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Lats finally develops in a Leclair type of power forward

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Old
07-14-2008, 01:41 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Wouldn't he be better off with Chuck Norris?

Latendresse




And it's safe to say there are a lot of things Carbo knows that you don't.
Probably...but this is the guy that played the trap for half the year last year...

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07-14-2008, 01:51 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Probably...but this is the guy that played the trap for half the year last year...
Typical... you are insinuating that Carbo was the reason why the team went off to a bad start, right... and it was all the player's doings when they finished first, right?

BTW, the Habs played the same style for most of the season, you just don't go and change your coaching philosophy in the middle of the season, especially concerning the transition in the middle-zone, you make adjustments.

So it's probably Carbo's fault if Lats couldn't do himself justice... it was in no way whatsoever related to how Lats was playing?

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07-14-2008, 02:01 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Typical... you are insinuating that Carbo was the reason why the team went off to a bad start, right... and it was all the player's doings when they finished first, right?

BTW, the Habs played the same style for most of the season, you just don't go and change your coaching philosophy in the middle of the season, especially concerning the transition in the middle-zone, you make adjustments.

So it's probably Carbo's fault if Lats couldn't do himself justice... it was in no way whatsoever related to how Lats was playing?
This is pure BS, Lats produced very respectable numbers given what was given to him. Because Carbo did not play him enough doesn't mean Latendresse did bad or Carbo is an idiot. Carbo probably felt that other players were better suited for top line duties, it's not a knock on Latendresse or whatever. You only defend your opinion with the way Carbo used him. If I use your logic I could go on and say Latendresse is godlike, because in a conservative system he got brought up as a 19 years old, who are you to defy Gainey?

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07-14-2008, 02:04 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
He was stuck on the 3rd and 4th lines with non skill guys all year. There are a lot of things about Carbonneau I can't explain.
Ummm, did you miss last season? Or the one before it? Latts has recieved TONS of PP/1st/2nd line time - that accounts for him breaking the 10 goal mark.

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07-14-2008, 02:07 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by BadKiwi View Post
This is pure BS, Lats produced very respectable numbers given what was given to him. Because Carbo did not play him enough doesn't mean Latendresse did bad or Carbo is an idiot. Carbo probably felt that other players were better suited for top line duties, it's not a knock on Latendresse or whatever. You only defend your opinion with the way Carbo used him. If I use your logic I could go on and say Latendresse is godlike, because in a conservative system he got brought up as a 19 years old, who are you to defy Gainey?
Dear lord, do you at least understand that I was replying to someone who made it sound as if it was Carbo's fault, as if Lats was perfect and the only reason he couldn't do himself justice was because of Carbo??

You assume a lot by what I said. I didn't say it was Lats fault, I didn't say he played bad and that was the reason, you even point out the same thing I'm trying to point out, the bolded part in your text.

Dude, take a deep breath. Reread my text and tell me where I said it was because Lats played bad. I only said "because of the way he played", that can also imply that it's because his play wasn't on par with what was required for the top 6 (and logically that there were others better suited).

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07-14-2008, 02:09 PM
  #56
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I can't wait for training camp

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07-14-2008, 02:25 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
So it's probably Carbo's fault if Lats couldn't do himself justice... it was in no way whatsoever related to how Lats was playing?
How does that mean anything else? The guy said that it is Carbo that did not want to let Latendresse play more, like it or not he's right. Now it's up to everyone's opinion to know if Carbo was right or wrong. You try to make it sound that Carbo did automatically the right decision because he has a better Hockey IQ then most of us. While I agree that Carbo knows more then most of us, I wouldn't use that argument to prove if a decision was right or wrong. Carbo made a lot of errors during his "reign" it is not hard to list a few of them. It is one of the purpose of the message board, arguing. If we'd all agree that the people in charge are the most knowledgeable people, hence undebatable it would make this board pretty dull. So if you want to prove that Carbo did the right thing prove it with some facts not with the "supposed" superior knowledge.

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07-14-2008, 02:26 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Le Slow Poke View Post
Ummm, did you miss last season? Or the one before it? Latts has recieved TONS of PP/1st/2nd line time - that accounts for him breaking the 10 goal mark.
He never played on the top 2 lines or PP with any regularity.

The regular 5 on 5 and PP lines were...Kovalev-Plekanec-A.Kostystyn Higgins-Koivu-Ryder/S.Kost...

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07-14-2008, 02:28 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
He never played on the top 2 lines or PP with any regularity.

The regular 5 on 5 and PP lines were...Kovalev-Plekanec-A.Kostystyn Higgins-Koivu-Ryder/S.Kost...
In order to be considered on the PP he'll have to be on top of his game, wich is what I wish for the guy.. He's not exactly playing for the Leafs, or the Canucks

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07-14-2008, 02:34 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Le Slow Poke View Post
Ummm, did you miss last season? Or the one before it? Latts has recieved TONS of PP/1st/2nd line time - that accounts for him breaking the 10 goal mark.
Is that why he had 2pp goals... and 2pp assists.... a grand total of 4pp points.

Seems to me he didn't get much pp time ase we had the best PP in the leauge.

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07-14-2008, 02:37 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Le Slow Poke View Post
Ummm, did you miss last season? Or the one before it? Latts has recieved TONS of PP/1st/2nd line time - that accounts for him breaking the 10 goal mark.
you are wrong . He didn't get TONS of time on the first lines last season . It was 2 years ago , when Higgins got injured .

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07-14-2008, 02:39 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by #ZAMBONI# View Post
you are wrong . He didn't get TONS of time on the first lines last season . It was 2 years ago , when Higgins got injured .

Of course he played on the 1st line all the time, so where Laps and Begin

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07-14-2008, 02:45 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by BadKiwi View Post
How does that mean anything else?
"Because of how he played" you assumed I was saying that he was playing bad, you assumed wrong, get over it. He wasn't playing on par with what was needed for the top6, is that really too complicated to understand, and that it doesn't mean he was playing bad, just not good enough for the top 6. You put words into my mouth, next time, before assuming anything, ask me what I meant in a comment if you are unsure or want more detail.

Quote:
The guy said that it is Carbo that did not want to let Latendresse play more, like it or not he's right.
No he's wrong, because you are ommiting the part that he said this as if it was Carbo's fault, as if, if Latendresse would've played, the team would've had better results.

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Now it's up to everyone's opinion to know if Carbo was right or wrong.
I think last season's results are pretty indicative that he was right about that one, we had a top offense in the league, that's a fact you can't dispute.

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You try to make it sound that Carbo did automatically the right decision because he has a better Hockey IQ then most of us.
No that response was a cynism towards his own assertion. Turn on your sarcasm/cynism radar.

Quote:
While I agree that Carbo knows more then most of us, I wouldn't use that argument to prove if a decision was right or wrong.
And you wouldn't also use the argument that Carbo played the "trap" for the first half of the season, implying that he makes wrong decisions and implying that his decision to not use Lats on the top 6.

He said ""He was stuck on the 3rd and 4th lines with non skill guys all year. There are a lot of things about Carbonneau I can't explain.""

When I pressed him to see if he was actually giving fault to Carbo, by mentioning that Carbo knows a lot more about the situation, he repsonded with this :

""Probably...but this is the guy that played the trap for half the year last year...""

As if it was the most logical choice to put Latendresse on the top 6, hence it was Carbo's fault.


Quote:
Carbo made a lot of errors during his "reign" it is not hard to list a few of them. It is one of the purpose of the message board, arguing.
As if all other coaches don't make errors, but that's just the point. Montreal had a leading offense, you can't argue this, so he was right in his choices for the top lines.

Quote:
If we'd all agree that the people in charge are the most knowledgeable people, hence undebatable it would make this board pretty dull.
I never said that, stop putting words into my mouth. We can have a debate, but to say that Carbo used the trap as to say that he makes bad decisions and relate it to the use of Latendresse is poor debating and arguing.

Quote:
So if you want to prove that Carbo did the right thing prove it with some facts not with the "supposed" superior knowledge.
I think that Jack Adams nomination and Montreal's #1 offense (second for GFPG) speaks of itself in this case, because Lats is supposedly an offensive player and our offense was one of the best.... without Lats on the top6.

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07-14-2008, 02:54 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Beakermania View Post
Is that why he had 2pp goals... and 2pp assists.... a grand total of 4pp points.

Seems to me he didn't get much pp time ase we had the best PP in the leauge.
Ok Berks! Lets play "pretend"... how many minutes was he on the best PP unit in the league last year with his incredible 4 points...?

Hmmm, let me look that up.

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07-14-2008, 02:56 PM
  #65
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What is it about Latendresse that everybody loves???? I personally don't get it. The kid makes the team and has a decent season, but doesn't do anything special in his first year, and then he does absolutely nothing in his second year and yet he is supposed to play on the 1st line, even though he is slow and isn't producing?

It must be because he is a french canadian....thats the only thing I can come up with.

Considering the amount of hype I have had to listen to over the last couple of season, Latendresse is a disappointment in my eyes. Everybody goes on about him like he is the second coming of Christ!!!!

The kid should have spent at least 2 seasons in Hamilton to get his legs under him so he can keep up with the NHL's game speed.

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07-14-2008, 02:57 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Le Slow Poke View Post
Ok Berks! Lets play "pretend"... how many minutes was he on the best PP unit in the league last year with his incredible 4 points...?

Hmmm, let me look that up.
That would be 104 minutes total..

1 minutes 25 seconds per game

I like Lats, but his PP production wasn't all that good. That's 1 point at every 15 minutes of PP time, although given, he didn't get much practice, but still I would've expected just a bit more.

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07-14-2008, 02:59 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
"Because of how he played" you assumed I was saying that he was playing bad, you assumed wrong, get over it. He wasn't playing on par with what was needed for the top6, is that really too complicated to understand, and that it doesn't mean he was playing bad, just not good enough for the top 6. You put words into my mouth, next time, before assuming anything, ask me what I meant in a comment if you are unsure or want more detail.
You're saying he was not playing bad yet at the same time he was not playing well enough. Doesn't it ends up being very similar? If an offensive player is not playing well enough to be playing on an offensive line, it doesn't mean he's playing bad? I never pretended you said Lats was our worst player or that he played atrocious. If I misinterpreted something, sorry.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
No he's wrong, because you are ommiting the part that he said this as if it was Carbo's fault, as if, if Latendresse would've played, the team would've had better results.
I am not saying he's right or defending his opinion. I am saying that he is right that Carbo decided not to play him allot. May it be a right or wrong decision, it still is Carbo's decision.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
I think last season's results are pretty indicative that he was right about that one, we had a top offense in the league, that's a fact you can't dispute.
I can still come up with the fact that Dandenault played on the first line, it was a mistake. This is where you don't understand my point, someone with superior knowledge CAN make mistakes. Even if his good moves overshadows his bad ones greatly.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
No that response was a cynism towards his own assertion. Turn on your sarcasm/cynism radar.
Sorry, needed a smiley.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
And you wouldn't also use the argument that Carbo played the "trap" for the first half of the season, implying that he makes wrong decisions and implying that his decision to not use Lats on the top 6.

He said ""He was stuck on the 3rd and 4th lines with non skill guys all year. There are a lot of things about Carbonneau I can't explain.""

When I pressed him to see if he was actually giving fault to Carbo, by mentioning that Carbo knows a lot more about the situation, he repsonded with this :

""Probably...but this is the guy that played the trap for half the year last year...""

As if it was the most logical choice to put Latendresse on the top 6, hence it was Carbo's fault.
Never said the guy was good at arguing. But you did not put up a much better effort having for only fact the superiority of Carbo.


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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
As if all other coaches don't make errors, but that's just the point. Montreal had a leading offense, you can't argue this, so he was right in his choices for the top lines.
Dandenault.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
I never said that, stop putting words into my mouth. We can have a debate, but to say that Carbo used the trap as to say that he makes bad decisions and relate it to the use of Latendresse is poor debating and arguing.
Yes, it is bad arguing.

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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
I think that Jack Adams nomination and Montreal's #1 offense (second for GFPG) speaks of itself in this case, because Lats is supposedly an offensive player and our offense was one of the best.... without Lats on the top6.
Dandenault.

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07-14-2008, 02:59 PM
  #68
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So I noticed that Lats' on trial here


How whise were you at 20? Personally, I fell of a building, guess I wasn't that wise back then.. I'll give the guy another season and some pubic hair before I get rude about him..

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07-14-2008, 02:59 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
That would be 104 minutes total..

1 minutes 25 seconds per game
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA and thanku

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07-14-2008, 03:02 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
That would be 104 minutes total..

1 minutes 25 seconds per game

That much??? And he only got 10 goals? What a foney, a real foney.. East coast league, here I come for sure I want his brother with the big team instead, let's be serious for a moment!


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07-14-2008, 03:03 PM
  #71
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Actually, the "like most of you" should have sound funny knowing this is the internet

And no, I wouldn't move back to my parent's


And you can see one of my cars here http://406ci.monchar.com/


I love cars


But I'd really love Latendresse to be that so wished PF we want.. Even if is name was Latenderness, i'm not so peculiar, if that's a word lol


I mean, the guy is 20 after all.. Imagine him at 26 if he has a normal progression curve
Geeze....stop being so objective.

Gotta remember....this is the HF Habs board...where 20 yr old players are busts, where Bob Gainey and Guy Carbs are horrible (even after a conf.championship)....and where it's always about politics rather than reality.

Please, smarten-up and get in line with the consensus or risk being ignored for being too rational.

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07-14-2008, 03:03 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
That would be 104 minutes total..

1 minutes 25 seconds per game

I like Lats, but his PP production wasn't all that good. That's 1 point at every 15 minutes of PP time, although given, he didn't get much practice, but still I would've expected just a bit more.

For some perspective....
Ozy how does that rank on the team among forwards..... 7th - 8th???

He was not part of either the 1st or 2nd PP unit, thats my point.... He did not get the TONS of PP time that Le Slow Poke claims... .It didn't happen

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07-14-2008, 03:04 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Puckhead58 View Post
What is it about Latendresse that everybody loves???? I personally don't get it. The kid makes the team and has a decent season, but doesn't do anything special in his first year, and then he does absolutely nothing in his second year and yet he is supposed to play on the 1st line, even though he is slow and isn't producing?

It must be because he is a french canadian....thats the only thing I can come up with.

Considering the amount of hype I have had to listen to over the last couple of season, Latendresse is a disappointment in my eyes. Everybody goes on about him like he is the second coming of Christ!!!!

The kid should have spent at least 2 seasons in Hamilton to get his legs under him so he can keep up with the NHL's game speed.

You should go to Hamilton for 2 years and learn how to read.

Where did anybody suggest he was the second coming of christ?

16 goals is pretty good for a guy that played with the likes of Dandenault Begin Lapierre and co and did "absolutely nothing".

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07-14-2008, 03:05 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
Geeze....stop being so objective.

Please, smarten-up and get in line with the consensus or risk being ignored for being too rational.
I'll make an effort

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07-14-2008, 03:06 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
That would be 104 minutes total..

1 minutes 25 seconds per game

I like Lats, but his PP production wasn't all that good. That's 1 point at every 15 minutes of PP time, although given, he didn't get much practice, but still I would've expected just a bit more.
What were the ratios for A.Kost Kovalev Plekanec Markov and Streit on the #1 unit for comparison sake?

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