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07-04-2008, 03:57 PM
  #151
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Gorges does the cross thing before he steps on the ice. I forget exactly what its referred to as though. I assume that would make him Christian.

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07-04-2008, 04:00 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by Tarpan View Post
A) Coneptually no, you can't reject something that you don't know about because you don't know what you're rejecting, just the title and not the contents.
Given this, it would stand to reason that one could reach adulthood without ever accepting the gospel, yet not be precluded from having an 'afterlife'.

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1) Some yes, some no
2) Some yes, some no
3) Some yes, some no
4) Some yes, some no
Give me an example of a deity that has no mass and an example of one that has no organic life. Then give me an example of a deity that has mass and one that has organic life.


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All deities require blind faith and there is no evidence as to the reality of any of them. There are, I believe, about 4500 known deities in documented world history.
Would Gary Bettman be considered a deity? I take it on blind faith that Gary Bettman exists. I've seen him on TV and take it on blind faith that it's really Gary Bettman. I take it on blind faith that everything I read about Gary Bettman is accurate. If he's not a deity, please explain why he hasn't achieved this status.

Is it possible for a hockey player to become a deity? If so, give me an example.

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07-04-2008, 04:49 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Rafael View Post
Given this, it would stand to reason that one could reach adulthood without ever accepting the gospel, yet not be precluded from having an 'afterlife'.


Give me an example of a deity that has no mass and an example of one that has no organic life. Then give me an example of a deity that has mass and one that has organic life.



Would Gary Bettman be considered a deity? I take it on blind faith that Gary Bettman exists. I've seen him on TV and take it on blind faith that it's really Gary Bettman. I take it on blind faith that everything I read about Gary Bettman is accurate. If he's not a deity, please explain why he hasn't achieved this status.

Is it possible for a hockey player to become a deity? If so, give me an example.
1) Correct.

2) a) Yahweh, b) Yahweh, c) Jesus / L Ron / Joseph Smith, d) Jesus / L Ron / Joseph Smith

3) Plausible, but not based on that information. You have not attributed to him supernatural ability that you subscribe to, you also have not said that you worship him. It is plausible for a human, such as Gary Bettman, to be classified as a deity to an individual though. A person is not neccessarily a deity, per se, but he can be a deity by one persons belief. That does not make him a deity to me, or you, but to that person they are. Tom Cruise is a person that many feel will become a deity within Scientology similar to that of L Ron. It is plausible that a hockey player would follow a similar path.

Further, on Bettman, you don't take it purely on Blind Faith. The existance of Bettman you can suggest is likely based on seeing evidence such as: countless contemporary witnesses, pictures, video footage, writings by him, 3rd party verification of his existance. Though you may not know for certain that he exists, there is a lot more than simple faith that goes into the decision of whether to believe he does not exist as there is much evidence for his existance and if you made attempts to prove his existance, it wouldn't be very difficult to do.

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07-04-2008, 05:11 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Tarpan View Post
1) Correct.

2) a) Yahweh, b) Yahweh, c) Jesus / L Ron / Joseph Smith, d) Jesus / L Ron / Joseph Smith
Didn't Jesus live some 2,000 years ago? I doubt he has organic life. You may want to revise your answers.

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3) Plausible, but not based on that information. You have not attributed to him supernatural ability that you subscribe to, you also have not said that you worship him. It is plausible for a human, such as Gary Bettman, to be classified as a deity to an individual though. A person is not neccessarily a deity, per se, but he can be a deity by one persons belief. That does not make him a deity to me, or you, but to that person they are. Tom Cruise is a person that many feel will become a deity within Scientology similar to that of L Ron. It is plausible that a hockey player would follow a similar path.

Further, on Bettman, you don't take it purely on Blind Faith. The existance of Bettman you can suggest is likely based on seeing evidence such as: countless contemporary witnesses, pictures, video footage, writings by him, 3rd party verification of his existance. Though you may not know for certain that he exists, there is a lot more than simple faith that goes into the decision of whether to believe he does not exist as there is much evidence for his existance and if you made attempts to prove his existance, it wouldn't be very difficult to do.
There are counteless witnesses & 3rd party verification of the existence of Jesus and his resurrection. Just as I haven't seen Jesus in person, I haven't seen Gary Bettman in person. Other than the fact that one is dead and the other living, there isn't much difference between the two with respect to whether or not I accept their existence on faith or fact.

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07-04-2008, 05:33 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Rafael View Post
Didn't Jesus live some 2,000 years ago? I doubt he has organic life. You may want to revise your answers.


There are counteless witnesses & 3rd party verification of the existence of Jesus and his resurrection. Just as I haven't seen Jesus in person, I haven't seen Gary Bettman in person. Other than the fact that one is dead and the other living, there isn't much difference between the two with respect to whether or not I accept their existence on faith or fact.
1) I clarified earlier that none currently exist that we know of. Those are ones that attributed with organic life as an attribute.

2) There are not countless witnesses & 3rd aprty verificaton of Jesus and the ressurection. There are actually very few sources, most of which have cloudy histories of edits, translations, and councils dedicated to filtering the information in the evidences to suit a specific story. Further, the authors of those evidences are unknown. To further add to the pain, I was quite specific about contemporary evidence and there is no contemporary evidence to support the existance of Jesus. The claim that he existed as a human is questionable, and there is not a shred of evidence to support any supernaturalism.

To suggest the two sets of evidence are equal is simply falacious.

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07-04-2008, 06:23 PM
  #156
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the last three pages of this thread have absolutely nothing to do with the topic
again

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07-04-2008, 06:55 PM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steel Yourselves View Post
Gorges does the cross thing before he steps on the ice. I forget exactly what its referred to as though. I assume that would make him Christian.
the Sign of the Cross

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07-04-2008, 09:22 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Tarpan View Post
1) I clarified earlier that none currently exist that we know of. Those are ones that attributed with organic life as an attribute.

2) There are not countless witnesses & 3rd aprty verificaton of Jesus and the ressurection. There are actually very few sources, most of which have cloudy histories of edits, translations, and councils dedicated to filtering the information in the evidences to suit a specific story. Further, the authors of those evidences are unknown. To further add to the pain, I was quite specific about contemporary evidence and there is no contemporary evidence to support the existance of Jesus. The claim that he existed as a human is questionable, and there is not a shred of evidence to support any supernaturalism.

To suggest the two sets of evidence are equal is simply falacious.
What is the scientific evidence that Jesus was able to resurrect himself? How do scientists explain this?

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07-04-2008, 09:23 PM
  #159
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the Sign of the Cross
Very interesting that the cross appears in the Sabres logo.

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07-05-2008, 12:56 AM
  #160
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Ugh, if George Carlin is yor beacon of hope then you're really in trouble!

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07-05-2008, 02:27 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
Ugh, if George Carlin is yor beacon of hope then you're really in trouble!

At least George Carlin tells it from a "what you see is what you get" perspective. That's a lot better than what most Christians will tell you.

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07-05-2008, 03:28 PM
  #162
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250px-Anson_Carter.jpg

Anson Carter = Rasta

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Old
07-05-2008, 03:28 PM
  #163
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Im pretty sure malkin is Orthodox, though lots of Russians probably are

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Old
07-05-2008, 03:40 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Rafael View Post
What if someone's mother's mother was a convert? Would that person then be Jewish? Well, let's look at the person's mother. Her mother was a convert, so she must not be ethnically Jewish. Therefore the subject person isn't ethnically Jewish.

Now if you trace that back to the beginnning of Judaism, there must have been a first Jew. Someone who wasn't born Jewish, but then became a Jew. Therefore, all of that person's descendents aren't ethnically Jewish. In summary, it means that there really aren't any ethnic Jews.
Jew as an ethnicity is a general term. The real ethnicity is Ashkenazi or Sephardi, etc. Ashkenazi and Sephardi Jews are genetically different from other ethnicities and this can be proven in a blood test. The reason the term Jew is used is because the Jewish religion is the main characteristic of this ethnicity. There wasn't 1 guy who was the first jew, but ethnically diverse tribes in the middle east who's culture eventually evolved into Judaic beliefs.
As far as Ashkenazis go, the genetic variation in the population is very small actually. 50% of all Ashkenazis genetically come from 4 distinct mothers and are pure Ashkenazi the rest 50% have a mixing rate with other ethnicities of about 0.5% per generation. Basically the Ashkenazi ethnicity is 12.5% mixed which is actually very low for a ethnicity in Europe. This is due to conversion to Judaism being very rare in the last 2000 years until recently.

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07-05-2008, 03:47 PM
  #165
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However, Jeff Halpern and Steve Yzerman aren't ethnically different. One is white and the other is white - even if one is Jewish and the other isn't.
White is not a ethnicity, it is a skin color. If you did genetic tests on those two their haplotypes would most likely be different. You can test for ethnicity these days. White skin is just a reference point.

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07-05-2008, 03:50 PM
  #166
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We lost the hockey part somewhere in this thread about Hockey and Relgion.

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