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Van-Atl: All Kovalchuk-Sedin talk here

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Old
07-08-2008, 04:29 PM
  #76
Shane
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Originally Posted by btn View Post
From a Thrashers perspective, I would rather have 66% of a top line than 33% of a top line.

This makes the Thrashers a better team immediately. Marketing is great, but as someone here said...winning is the best kind of marketing you can get.

Will they sign an extension though? The Thrashers certainly cannot let Kovalchuk be traded for 1 years worth of the Sedin twins.
Which is exactly why Canucks fans are hesitant about something like this. It's 66% of a line for 33% of one, even if that 33% coming their way is a better 33% than either half of the 66%.

Now, if the deal centred around the Sedins + Bieksa for Kovalchuk + Little, then it'd be easier to swallow, because they'd have another (potential) top six forward coming back. I'm sure the Canucks would have to add a significant prospect or a reasonably high pick for balance though.

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07-08-2008, 04:29 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Setocheechoo View Post
Awwwwwwwwwww, that would terrible, huh? Quit your whining, you got Malkin, Crosby, Lecavalier, Ovechkin, Price, Kovalchuk, Heatley, Spezza, the three Staals, now Zherdev & Stamkos. Of course none of this makes the East a more competitive conference, but remember that the West doesn't have even a fifth of what you guys got.
Dont forget the Finger!

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07-08-2008, 04:30 PM
  #78
Hale The Villain
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Originally Posted by Setocheechoo View Post
Awwwwwwwwwww, that would terrible, huh? Quit your whining, you got Malkin, Crosby, Lecavalier, Ovechkin, Price, Kovalchuk, Heatley, Spezza, the three Staals, now Zherdev & Stamkos. Of course none of this makes the East a more competitive conference, but remember that the West doesn't have even a fifth of what you guys got.
Don't forget Alfredsson, St. Louis, Savard, Prospal, Briere, Parise, Richards (Mike), Carter, Semin, Backstrom, Kovalev, Drury, Gomez, Sundin, Vanek and Elias!

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07-08-2008, 04:30 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by btn View Post
Will they sign an extension though?
That would probably be a part of the trade, that they agree to extensions.

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07-08-2008, 04:31 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Safir View Post
Why would the Sedins sign an extension when a homegrown franchise player Kovalchuk wants to be traded (if you believe the rumor) out of town, because he doesn't think that the Thrashers are moving the right direction? Henrik and Daniel might as well say by y'all in 2009 and head back to Vancouver, where Gilles signs Kovy to a long term extension.
The Thrashers would just make the deal contingent on the Sedins signing an extension. Gillis would allow the Sedins to negotiate with the Thrashers (or negotiate it himself on behalf of the Thrashers), and if a deal is signed, the trade is made. It's the same thing that happened in the Hossa-Heatley deal.

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07-08-2008, 04:31 PM
  #81
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Who does Ila play with most often?

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07-08-2008, 04:33 PM
  #82
Magnus Fulgur
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Originally Posted by Levizk View Post
That's why making up rumors like this for site hits works though. You basically want to believe that's the case and everyone can draw that scenario up in their head, so someone just prints it and calls it their rumor. We see all the garbage Al Strachan spews on the CBC, and very little if any ever comes to pass. He's the prime example of a person who engages in telling people things they expect to hear and makes money off it, but usually none of it ever comes to pass.
No actually, I've been concerned about Kovalchuk being traded since the Nikulin deal stalled and the fact that DW couldn't get anyone to sign. Atlanta's been way too quiet. If Kovalchuk is staying, they need to trade for a RW. That's not happening, and everything else is up in the air right now. It's very unsettling.

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07-08-2008, 04:35 PM
  #83
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Hell no.

Kovalchuk >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Both Sedins

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07-08-2008, 04:36 PM
  #84
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Kovalchuk for the Sedins is a massive overpayment by Atlanta, now if Vancouver added 2 1st round draft picks a top prospect and Kevin Bieksa then we'd have a trade.

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07-08-2008, 04:38 PM
  #85
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didnt someone make this up on here?

and who pray tell will center kovy in couver? kesler? demitra? how it be any better for him in couver if henriks going back the other way?

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07-08-2008, 04:39 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane View Post
The Thrashers would just make the deal contingent on the Sedins signing an extension. Gillis would allow the Sedins to negotiate with the Thrashers (or negotiate it himself on behalf of the Thrashers), and if a deal is signed, the trade is made. It's the same thing that happened in the Hossa-Heatley deal.
I think that Hossa's reason for not resigning in Atlanta where heard around the NHLPA. The Sedins are used (before Gilles apparently) to play for a team (under Nonis) which is unable to sign quality FA's. Do you honestly believe that both want to play on a similar team (Atlanta)? I doubt it.

You can't compare this to the Hossa (DeVries)- Heatley swap. Both were RFA at the time, whereas the Sedins and Kovy will be UFA. All three can sign with any team they want.

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07-08-2008, 04:41 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by btn View Post
Will they sign an extension though? The Thrashers certainly cannot let Kovalchuk be traded for 1 years worth of the Sedin twins.
Considering that Kovalchuk definitely won't be signing an extension with Atlanta, I'd say that getting the Sedins even without a guarantee of them signing an extension isn't a bad deal for Atlanta. Especially since they are far more likely to sign that extension with Atlanta at this point in time than Kovalchuk is.

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07-08-2008, 04:41 PM
  #88
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To VAN
Ilya Kovalchuk
Alexei Zhitnik

To ATL
Henrik Sedin
Daniel Sedin
Kevin Bieksa
VAN 1st rounder in 2009

Zhitnik's a salary dump. Is this an overpayment by VAN? Keep in mind that Kovalchuk is probably the best goal scorer in the NHL.

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07-08-2008, 04:43 PM
  #89
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Although i prefer havin kovalchuck over both twins
i seems keeping the twins would be smarter

Ilya 52G 35a means he's responsable for atleast 87 goals

Twins 15g 61a and 29g 45a
Even if the wins assisted on each other every goal and you sustract the 44 from their assists total (106-44 = 62)

They're stil left with 106 goals that they're responsable for

If it was crosby malkin or ovechkin we were talking about, thats a dif story.
But it's not like Kovalchuck would be in a better situation with a better support staff in vancouver to say that he can get more points than in ATL...

Remember max he's ever gotten has been 98 and he's played with savard and hossa as support staff

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07-08-2008, 04:43 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goc Fanatic View Post
To VAN
Ilya Kovalchuk
Alexei Zhitnik

To ATL
Henrik Sedin
Daniel Sedin
Kevin Bieksa
VAN 1st rounder in 2009

Zhitnik's a salary dump. Is this an overpayment by VAN? Keep in mind that Kovalchuk is probably the best goal scorer in the NHL.
Ovechkin is the best goal scorer in the NHL, Kovy's a close second.

If the Canucks are trading the Sedins, they need two forwards back. No matter what. And pawning Kozlov off on them wouldn't cut it. I think Little would absolutely have to be part of this deal, especially if the Canucks are sending a potential lottery pick to Atlanta (and it will be a lottery pick if the Canucks' only top six forward was Kovalchuk, which he would be at this point if this trade was made).

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Old
07-08-2008, 04:44 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goc Fanatic View Post
To VAN
Ilya Kovalchuk
Alexei Zhitnik

To ATL
Henrik Sedin
Daniel Sedin
Kevin Bieksa
VAN 1st rounder in 2009

Zhitnik's a salary dump. Is this an overpayment by VAN?

Bigtime overpayment by Vancouver.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goc Fanatic View Post
Keep in mind that Kovalchuk is probably the best goal scorer in the NHL.
I'm trying to keep that in my mind, but I keep getting distracted by images of AO pwning n00bs.

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Old
07-08-2008, 04:45 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Shane View Post
Ovechkin is the best goal scorer in the NHL, Kovy's a close second.

If the Canucks are trading the Sedins, they need to forwards back. No matter what. And pawning Kozlov off on them wouldn't cut it. I think Little would absolutely have to be part of this deal, especially if the Canucks are sending a potential lottery pick to Atlanta (and it will be a lottery pick if the Canucks only top six forward was Kovalchuk, which it would be at this point if this trade was made).
Assuming Sundin's signed (and the article seems to indicate that the delay for Mats signing is related to this Kovy business), Kovalchuk--Sundin--Raymond would be a scary top line.

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07-08-2008, 04:45 PM
  #93
nanzenkills
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Originally Posted by Goc Fanatic View Post
Keep in mind that Kovalchuk is probably the best goal scorer in the NHL.
I would say that Kovalchuk is most offensively talented goal scorer in the NHL, but Alexander Ovechkin is the best goal scorer in the NHL.

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Old
07-08-2008, 04:45 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goc Fanatic View Post
To VAN
Ilya Kovalchuk
Alexei Zhitnik

To ATL
Henrik Sedin
Daniel Sedin
Kevin Bieksa
VAN 1st rounder in 2009

Zhitnik's a salary dump. Is this an overpayment by VAN? Keep in mind that Kovalchuk is probably the best goal scorer in the NHL.
Zhitnik has been bought out. Adding a first is too much IMO.

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Old
07-08-2008, 04:46 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by jeffleafsfan91 View Post
Long post
That wouldn't happen. Waddell doesn't want to lose Perrin. He wouldn't throw him in. IMO, if Kovalchuk was going to Vancouver, it'd look more like this...

To Atlanta:
Daniel Sedin
Henrik Sedin
Kevin Bieksa
1st rounder 2009

To Vancouver:
Ilya Kovalchuk
Garnet Exelby
Todd White (Throw-in, as the Thrashers already have too many centers)

Atlanta's roster...

Sedin-Sedin-Armstrong
Kozlov-Christensen-Perrin
Stuart-Little-LaVallee
Thorburn-Slater-Boulton


Enstrom-Bieksa
Bogosian-Hainsey
Havelid-Valabik
Klee

Lehtonen
Hedberg

While I'm not fond of trading away Kovalchuk, this would give Atlanta 3 legitimate scoring lines, as Stuart and LaVallee have offensive ability. The only problem is that, IMO, Atlanta will be too deep at center. Armstrong would be a great RW for the Sedins. He provides the physicality and size that the Sedins have always lacked on the other wing.

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Old
07-08-2008, 04:46 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Randall Graves View Post
Sedins are not game breakers.

Kovalchuk is, and yes it makes a difference to have a player like that on the ice.
+1

when kovalchuk is on the ice, the opposing team knows that the slightest defensive lapse will cost them a goal

the sedins dont nearly cause as much fear

perfect example of the difference between being good and being a star

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07-08-2008, 04:47 PM
  #97
Shane
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Originally Posted by Goc Fanatic View Post
Assuming Sundin's signed (and the article seems to indicate that the delay for Mats signing is related to this Kovy business), Kovalchuk--Sundin--Raymond would be a scary top line.
And then who's their second line? Pyatt-Wellwood-Bernier? That's awful.

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07-08-2008, 04:47 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by YogiCanucks View Post
Yeah, you get offered an elite game breaker all the time. This is NO time to make a knee jerk reaction and jump at this.


Kovalchuk is very one-dimensional. He's a great goalscorer, but that's it. Doesn't initiate hits like Ovy nor is he rugged like Dats. He's not a very strong two-way player. Nor does he win faceoffs and help anchor the center position. He completely vanished in the playoffs (but in his defense it was his first and he was the only threat on that team really).

You would be stupid to trade both Sedins for Kovalchuk.

Do you want to win or do you want to impress the fantasy-gm's on hfb?

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Old
07-08-2008, 04:47 PM
  #99
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Zhitnik has been bought out.
Damn. My bad. Would the trade still work if Zhitnik was flat out removed?

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07-08-2008, 04:49 PM
  #100
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And then who's their second line? Pyatt-Wellwood-Bernier? That's awful.
Bernier--Wellwood--Demitra

Yeah, not great, but it's not like offense is what wins the Canucks games anyway -- they've got a top 3 goalie in the league and a terrific defense. Adding Kovalchuk gives them a legitimate top line scoring threat which should be enough to push them over the top.

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