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Old
07-03-2008, 05:17 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Or how do you know those guys won't bomb like the many before Avery who tried to fill that role? Avery you KNEW what you got, these guys we have no idea. The fact that you guys are excited about those names scares me, pass me some of those brownies please.
how do you know they wont succeed. From what I have read about these players from the fans of their previous teams, they sound promising.
I for one dont look at Voros as Averys replacement, I look at him as Hollwegs. And I am ecstatic about that. Fritsche sounds like a hard working defensively responsible player that can skate and plays hard every shift. And they are both very young.
I am very sad to see Avery go, but that doesnt mean that these two guys wont be able to contribute to the team.

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07-03-2008, 05:18 PM
  #27
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I don't think anyone can answer the question for sure.

However, I think it's clear that this squad became noticeably younger and faster going forward. It's going to be a more fun squad to watch, imho.

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07-03-2008, 05:21 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
You said we are better on paper now. I think the roster we had at the end of the season was far superior ON PAPER than what we have now.
The fact that we couldn't get past the second round in two straight years was a sign that we obviously weren't good enough as it was.

Also, I don't buy that on paper we looked better. We had Avery playing first line minutes and Drury being misused on a third line that consisted of Callahan and Dawes (no offense to those two, it's just they have almost no experience).

Also, let's face it... Dubinsky is not a first line center. He has the potential to be in my opinion, but he is clearly third on the depth chart when it comes to centers as of now.

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07-03-2008, 05:23 PM
  #29
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The thing I love is that Dubinsky lost his mentor and linemate in Jagr and everyone here thinks he is going to IMPROVE on his numbers.

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07-03-2008, 05:25 PM
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I'll be honest, I would be surprised if Dubinsky gets to the 40 points he did last year. I like him a lot, but I don't see him as a top line center. He's more of a decent 2nd liner, and a great 3rd line center. I think he'll be at his best if you don't put the scoring pressure on him (without a superstar like Jagr next to him) and let him play his all-around game.

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07-03-2008, 05:27 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
The thing I love is that Dubinsky lost his mentor and linemate in Jagr and everyone here thinks he is going to IMPROVE on his numbers.
Jagr was Dubis linemate, but I dont think he was his mentor. Drury is still there and I think he is a great role model.

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07-03-2008, 05:30 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
The thing I love is that Dubinsky lost his mentor and linemate in Jagr and everyone here thinks he is going to IMPROVE on his numbers.
On the plus side, we won't have to give Dubinsky a ridiculous contract after Jagr inflates his numbers for several years.

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07-03-2008, 05:32 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by fes View Post
Jagr was Dubis linemate, but I dont think he was his mentor. Drury is still there and I think he is a great role model.
Jagr was teaching Dubinsky positioning and how to use his body and size to his advantage. Hopefully the lessons stick and Dubinsky can figure out the rest through coaching and self analysis.

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07-03-2008, 05:32 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdEye View Post
On the plus side, we won't have to give Dubinsky a ridiculous contract after Jagr inflates his numbers for several years.
Oh yeah cause you never want your players to overperform while you have them cheap.

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07-03-2008, 05:48 PM
  #35
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I think that the reason we are better on paper is because the roster makes a lot more sense now. Granted, last year it seemed like Jagr and Gomez were a perfect fit, but after watching Gomez for a full season it's pretty obvious that it wasn't. Zherdev sounds like a player who compliments Gomez pretty well, which in itself is a reversal. Zherdev is complimenting Gomez, not Gomez complimenting someone else. Also, not having a Jagr-centric offense is going to allow Renney to be a bit more creative with his plan of attack.

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07-03-2008, 05:50 PM
  #36
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WORSE....

Going into the offseason we needed a pp qb and a hard hitting defenseman...The Ragners brought back Rozsvial and signed Redden to a long term contract...neither fills the needs we all saw last season...

We lose Avery, Straka, Jagr, Mara, Shanny, (although that's a positive) and replace them with Fritsche, Zherdev, Voros, and Rismiller Redden, Kallinin(who will make us pine for Malik/Backman by November) and Naslund....Tell me how that's an upgrade? tell me how this team took a step forward...tell me who the franchise forward is going to be? Tell me how good Gomez is going to look with the top defenseman all over him next season instead of having Jagr get that role? Tell me chemstry isn't going to once again be an issue to start the season? Tell me who the spark plug is going to be to get the team going when NOBODY has life? I love our prospect pool but who's ready to step up and take a spot next season? korpikoski? maybe...maybe he is...Anisimov? Is he ready? Is he somebody you want to rush to the NHL?



Will Zherdev get 30 goals next season?

Will Naslund take another step backwards?

If the Zherdev of last season shows up but what if the Zherdev of 06-07 shows up?

For all the talk about Avery being a 3rd line player playing out of postin on the 2nd line what do you guys call the potential for Callahan on the 2nd line? Or worse Sather says Shanny might be back...COME ON!! The guy looked like he retired in March 07...What's Shanny going to look like in March 09? But his leadership is just soooooooooooo important but never manifests itself when we really need it (buffalo game 5 OT Pittsburgh Game 5 OT)...ya know leadership the the thing we hear we have sooooooooo much of with Gomez, Drury, Redden, and Naslund...Great can't wait for a team of leaders taking us to the 8th spot...

We have created a hole on the top line that can't be fixed from within....We have less depth on the forward lines...This team took a HUGE step backwards and we are happy? why? I know we have a certain part of our fanbase that love the draft more than the season but a step backwards never leads to good things...

We talk about Jagr being prima-donna for wanting to be the MAN on the team yet give Gomez a pass for essentialy saying the same thing about himself in the post today (yeah but it's ok cause it seems out of character for gomez...sure.)..ya know the guy making $7M a year who looked like a 2nd line player when NOT paired with Jagr at even strength last year...Ya know the guy who gets a free pass for the woes of the power play...That guy.....

We are a borderline playoff team as it stands right now...A team that could either pick 10th in the draft or make the 8th seed.....

Now I'm gonna hear the following response..."But SoS we didn't make it past the 2nd round again!!" My answer to that is the Rangers had the pieces to build on..to make one more run with the chemistry already established the past year.....

Sather should be fired....This team is a mess and I'm not sure why I'm in the minority here...I'll root my heart out (like always) but I have zero expecations next season.....i need to go get a beer and calm down....

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07-03-2008, 05:54 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
WORSE....

Going into the offseason we needed a pp qb and a hard hitting defenseman...The Ragners brought back Rozsvial and signed Redden to a long term contract...neither fills the needs we all saw last season...

We lose Avery, Straka, Jagr, Mara, Shanny, (although that's a positive) and replace them with Fritsche, Zherdev, Voros, and Rismiller Redden, Kallinin(who will make us pine for Malik/Backman by November) and Naslund....Tell me how that's an upgrade? tell me how this team took a step forward...tell me who the franchise forward is going to be? Tell me how good Gomez is going to look with the top defenseman all over him next season instead of having Jagr get that role? Tell me chemstry isn't going to once again be an issue to start the season? Tell me who the spark plug is going to be to get the team going when NOBODY has life? I love our prospect pool but who's ready to step up and take a spot next season? korpikoski? maybe...maybe he is...Anisimov? Is he ready? Is he somebody you want to rush to the NHL?



Will Zherdev get 30 goals next season?

Will Naslund take another step backwards?

If the Zherdev of last season shows up but what if the Zherdev of 06-07 shows up?

For all the talk about Avery being a 3rd line player playing out of postin on the 2nd line what do you guys call the potential for Callahan on the 2nd line? Or worse Sather says Shanny might be back...COME ON!! The guy looked like he retired in March 07...What's Shanny going to look like in March 09? But his leadership is just soooooooooooo important but never manifests itself when we really need it (buffalo game 5 OT Pittsburgh Game 5 OT)...ya know leadership the the thing we hear we have sooooooooo much of with Gomez, Drury, Redden, and Naslund...Great can't wait for a team of leaders taking us to the 8th spot...

We have created a hole on the top line that can't be fixed from within....We have less depth on the forward lines...This team took a HUGE step backwards and we are happy? why? I know we have a certain part of our fanbase that love the draft more than the season but a step backwards never leads to good things...

We talk about Jagr being prima-donna for wanting to be the MAN on the team yet give Gomez a pass for essentialy saying the same thing about himself in the post today (yeah but it's ok cause it seems out of character for gomez...sure.)..ya know the guy making $7M a year who looked like a 2nd line player when NOT paired with Jagr at even strength last year...Ya know the guy who gets a free pass for the woes of the power play...That guy.....

We are a borderline playoff team as it stands right now...A team that could either pick 10th in the draft or make the 8th seed.....

Now I'm gonna hear the following response..."But SoS we didn't make it past the 2nd round again!!" My answer to that is the Rangers had the pieces to build on..to make one more run with the chemistry already established the past year.....

Sather should be fired....This team is a mess and I'm not sure why I'm in the minority here...I'll root my heart out (like always) but I have zero expecations next season.....i need to go get a beer and calm down....


Beautiful post man. I'm havin a Bass Ale, what you havin? I might need the whole six pack after today!

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07-03-2008, 05:54 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Better, and most importantly, DIFFERENT. this team has addressed a major problem. no definite focus on how the team will play. with the moves sather has made, i think its pretty clear what kind of a club this will be next year.
Fast paced with a strong defense?

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07-03-2008, 05:56 PM
  #39
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We're 12x better and 12x more exciting. And we'll see about 12x more line combinations.

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07-03-2008, 06:04 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
WORSE....

Going into the offseason we needed a pp qb and a hard hitting defenseman...The Ragners brought back Rozsvial and signed Redden to a long term contract...neither fills the needs we all saw last season...

We lose Avery, Straka, Jagr, Mara, Shanny, (although that's a positive) and replace them with Fritsche, Zherdev, Voros, and Rismiller Redden, Kallinin(who will make us pine for Malik/Backman by November) and Naslund....Tell me how that's an upgrade? tell me how this team took a step forward...tell me who the franchise forward is going to be? Tell me how good Gomez is going to look with the top defenseman all over him next season instead of having Jagr get that role? Tell me chemstry isn't going to once again be an issue to start the season? Tell me who the spark plug is going to be to get the team going when NOBODY has life? I love our prospect pool but who's ready to step up and take a spot next season? korpikoski? maybe...maybe he is...Anisimov? Is he ready? Is he somebody you want to rush to the NHL?



Will Zherdev get 30 goals next season?

Will Naslund take another step backwards?

If the Zherdev of last season shows up but what if the Zherdev of 06-07 shows up?

For all the talk about Avery being a 3rd line player playing out of postin on the 2nd line what do you guys call the potential for Callahan on the 2nd line? Or worse Sather says Shanny might be back...COME ON!! The guy looked like he retired in March 07...What's Shanny going to look like in March 09? But his leadership is just soooooooooooo important but never manifests itself when we really need it (buffalo game 5 OT Pittsburgh Game 5 OT)...ya know leadership the the thing we hear we have sooooooooo much of with Gomez, Drury, Redden, and Naslund...Great can't wait for a team of leaders taking us to the 8th spot...

We have created a hole on the top line that can't be fixed from within....We have less depth on the forward lines...This team took a HUGE step backwards and we are happy? why? I know we have a certain part of our fanbase that love the draft more than the season but a step backwards never leads to good things...

We talk about Jagr being prima-donna for wanting to be the MAN on the team yet give Gomez a pass for essentialy saying the same thing about himself in the post today (yeah but it's ok cause it seems out of character for gomez...sure.)..ya know the guy making $7M a year who looked like a 2nd line player when NOT paired with Jagr at even strength last year...Ya know the guy who gets a free pass for the woes of the power play...That guy.....

We are a borderline playoff team as it stands right now...A team that could either pick 10th in the draft or make the 8th seed.....

Now I'm gonna hear the following response..."But SoS we didn't make it past the 2nd round again!!" My answer to that is the Rangers had the pieces to build on..to make one more run with the chemistry already established the past year.....

Sather should be fired....This team is a mess and I'm not sure why I'm in the minority here...I'll root my heart out (like always) but I have zero expecations next season.....i need to go get a beer and calm down....
Maybe you're right, SOS. Who knows, we'll just have to wait and see. I hear where you're coming from, I'm just more optimistic about the players we brought in and how the team will respond without a single "go-to" guy. Again, I hear you, I'm just optimistic. Let's hope you're wrong about all this!

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07-03-2008, 06:05 PM
  #41
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SoS... not bringing back Jagr makes Gomez the PP QB. We were never without one, you know. QBs don't have to play the point. Jagr as PP QB last season and the season before just wasn't cutting it. That style of powerplay doesn't work nearly as well in the current NHL. Gomez WASN'T at fault for the powerplay failures because the PP was flowing through Jagr. Not his plan.

I am absolutely not sold on the need for a hard hitting defenseman. Not in the Rangers' system. We need quick sticks. That's what we have.

Where is this hole in the top 6? Gomez, Drury, Naslund, Zherdev, Dawes and any one of 3 guys who could plug into the other slot. Most top 6 teams have a "Two-A" winger playing there, including the Detroit Red Wings (Mikael Samuelsson?). Is it a scary offense? No, but it's one that makes much more sense that last year's.

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07-03-2008, 06:15 PM
  #42
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SOS, what would you have done to make this team better? I'm really curious.

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07-03-2008, 06:23 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Better, and most importantly, DIFFERENT. this team has addressed a major problem. no definite focus on how the team will play. with the moves sather has made, i think its pretty clear what kind of a club this will be next year.
I agree.

We not only got younger, but we got bigger and faster.

I think maybe we take a step back next season, but to take two steps forward in the near future.

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07-03-2008, 06:29 PM
  #44
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After the signings last year I thought we were a lock for the cup, I was sooooo overly positive, after what has transpired over the last 3 days I am the complete oposite of were I was just 12 Months & two days ago.

I think all these moves were bandaid moves, I think Redden was the worst signing by us out of all the signings by all the teams in the leauge.

I think we will stuggle all year to score goals, I also think our Defense will stuggle to keep us in a one to two goal game. I honestly think we could miss the playoffs, maybe by a point or two. I whole heartly believe we will not seriously compete for a Cup for 2 to 3 years.

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07-03-2008, 06:32 PM
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We are a better organization now. The team may have some chemistry issues, and next year may be a step back, but this team is built for longer term success.

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07-03-2008, 06:45 PM
  #46
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Ask me in April 2009. It is impossible to predict how a team with this degree of changeover will perform.

Do I approve of the changes? Yes.

Am I willing to bet we get further in the playoffs this year? No.

Wait and see fellas.

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07-03-2008, 06:50 PM
  #47
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we are better...

...and our chemistry will be much much better...book it

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07-03-2008, 06:53 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Better, and most importantly, DIFFERENT. this team has addressed a major problem. no definite focus on how the team will play. with the moves sather has made, i think its pretty clear what kind of a club this will be next year.
This was team with conflicting styles of play within itself. That element needed to be removed and it was. This is now a team constructed to play the style of play required based on our own drafted and trained players, forecheck, with speed and size.

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07-03-2008, 06:58 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
WORSE....

Going into the offseason we needed a pp qb and a hard hitting defenseman...The Ragners brought back Rozsvial and signed Redden to a long term contract...neither fills the needs we all saw last season...

We lose Avery, Straka, Jagr, Mara, Shanny, (although that's a positive) and replace them with Fritsche, Zherdev, Voros, and Rismiller Redden, Kallinin(who will make us pine for Malik/Backman by November) and Naslund....Tell me how that's an upgrade? tell me how this team took a step forward...tell me who the franchise forward is going to be? Tell me how good Gomez is going to look with the top defenseman all over him next season instead of having Jagr get that role? Tell me chemstry isn't going to once again be an issue to start the season? Tell me who the spark plug is going to be to get the team going when NOBODY has life? I love our prospect pool but who's ready to step up and take a spot next season? korpikoski? maybe...maybe he is...Anisimov? Is he ready? Is he somebody you want to rush to the NHL?



Will Zherdev get 30 goals next season?

Will Naslund take another step backwards?

If the Zherdev of last season shows up but what if the Zherdev of 06-07 shows up?

For all the talk about Avery being a 3rd line player playing out of postin on the 2nd line what do you guys call the potential for Callahan on the 2nd line? Or worse Sather says Shanny might be back...COME ON!! The guy looked like he retired in March 07...What's Shanny going to look like in March 09? But his leadership is just soooooooooooo important but never manifests itself when we really need it (buffalo game 5 OT Pittsburgh Game 5 OT)...ya know leadership the the thing we hear we have sooooooooo much of with Gomez, Drury, Redden, and Naslund...Great can't wait for a team of leaders taking us to the 8th spot...

We have created a hole on the top line that can't be fixed from within....We have less depth on the forward lines...This team took a HUGE step backwards and we are happy? why? I know we have a certain part of our fanbase that love the draft more than the season but a step backwards never leads to good things...

We talk about Jagr being prima-donna for wanting to be the MAN on the team yet give Gomez a pass for essentialy saying the same thing about himself in the post today (yeah but it's ok cause it seems out of character for gomez...sure.)..ya know the guy making $7M a year who looked like a 2nd line player when NOT paired with Jagr at even strength last year...Ya know the guy who gets a free pass for the woes of the power play...That guy.....

We are a borderline playoff team as it stands right now...A team that could either pick 10th in the draft or make the 8th seed.....

Now I'm gonna hear the following response..."But SoS we didn't make it past the 2nd round again!!" My answer to that is the Rangers had the pieces to build on..to make one more run with the chemistry already established the past year.....

Sather should be fired....This team is a mess and I'm not sure why I'm in the minority here...I'll root my heart out (like always) but I have zero expecations next season.....i need to go get a beer and calm down....
When you are right you are right. Our draft picks the last 3-4 years have sucked. We have no prospects with high upsides. Staal & Dubi were flukes and Cherry, AA, Sangs and MDZ will all bomb. Lundqvist is a flash in the pan another fluke who can't close the deal on winning the vezina. Where the hell is Dunc Wilson & Gilles gratton when you need a goalie!

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07-03-2008, 07:08 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by The Thomas J. View Post
After the signings last year I thought we were a lock for the cup, I was sooooo overly positive, after what has transpired over the last 3 days I am the complete oposite of were I was just 12 Months & two days ago.

I think all these moves were bandaid moves, I think Redden was the worst signing by us out of all the signings by all the teams in the leauge.

I think we will stuggle all year to score goals, I also think our Defense will stuggle to keep us in a one to two goal game. I honestly think we could miss the playoffs, maybe by a point or two. I whole heartly believe we will not seriously compete for a Cup for 2 to 3 years.
That shouldn't be a real surprise, the Rangers are a team in transition.

I don't know why you hate the Redden signing so much, he was once a top-10 defenseman in this league, he's just had a couple of bad seasons. He could potentially rebound and paired with Staal, could give us one of the better top pairings in the league. Also, his all-world "first pass" is just what the Rangers need to jumpstart their transition game.

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