... than they have Kane, Toews, Sharp, Seabrook, Barker, Byfuglin

PHX - does lack defense. but they have great offensive players and a real solid goalie. We have good defense but nobody on offense.

both teams have extreme talent offensively and defensively. Both will be better than us in 2 yrs.

CBJ- center is where they are lacking. but they do have a good goalie, and have a good core of Voracek, and Filatov w/ nash and Zherdov. that's not a bad start at all.

Remember we are lacking on the wings. and really don't have any superstars. Each of these teams have potential if not already superstars, and forwards who can singlehandedly take over a game or a series. We do not have this at all. they are all in better positions than us. And all of their stars are under 26. Our 3 best players are all over 30. our youth in the forward groups does not compare to any of these teams.
Ok, give up on the team them

By the way, Gomez is not over 30 and Lundqvist (also not 30), who by the way plays the most important position, is a star in my book

Stop getting all panicky

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Old
07-02-2008, 10:55 AM
  #32
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By the way, all those teams you listed have sucked for a while and have had very good first round picks. Obviously they are going to have decent assets

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Old
07-02-2008, 11:00 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
Ok, give up on the team them

By the way, Gomez is not over 30 and Lundqvist (also not 30), who by the way plays the most important position, is a star in my book

Stop getting all panicky
he will be 30 by the time the season is over i believe.... and I was just talking about skaters that is why I left out lundy

i'm not panicking im just stating that there are many teams who have better, and younger cores than us.


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Old
07-02-2008, 11:09 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Sigh. Henke, how quickly they forget you...

Not disputing your take on these teams (although other than the offense in Chicago, you're counting on all those players to develop as projected - as a fan for the team that drafted Brendl, you should know better ), but you give us awful short shrift for having the best goalie in the group (not to mention the fact that he's well under 30).
LA - Kopitar, Brown, O'Sullivan and Johnson are established already and i forgot Frolov. LA definately has a better core than us. Would take Kopitar, Brown, O'Sullivan, Frolov, Johnson, and Bernier over Gomez, Drury, Dubi, Staal, hank any day of the week. and than they still have another 3 stud defensemen projected higher than ours prospects. They are going to win a cup w/in 3 yrs. and if they make good signings could become a serious dynasty type team.

CLB- Zherdov and Nash are established as well. leclair came of a great year, and I would like to see what type of contract he will get.

PHX - Mueller just came off an great season. and Bryzgalov for the contract he signed and how he plays is a better deal than our beloved Hanke. Hanke might be better (not by much) but Bryzgalov is almost $3mil cheaper I believe. That three mill adds up to better players surrounding him. but yeah maybe we do have a better core than PHX.

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Old
07-02-2008, 11:13 AM
  #35
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If you think Ilya Bryzgalov is close to as good a goalie as Henrik Lundqvist, then I have a bridge to sell you...

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Old
07-02-2008, 11:18 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash View Post
If you think Ilya Bryzgalov is close to as good a goalie as Henrik Lundqvist, then I have a bridge to sell you...
Bryzgalov had worse GAA but a better save percentage playing on a team that wasn't nearly as good defensively as ours (he faced 6 more shots in 8 less games). Also it was his first season as a starting goaltender... he really isn't as bad as you make him out to be. Watch next year his stats will be even closer to Lundy. In a couple years he will be a Vezina candidate.

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Old
07-02-2008, 12:42 PM
  #37
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The core is good but I feel that one of Redden/Roszi is redundant. Would've rather had Mara back with his overall solid play and less of a cap hit. We weren't going to compete for the Cup anyway - no need in mimicking Detroit. Plus we have Sangs and Del Zotto 2-4 years away. Offensively, I feel that Prucha-Gomez would be fine - Prucha needs 1st line minutes to come back to the rookie form and Gomez is most comfortable with speedy wingers who drive to the net (much like Gionta, Parise). Add a fast big body to retrieve pucks on forecheck (such as, IDK, Sjostrom?) and 1st line is set.

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Old
07-02-2008, 12:54 PM
  #38
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If they don't sign any offensive firepower, their core will be the weakest since the days of Ted Sator.

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Old
07-02-2008, 01:01 PM
  #39
n8
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I most concerned that with the length of their contracts, keeping our young stars will be exceedingly hard in 3-5 years. Most unhappy about the Rosival signing. Didn't even want him back. I can't stand it when he waits behind the net and waits for both teams to change lines and ends up waiting so long two forecheckers move in and he coughs up the puck when he had 15 seconds (that's like half a shift) to just skate the puck up himself which he is perfectly capable of and the other team gets a scoring chance. I also see him get a lot of lazy penalties which pisses me off (holding, hooking, tripping). Redden better turn into the second coming of Chris Chelios or that signing will hurt in the twilight years of his contract. And that contract would become an albatross as well. Love Redden though. Henke all the way. Gomez and Drury are great, I just don't like how much their cap hit hinders the team's roster flex.

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Old
07-02-2008, 01:11 PM
  #40
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I don't think Bryzgalov's a bad goalie. I think he's a good one.

Henke's an elite goalie.

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Old
07-02-2008, 01:16 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n8 View Post
I most concerned that with the length of their contracts, keeping our young stars will be exceedingly hard in 3-5 years. Most unhappy about the Rosival signing. Didn't even want him back. I can't stand it when he waits behind the net and waits for both teams to change lines and ends up waiting so long two forecheckers move in and he coughs up the puck when he had 15 seconds (that's like half a shift) to just skate the puck up himself which he is perfectly capable of and the other team gets a scoring chance. I also see him get a lot of lazy penalties which pisses me off (holding, hooking, tripping). Redden better turn into the second coming of Chris Chelios or that signing will hurt in the twilight years of his contract. And that contract would become an albatross as well. Love Redden though. Henke all the way. Gomez and Drury are great, I just don't like how much their cap hit hinders the team's roster flex.
Agreed. That cap better keep going up, otherwise we'll have Rozsie at Staal's expense...

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Old
07-02-2008, 01:31 PM
  #42
DontStepanMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash View Post
I don't think Bryzgalov's a bad goalie. I think he's a good one.

Henke's an elite goalie.
right now yes.... give it a year or two and Bryzgalov will be considered an elite goalie. he is that good.

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Old
07-02-2008, 01:40 PM
  #43
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We'll see.

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Old
07-02-2008, 02:30 PM
  #44
Evgeny Oliker
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no, I do not.

Every team has to decide who will be those top 4 or 5 players they hand out the big bucks to. When you look around the NHL, we dont match up at all in this area:
Detroit: Datsyuk, Hossa, Lidstrom, Rafalski
Tampa: Lecavalier, St.Louis, Boyle, Stamkos(eventually)
Anaheim: Getzlaf, Perry, Niedermayer, Pronger, Giguere
Calgary: Iginla, Langkow, Phaneuf, Regehr, Kipper
Montreal: Tanguay, Koivu, Kovalev, Markov, Hamrlik, Price(eventually)
Philly: Briere, Richards, Gagne, Timonen, Biron
Pitt: Crosby, Malkin, Gonchar, Whitney, Fleury
Washington: Ovechkin, Semin, Nylander, Green, Theodore

There is a reason why I bolded some teams. These are teams I just dont think we are in the same league with even. Two of those teams are not in the same league for a reason, Detroit and Pitt. Both just made the Cup finals. We dont have a Malkin or a Crosby, and we also dont have a Datsyuk or Zetterberg or Hossa. Defensively, we do not have a Lidstrom or Pronger or Niedermayer. Goaltending is where we might match up a bit with those 2 teams. The problem is that even teams who werent in the Finals last season, like Anaheim and Calgary, are also out of our league I think....we dont have any Iginla, or Getzlaf or Perry or Phaneuf.

Our major problems will come later on in the future, due to the mistakes we have made now. Guys like Datsyuk, Malkin, Getzlaf, Phaneuf have one thing in common - they are YOUNG and HOME GROWN talents. The guys we decide to make our 5 most expensive core players are NOT YOUNG and NOT HOME GROWN...aside from Lundqvist:
Drury(31)
Gomez(28)
Rozsival(29)
Redden(31)
(Lundqvist)


You cannot win with older players as your core. The problem is that we tried this technique before with guys like Lindros and Nylander and Ulanov and Lefebre and it just back-fired. You can see it in guys like Drury now even, he is a great clutch player, but he is already starting to lose a step and that is why his numbers dropped from a season ago when he was in Buffalo. You can see it in Rozsival now as he cannot keep up with top forwards. You can see it in Redden the last 2 seasons where his numbers dropped and Ottawa fans could not wait to get rid of him(for good reason). The Rangers made some very powerful long-term decisions in signing Drury, Gomez, Rozsival and Redden to long-term deals...I feel these decisions will seriously hurt us in the future.


Last edited by Evgeny Oliker: 07-02-2008 at 02:41 PM.
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Old
07-02-2008, 02:33 PM
  #45
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Because 31 is really old for a hockey player...

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Old
07-02-2008, 02:39 PM
  #46
Evgeny Oliker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash View Post
Because 31 is really old for a hockey player...
31 is borderline, 30 and 31 is when players start to show signs of decline. The problem is that we are not winning a Cup this year, trust me. So next year the 31 year olds will be 32, the year after they will be 33. Realistically, I dont see us winning a Cup for at least another 2 years....yet its hard to win the Cup when your top players are 33 or older.

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Old
07-02-2008, 02:50 PM
  #47
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Goaltending Core - Great one-two combination we have in Lundqvist and Valiquette.
Defensive Core - Improved with loss of Malik, signing of Redden, re-signing of Rozsival.
Offensive Core - Bring back Jagr and the team seems better than last year if we remove Hollweg/Orr for Voros/Rissmiller.

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Old
07-02-2008, 02:59 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avy View Post
Lundqvist+Gomez+Drury+Redden+Rozsival.
And Staal too.... long-term, either Sang or DZ will be a top pairing offensive dman.

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Old
07-02-2008, 03:00 PM
  #49
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i say its better than the lindros holik fleury lundmark one we had a few years ago....

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Old
07-02-2008, 03:01 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
defensively yes... our core of Redden, Rosy and Staal is great.

Goaltending yes... hanke is top 5 even if he is overpaid by a little

Offensively no... this core is one of the worst in the NHL if you consider their contracts for what they actually bring..
It's not so much offense as it is wingers. Our centers are great. [Gomez, Drury, Dubi, Betts, soon to be joined by Anisimov]

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